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[Kronos] Freighters and Jump Freighters Rebalance [Updated]

First post First post First post
Author
Stalker ofeveryone
Doomheim
#621 - 2014-05-18 08:48:08 UTC
Sobaan Tali wrote:
So, since we are doing this to freighters/JFs, when can we expect shuttles and pods getting rigs?

P.S., the sad thing is that I'm actually somewhat serious about this question, judging by what I've read/seen happen to this game over the 4 years I've been playing.


Is that a subtle backhand to CCP? "If you're gonna **** up freighters, you may as well do it to pods/shuttles rabble rabble"
Sobaan Tali
Caldari Quick Reaction Force
#622 - 2014-05-18 08:57:21 UTC
I'm just being honest (brutally) in what I think about this, and they did ask for what we think about this. I'm just trying to understand the logic, even if it sounds more like I'm questioning or challenging the logic.

"Tomahawks?"

"----in' A, right?"

"Trouble is, those things cost like a million and a half each."

"----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."

Dave Stark
#623 - 2014-05-18 08:59:56 UTC
Stalker ofeveryone wrote:
Sobaan Tali wrote:
So, since we are doing this to freighters/JFs, when can we expect shuttles and pods getting rigs?

P.S., the sad thing is that I'm actually somewhat serious about this question, judging by what I've read/seen happen to this game over the 4 years I've been playing.


Is that a subtle backhand to CCP? "If you're gonna **** up freighters, you may as well do it to pods/shuttles rabble rabble"


let's face it, an ehp nerf and a cargo nerf would be irrelevant to shuttles, so small rigs for speed would be a no brainer and a straight buff.

probably the only case where this type of change would be wanted.
Kaius Fero
#624 - 2014-05-18 09:01:07 UTC
How about stop the "I told you!" shiatposts and start doing something to stop this madness?

I hate ganking, but If this idiocy will hit TQ I will start bumping day and night every freighter that will pass Uedama and Niarja until people will stop hauling and all industry will go to hell.

Anselmo & The Illegals

Dave Stark
#625 - 2014-05-18 09:06:11 UTC
Kaius Fero wrote:
I hate ganking, but If this idiocy will hit TQ I will start bumping day and night every freighter that will pass Uedama and Niarja until people will stop hauling and all industry will go to hell.


i like that you're ambitious, but i think bumping freighters in 1 high sec system isn't likely to cause a shutdown of industry.
Herr Wilkus
Aggressive Salvage Services LLC
#626 - 2014-05-18 09:17:05 UTC
I am really digging the tears in this thread. And I fly freighters. Its just that EVE is better and more entertaining when they are getting popped on a regular basis by gankers.

After Burn Jita, carebears were eagerly expecting a 2012 'mining barge' style rebalance: massive upside, no downside.

Then, cry, cry, cry, and he waterworks fire up when the rebalance turns out to be neutral/mild nerf.

The important thing is that no configuration of rigs allows a freighter to have stats strictly superior to what they are today.
Now you get to pick (at a cost) - slightly better cargo, more gankable - or jump-freighter EHP and really Orca/JF cargospace.

Capital rigs is the right way to go, as the Freighters use capital components, and forces the freighter pilots to commit to a configuration. If you want to change your stats, it comes at a cost - sounds balanced.

When Orca gets its balance pass it should be adjusted to use capital rigs as well to keep things consistent.
Esur A'saw Ti
Wont To Buy
#627 - 2014-05-18 09:19:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Esur A'saw Ti
baltec1 wrote:


You numbers are out on how many cats are needed to kill a freighter.

Its funny how you go on about how you shouldn't need alts or corpmates to fly a freighter yet rage about a fleet being needed to kill said freighter. You arnt getting your perfect safety and your quest to get it has just backfired in everyones face.

Are you trying to say that you can't kill a freighter in a 0.5 system with around 10 perfect cata pilots? LOL

Thanks for confirming that your reading comprehension is indeed terrible, I said that SINCE flying a freighter is tedious, dull and boring (see that's a game design flaw) it's harder to rely on other people, in the same way that people use solocorps for industry because it's **** easy to steal bpos from a pos/hangar, this has nothing to do with your "moral" or what you think people should do, it's all about the inherent bad design of some part of eve.

Is it too hard to understand? I wish I could explain stuff by making you press f1 Roll
And by the way, nice projecting I never lost a freighter and don't live in hs, even tho I use an alt to dodge the fw/concord mechanics (god bless metagaming, imirite guys).

No need to be mad because I'm pointing out that your baby-tier risk averse "pvp" should go. P

tl;dr : buff freighters to make it impossible to suicide them in a small fleet that cost like 200m and is easy as **** to setup (see I'm ok with taloses), give a tanking malus to autopilot ships
Dave Stark
#628 - 2014-05-18 09:22:51 UTC
Herr Wilkus wrote:
When Orca gets its balance pass it should be adjusted to use capital rigs as well to keep things consistent.

i'd put money on that not happening.

as some one pointed out to me this morning; the show info panel of freighters says that they primarily use XL modules, where as on the orca's show info panel it says Large modules.

having said that; it does require capital ship construction skill, and capital components so i guess there's an argument for both.
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn
Department 10
#629 - 2014-05-18 09:27:26 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Tippia wrote:
See… there was a reason why I was against rigs on freighters from the very start… Straight

T2 capital rigs and a significant reduction in survivability requried and/or speed to get them back to where they were. Gee thanks.


T1 rigs are easily enough to bring normal freighters above their current cargo values.


Regarding industry changes across the board it did appear initially that gankers were getting a nerf. I'm thinking more in terms of changes to mining vessels with that statement.

But from other aspects with the increase to signature radius on POS towers and 'outside' POS defences and now potentially less survivability for freighters if they wish to keep similar cargo holds I've changed my mind.

On balance it seems to be an unnecessary and bad change still. Would be better to leave freighters & jump freighters where they are presently.

" They're gonna feel pretty stupid when they find out. " Rick. " Find out what ? " Abraham. " They're screwing with the wrong people. " Rick. Season four.   ' The Walking Dead. ' .

Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn
Department 10
#630 - 2014-05-18 09:35:57 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Herr Wilkus wrote:
When Orca gets its balance pass it should be adjusted to use capital rigs as well to keep things consistent.

i'd put money on that not happening.

as some one pointed out to me this morning; the show info panel of freighters says that they primarily use XL modules, where as on the orca's show info panel it says Large modules.

having said that; it does require capital ship construction skill, and capital components so i guess there's an argument for both.


I hadn't thought about that. It only gets worse doesn't it. Meanwhile heaps of broken elements of the game eg roles & permissions, POSes, lowsec, FW etc do not get any attention.

I'm not sure it would be balanced to reduce EHP on Orca though as they would, due to having module slots and therefore probably having a bulkhead module fitted, take an even greater hit in terms of cargo capacity and EHP.

This happens when the wrong people are taken notice of.........

" They're gonna feel pretty stupid when they find out. " Rick. " Find out what ? " Abraham. " They're screwing with the wrong people. " Rick. Season four.   ' The Walking Dead. ' .

Kaius Fero
#631 - 2014-05-18 09:39:56 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Kaius Fero wrote:
I hate ganking, but If this idiocy will hit TQ I will start bumping day and night every freighter that will pass Uedama and Niarja until people will stop hauling and all industry will go to hell.


i like that you're ambitious, but i think bumping freighters in 1 high sec system isn't likely to cause a shutdown of industry.

I have to test this on SISI, but I'm pretty sure that I can bounce on 4-5 freighters at once preventing them to warp away. If more than 2-3 people do this, they could completely shut down a choke point as Uedama. It would be hilarious to do the bumping with a Prospect.

Anselmo & The Illegals

Batolemaeus
Mahlstrom
Northern Associates.
#632 - 2014-05-18 09:47:20 UTC
Kaius Fero wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Kaius Fero wrote:
I hate ganking, but If this idiocy will hit TQ I will start bumping day and night every freighter that will pass Uedama and Niarja until people will stop hauling and all industry will go to hell.


i like that you're ambitious, but i think bumping freighters in 1 high sec system isn't likely to cause a shutdown of industry.

I have to test this on SISI, but I'm pretty sure that I can bounce on 4-5 freighters at once preventing them to warp away. If more than 2-3 people do this, they could completely shut down a choke point as Uedama. It would be hilarious to do the bumping with a Prospect.


Bannable offense mate.
Oxide Ammar
#633 - 2014-05-18 09:48:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Oxide Ammar
At least if they want to to nerf cargo holds for freighters and JF they should look into material list of T2 rigs because they cost arm and leg to buy these. 2 x T2 cargo hold rigs worth 1.4 bill in Jita that means I'm buying another freighter to put it in my freighter so I get my old freighter back....Brilliant !

Lady Areola Fappington:  Solo PVP isn't dead!  You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#634 - 2014-05-18 09:51:00 UTC
Esur A'saw Ti wrote:
baltec1 wrote:


You numbers are out on how many cats are needed to kill a freighter.

Its funny how you go on about how you shouldn't need alts or corpmates to fly a freighter yet rage about a fleet being needed to kill said freighter. You arnt getting your perfect safety and your quest to get it has just backfired in everyones face.

Are you trying to say that you can't kill a freighter in a 0.5 system with around 10 perfect cata pilots? LOL

Thanks for confirming that your reading comprehension is indeed terrible, I said that SINCE flying a freighter is tedious, dull and boring (see that's a game design flaw) it's harder to rely on other people, in the same way that people use solocorps for industry because it's **** easy to steal bpos from a pos/hangar, this has nothing to do with your "moral" or what you think people should do, it's all about the inherent bad design of some part of eve.

Is it too hard to understand? I wish I could explain stuff by making you press f1 Roll
And by the way, nice projecting I never lost a freighter and don't live in hs, even tho I use an alt to dodge the fw/concord mechanics (god bless metagaming, imirite guys).

No need to be mad because I'm pointing out that your baby-tier risk averse "pvp" should go. P

tl;dr : buff freighters to make it impossible to suicide them in a small fleet that cost like 200m and is easy as **** to setup (see I'm ok with taloses), give a tanking malus to autopilot ships


I love when people with zero knolage of ganking shiptost about how how ganking is so easy and risk free. Tell us, if its so easy why are there so few kills considering the 500,000 to a million freighter trips made every month?
Arianne Kass
Garoun Long-Term Capital Management
#635 - 2014-05-18 09:55:24 UTC
I don't think these changes will do much to nerf the big blue donut, but small PvP corps based out of NPC nullsec will be faced with higher operational costs.
Esur A'saw Ti
Wont To Buy
#636 - 2014-05-18 09:59:56 UTC
baltec1 wrote:

I love when people with zero knolage of ganking shiptost about how how ganking is so easy and risk free. Tell us, if its so easy why are there so few kills considering the 500,000 to a million freighter trips made every month?

Oh but I know about ganking, it's not rocket science you know (well maybe it is for you, you don't seems very smart, no offense) and the answer to that question is really simple : lots of people move valuable stuff in t1 haulers, making solo ganking more efficient than any fleet stuff.

Does that mean that we shouldn't change the math that allow a fleet of around 10 catalyst kill a freighter in 0.5 systems? My opinion is no, because it shouldn't happen, if you want to gank with a small fleet you have to use bigger ships.

It's called balance, I'm being objective you are not all you want is more RISK AVERSE PVP PRESS F1 ECKSDEE that's the part of eve that should go like most carebear gameplay.

Pls don't be upset because my logic and posting is superior. Lol
Haalabi
Perkone
Caldari State
#637 - 2014-05-18 10:00:32 UTC
it was good ... and now it will be tragic.
GJ CCP ....
easily guess that, not you fly those ships
Sweet Times
Riptide Riot
#638 - 2014-05-18 10:02:48 UTC
this nerf and the fuel nerf and the reprocessing nerf all in 1 go
This all makes moving anything around in game massively expensive and they want industry to spread out
Maybe the pll in cpp should talk to each other to come up with a coherent plan or was it to spread out industry and make it **** expensive
Jitazan
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#639 - 2014-05-18 10:03:37 UTC
Hi, now your changing freighters could you also look at the current situation of bumping freighters.

What i mean by this is when a 100mn stabber or mach just bumps a freighter 100k of gate the freighter pilot can not do any action against them can not log or they get pointed by a rookie ship alt with no skill points and nothing to lose, which keeps them aggressed they can keep them there all day till they either gank them or ransom them.


I feel this is completely unfair in the eve universe as there is 0 counter play there is nothing you can do in this situation other then die. What i would like to see is the the bumping char's go flashy after bumping for so long this way there is counter play the freighter pilot can get asssistance and they risk their shiny ships that just bump people.
Steijn
Quay Industries
#640 - 2014-05-18 10:05:44 UTC
Batolemaeus wrote:
Kaius Fero wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Kaius Fero wrote:
I hate ganking, but If this idiocy will hit TQ I will start bumping day and night every freighter that will pass Uedama and Niarja until people will stop hauling and all industry will go to hell.


i like that you're ambitious, but i think bumping freighters in 1 high sec system isn't likely to cause a shutdown of industry.

I have to test this on SISI, but I'm pretty sure that I can bounce on 4-5 freighters at once preventing them to warp away. If more than 2-3 people do this, they could completely shut down a choke point as Uedama. It would be hilarious to do the bumping with a Prospect.


Bannable offense mate.


whats bannable? bumping? Lol