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Supercarrier changes are hilariously bad
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E man Industries
SeaChell Productions
#61 - 2011-11-16 20:15:18 UTC
Can you or someone explain how thse changes encourage supercaps to just form larger blobs rather than bring in a support fleet?

Can you explain how this change makes gangs without suppers some how less viable?

thanks.
Vincent Gaines
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#62 - 2011-11-16 20:19:57 UTC
E man Industries wrote:
Can you explain how this change makes gangs without suppers some how less viable?


You need a good cheese with your suppers. I tend to eat Italian, and find a healthy mix of Romano and Provalone gives anything doused in Marinara just a little extra "kick."

Love it.

Not a diplo. 

The above post was edited for spelling.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#63 - 2011-11-16 20:29:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Andski
Vincent Gaines wrote:
Andski wrote:
Supercaps are ... absolutely screwed when it meets a bubble isn't a terribly exciting prospect for a lot of us.



Bubbles interdict supers? Roll


this, my friends, is why RAWR has lost two regions within five months

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Vincent Gaines
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#64 - 2011-11-16 20:34:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Vincent Gaines
Andski wrote:
Vincent Gaines wrote:
Andski wrote:
Supercaps are ... absolutely screwed when it meets a bubble isn't a terribly exciting prospect for a lot of us.



Bubbles interdict supers? Roll


this, my friends, is why RAWR has lost two regions within five months


Here I thought it was half of nullsec coming after us.. but I am the all and end all of an Alliance Shocked

But yes, I responded before I remembered that yes they can.

Not a diplo. 

The above post was edited for spelling.
IGNATIUS HOOD
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#65 - 2011-11-16 20:35:02 UTC
xxxak wrote:
Anyone who attempts to use Supercarriers for small hot drops, small scale structure bashes, or other such non-blob work will be caught with their pants down and dragged to to a bloody and gruesome death.


I may be wrong, but if you have no support brosef this in fact should be your fate. Super Carriers got their [IWIN] button taken away and every SCAP pilot needs to adjust accordingly.

Adjust or die.
"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats."   --H.L. Mencken
Froz3nEcho Sarain
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#66 - 2011-11-16 20:36:20 UTC
The only good cheese is melted cheese......

COME AT ME BRO!!!1111!!

[i]~ When everything fades away, an echo is the only sound that will remain ~   ~ Chaos is a name for any order that produces confusion in our minds ~[/i]
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#67 - 2011-11-16 20:38:38 UTC
Corina Jarr wrote:
Don;'t use em, so not sure but aren't supers immune to EWAR (which would include bubbles right?)?


No, supers are not immune to bubbles. If you're bubbled, you cannot enter warp or jump to a cyno - you're stuck unless you manage to take the bubble down with your smartbombs or by neuting out the HICs.

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Paragon Renegade
Sebiestor Tribe
#68 - 2011-11-16 20:39:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Paragon Renegade
Babybell is clearly the best.

Oh, and OP, stfu. If someone ever says "Super Capital ships are underpowered!" in the game, I swear to god I'll suicide gank them

The pie is a tautology
Ingvar Angst
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
#69 - 2011-11-16 20:39:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Ingvar Angst
Astrid Stjerna wrote:
Zagam wrote:


Seriously though... CCP's changes aren't forcing bigger supercap blobs. They are forcing supercaps to require a *fleet* of support. Supercaps aren't designed to OMGWTFBBQ rats or subcaps. They are designed to be anti-capital ships.


Indeed.

Not even in real-world navies do aircraft carriers operate without some kind of support, whether from the aircraft they carry with them or from other smaller ships in the fleet. Because of their immense size and relatively low moblity, and the fact that most of their guns are designed for long-range bombardment, rather than anti-aircraft fire, operating without support is pretty much suicide.


Hold the phone there Sparky. The only guns we had on our carrier that weren't attached to aircraft were the CIWS (close in weapons systems, affectionately known as "R2-D2 with a hard-on") designed to shoot down incoming planes and missile... nothing that was a threat at all to anything at range.

And yes, they serve cheese on aircraft carriers.

http://www.myspace.com/lil44_69/photos/25069865#%7B%22ImageId%22%3A25069865%7D (This is not me, btw...)

Six months in the hole... it changes a man.
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#70 - 2011-11-16 20:39:40 UTC
YOu could fly out of a bubble unless the bubble moves!

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#71 - 2011-11-16 20:44:34 UTC
Nova Fox wrote:
YOu could fly out of a bubble unless the bubble moves!


you'll be out of the bubble in no time at the blazing fast speed of 66 m/s

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#72 - 2011-11-16 20:51:26 UTC
Andski wrote:
Corina Jarr wrote:
Don;'t use em, so not sure but aren't supers immune to EWAR (which would include bubbles right?)?


No, supers are not immune to bubbles. If you're bubbled, you cannot enter warp or jump to a cyno - you're stuck unless you manage to take the bubble down with your smartbombs or by neuting out the HICs.

Thank you for the correction.
Thomas Orca
Broski is ded
#73 - 2011-11-16 20:54:46 UTC
E man Industries wrote:
Can you or someone explain how thse changes encourage supercaps to just form larger blobs rather than bring in a support fleet?


I believe his point is somewhere along the lines of "Supercarriers only need a minimal support fleet because of the Utility high slots they have allowing them to Remote rep each other easily, allowing them to not require carrier/logistics support, and their remote ECM bursts, allowing them to not require ECM support. Meaning the only real "support" a Supercarrier blob requires is tackle(Which can kind of be replaced by officer points) and "moar supers". These changes don't really nerf Supercaps abilities in a blob, but simply require more/better tackle to hold down smaller ships. These changes also make it so a single supercarrier is quite useless on its own, as it loses its main strength of near invincibility and sheer versatility of doing everything as good if not better than nearly every other ship, while maintaining all its downsides of being a massive target in every sense of the word, and getting absolutely ****** by bubbles."

Now, that seems to me like its working as intended.

That said, thanks to dread buffs, a Moros can actually do more damage than a Nyx with 25 Fighter bombers, so everything coming together may be a bit much for supercarriers.

Titans are still pretty dumb though.
SMT008
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#74 - 2011-11-16 22:24:45 UTC
I think that Supercarriers are a bit like tanks in Battlefield 3.

Powerfull, you have your main gun, you have the coaxial machinegun, you have the gunner's turret, you have the CITV station and all.

But if you roll too fast and without support in the ennemy base, what happens ? You'll get hit by 2 RPGs, your vehicle will be disabled, you won't be able to reverse to a safe place because you're too far from any kind of cover or friendly engineers who could repair you. And you'll die in a fire because you though you were driving an invincible behemoth.

(And it works the same with attack choppers. They kick metric tons of asses, but if they encounter too many AA Launchers or AA vehicles, you better get out fast. Ask your teammates to clean those up with regular tanks, then you'll be able to fly freely and destroy everything they have.)

Go alone and you'll die. Go with a support team, they won't break the tank because of friendly engineers, they'll get killed by the tank's machineguns, the tank will wreck any sort of cover if the ennemy is hiding. Epic win.
Terminal Insanity
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#75 - 2011-11-16 22:28:14 UTC
xxxak wrote:
. But the new alternative, being held down for 23 hours by an Ibis, is equally silly.

Ibis can fit a Warp Disruption Field Generator now?

"War declarations are never officially considered griefing and are not a bannable offense, and it has been repeatedly stated by the developers that the possibility for non-consensual PvP is an intended feature." - CCP
mkint
#76 - 2011-11-16 22:30:13 UTC
Terminal Insanity wrote:
xxxak wrote:
. But the new alternative, being held down for 23 hours by an Ibis, is equally silly.

Ibis can fit a Warp Disruption Field Generator now?

You missed the tone of the OP. He's never stuck around for a fight and always logoffski'd if he was losing or omgwtfbbqpwn'd everything else. Smells like an ebay account, doesn't it?

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.
Trainwreck McGee
Doomheim
#77 - 2011-11-16 23:12:12 UTC
I forgot a seriously serious important serious point..................

5 year old cheddar is perfect cheese

CCP Trainwreck - Weekend Custodial Engineer / CCP Necrogoats foot stool
Krios Ahzek
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#78 - 2011-11-16 23:18:46 UTC
xxxak wrote:


The infinite log-off timer is another example of just how blunt and confused CCP's actions have become. Certainly logoffski was ridiculous with supers. But the new alternative, being held down for 23 hours by an Ibis, is equally silly.


What, you mean your ship can actually be destroyed?

Astrid Stjerna wrote:
Zagam wrote:


Seriously though... CCP's changes aren't forcing bigger supercap blobs. They are forcing supercaps to require a *fleet* of support. Supercaps aren't designed to OMGWTFBBQ rats or subcaps. They are designed to be anti-capital ships.


Indeed.

Not even in real-world navies do aircraft carriers operate without some kind of support, whether from the aircraft they carry with them or from other smaller ships in the fleet. Because of their immense size and relatively low moblity, and the fact that most of their guns are designed for long-range bombardment, rather than anti-aircraft fire, operating without support is pretty much suicide.


In real life, aircraft carriers are also manned by 5000 men, not one.

 Though All Men Do Despise Us
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#79 - 2011-11-16 23:24:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Jaroslav Unwanted
War Kitten wrote:
Minister of Death wrote:
it's about cheese now?

one word: HAVARTI


Havarti, absolutely. A fine cheese, that one.


Olomoucké syrečky aka tvargle/tvarůžky .. far superior to any known cheeses..

Altho technically its not cheese Cool
Maxpie
MUSE LLP
#80 - 2011-11-16 23:31:47 UTC
Chaos Incarnate wrote:


if only there were ships capable of killing the mighty ibis solo


Made me laugh irl. +1

Also, Mozzarella. Especially when melted on just about anything. Sharp Provolone is up there also. Sort of depends on the mood.

No good deed goes unpunished