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Gevlon=Carebear Extraordinaire?

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Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#121 - 2014-05-14 15:23:41 UTC
I think you are missing the point that those 10% stay with Eve exactly because it requires high levels of patience and tolerance of failures.

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Malthuz Silva
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#122 - 2014-05-14 15:26:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Malthuz Silva
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
Malthuz Silva wrote:
So people dont like to Skill up to Battlercruiser (more than a Week) and grind up to lvl 4 mission just to lose them? Thats a surprise... I am saying that you need to much time just to realise how things work, and if you dont like doing LvL 4 Missions even doing it sucessful?


If you don't like L1s chances are you won't like L4s. And what do you need to run L1s? Oh yes, any t1 frig with t1 mods. Mere minutes after tutorial missions you should be ready to action.

Unless you are simultaneously playing russian roulette in RL you should have plenty of time to try most of activities Eve has to offer within first day.


Doing in a LvL 1 Mission with a frigate is a very diferent experience than doing LvL 4 with a Battlecruiser+
Even the modules.

But this is another topic and i went off the Original Topic, that Gevlon have some good points, and some bad ones too. But i think we all agreed that EvE experience for new players should improve.
Malthuz Silva
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#123 - 2014-05-14 15:27:49 UTC
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
I think you are missing the point that those 10% stay with Eve exactly because it requires high levels of patience and tolerance of failures.


Yes, and does not need to be like that.
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#124 - 2014-05-14 15:32:29 UTC
Malthuz Silva wrote:
Doing in a LvL 1 Mission with a frigate is a very diferent experience than doing LvL 4 with a Battlecruiser+
Even the modules.


All that is different are toys, method is the same and rules are the same so it is fair to say that L1 is testing ground for higher levels when you just started and are not sure if missions are something you would enjoy.

Malthuz Silva wrote:

But this is another topic and i went off the Original Topic, that Gevlon have some good points, and some bad ones too. But i think we all agreed that EvE experience for new players should improve.


Nope, I quite frankly don't care about experiences of new players because new players didn't spend last 3 years pumping money into CCP's wallet. I want my experience to be rich and beautiful and full of awesomeness and endless possibilities and everything that we all did see in trailers. And if all that will be there for me I am sure newbies will enjoy it too because that Eve will be simply EPIC.

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Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#125 - 2014-05-14 15:32:48 UTC
Malthuz Silva wrote:
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
I think you are missing the point that those 10% stay with Eve exactly because it requires high levels of patience and tolerance of failures.


Yes, and does not need to be like that.


So, why do you want to take away what other people like about the game?

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Malthuz Silva
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#126 - 2014-05-14 15:34:42 UTC
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
Malthuz Silva wrote:
a few days... 8+- days for Retriever, thats 8 days you do nothing worth your time. This time is wasted if you end up not liking what you skill up for and Quit the game as i did before.


Venture, Training time: 16 minutes.


as i said, nothing worth you time. In case of Venture your doesnt even need to be more than $ 0,1/hour
Marsha Mallow
#127 - 2014-05-14 15:34:45 UTC
Sibyyl wrote:
I agree that the 50% who drop out probably aren't good fits for the game and EVE would be made much worse by trying to cater to them. I disagree with lumping everyone in 90%. The players that don't connect with others may be antisocial, but Gevlon points to another key reason: These players may enjoy PvE but this activity is not geared towards cooperation. PvP is geared towards cooperation, but PvE isn't. I don't think it's a good assumption that this 40% who feel alone are all entitled players. It's too much of a simplification.. and EVE can only be made better if more aspects of the game are geared towards cooperative play (without turning into farming).

I can see what you are saying, and if CCP weren't concerned they wouldn't have created Team Pirate Unicorns and be considering a complete revamp of the NPE - all of which seems to be widely supported.

The thing I don't get is this perception that PVE content has to be solo'd, either as a starter or ongoing. The first corps I was active in had a mix of rookies and vets and we ran missions in fleet. Partly to get standings up for newer members, partly to clear them faster, but also to generate more money via salvage/loot. Normally the older players blitzed in BS, new members in BC (although we did level 4s in AFs a few times which was mental) the brand new players salvaged and we split the loot. I remember one guy practically crying after his first day in corp because he'd made 40m isk. He'd been playing solo for a month, had never had that much money before, and was ready to quit.

All of our core recruits were mission runners and a hell of a lot of them complained how hard they'd found the first few months. But we went looking for them, they weren't particularly pro-active fnding corps, so who was actually at fault there for that experience? It's not as though highsec corps don't exist which operate like we did (if anything there are way more starter corps now), and yeah, wardecs can be a pain but they aren't as gamebreaking as is claimed. We kept people in our recruitment channel for a minimum of a week (no API checks at that point) and never had issues with awoxers. If people are so terrified of wardecs and awoxers that they live in NPC or solo corps indefinitely they miss out on making any friends, and tbh they might as well go play Farmville.

Sibyyl wrote:
Do you disagree? Do you think that making players cooperate for PVE (like they have to for PVP) would turn EVE into a worse game?

Forcing joint play is a bit too much, but doesn't cooperative PVE already exist? Level 5s, Incursions, WHs? It's just that these activities make a lot of ISK, have risk attached to them, are finite resources people compete for and they can't be done in 15 minutes 3 jumps from Jita on a whim. I'm not sure those are bad things, why should it be easy?

Ripard Teg > For the morons in the room:

Sweets > U can dd my face any day
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#128 - 2014-05-14 15:38:57 UTC
Malthuz Silva wrote:
Schmata Bastanold wrote:

Venture, Training time: 16 minutes.


as i said, nothing worth you time. In case of Venture your doesnt even need to be more than $ 0,1/hour


So you say that to know if you LIKE mining you need to have a hulk right away? No, I'm not talking about earning a lot or plexing account from mining. I am talking about testing if you LIKE this activity enough to commit to longer training for better tools.

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ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#129 - 2014-05-14 15:39:44 UTC
As this thread is in essence an attack at another player, it gets a lock.

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