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[Kronos] Mordu's Legion

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Barton Breau
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#781 - 2014-05-15 14:03:38 UTC
Mournful Conciousness wrote:
7x cruise missile launcher (Nova Fury Cruise Missiles)
4x Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System
1x Large Bay Loading Accelerator II

No implants

No drone

1101 dps

with drone (1x gecko) : 1224dps

with 5% implants: 1340dps

overheat: 1555dps


Well, 1101 is without reloads, so probably ok, and dread are not t2, are they? :)
Mournful Conciousness
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#782 - 2014-05-15 14:50:34 UTC
Barton Breau wrote:
Mournful Conciousness wrote:
7x cruise missile launcher (Nova Fury Cruise Missiles)
4x Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System
1x Large Bay Loading Accelerator II

No implants

No drone

1101 dps

with drone (1x gecko) : 1224dps

with 5% implants: 1340dps

overheat: 1555dps


Well, 1101 is without reloads, so probably ok, and dread are not t2, are they? :)


I did an illustration with DG BCUs because of this:

Barton Breau wrote:

And for some reason me coputah says 1160dps with 4x cnbcs and 2 x 5% implant.


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SurrenderMonkey
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#783 - 2014-05-15 15:08:08 UTC  |  Edited by: SurrenderMonkey
Xuixien wrote:
Quote:
Role Bonus:
200% bonus to missile velocity
50% penalty to missile flight time


Why not just make it a 150% bonus to velocity and cut out the redundant penalty to flight time?


Because that would take it from a total range bonus of +50% to a range bonus of 150%?


Current stats take an unbonused light missile and increase its range from 18750 to 28,125. A 150% velocity bonus would bring the range to 46,875.

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Vulfen
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#784 - 2014-05-15 15:12:58 UTC
SurrenderMonkey wrote:
Xuixien wrote:
Quote:
Role Bonus:
200% bonus to missile velocity
50% penalty to missile flight time


Why not just make it a 150% bonus to velocity and cut out the redundant penalty to flight time?


Because that would take it from a total range bonus of +50% to a range bonus of 150%?


Current stats take an unbonused light missile and increase its range from 18750 to 28,125. A 150% velocity bonus would bring the range to 46,875.


That bonus that CCP have chosen is perfect, what i basically does is mean that most missiles will land at their target before the next cycle is launched, (like a gun).
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#785 - 2014-05-15 17:22:36 UTC  |  Edited by: epicurus ataraxia
Vulfen wrote:
SurrenderMonkey wrote:
Xuixien wrote:
Quote:
Role Bonus:
200% bonus to missile velocity
50% penalty to missile flight time


Why not just make it a 150% bonus to velocity and cut out the redundant penalty to flight time?


Because that would take it from a total range bonus of +50% to a range bonus of 150%?


Current stats take an unbonused light missile and increase its range from 18750 to 28,125. A 150% velocity bonus would bring the range to 46,875.


That bonus that CCP have chosen is perfect, what i basically does is mean that most missiles will land at their target before the next cycle is launched, (like a gun).


If that is the case, that is a stunning improvement and a massively worthwhile change.
A real advantage to this ship for that alone.

When prices moderate, I certainly intend to buy one.
Are they on Sisi yet? Does anyone know, (not at home to check)

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE
Rajeet Achmar
Rajeet Achmar Corporation
#786 - 2014-05-15 18:10:55 UTC
epicurus ataraxia wrote:


If that is the case, that is a stunning improvement and a massively worthwhile change.
A real advantage to this ship for that alone.

When prices moderate, I certainly intend to buy one.
Are they on Sisi yet? Does anyone know, (not at home to check)


They are on sisi, but not available and have no models
Barton Breau
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#787 - 2014-05-15 19:36:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Barton Breau
Mournful Conciousness wrote:
Barton Breau wrote:
Mournful Conciousness wrote:
7x cruise missile launcher (Nova Fury Cruise Missiles)
4x Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System
1x Large Bay Loading Accelerator II

No implants

No drone

1101 dps

with drone (1x gecko) : 1224dps

with 5% implants: 1340dps

overheat: 1555dps


Well, 1101 is without reloads, so probably ok, and dread are not t2, are they? :)


I did an illustration with DG BCUs because of this:

Barton Breau wrote:

And for some reason me coputah says 1160dps with 4x cnbcs and 2 x 5% implant.




I used cnbcs only because you claimed higher dps with t2 ones, ~1200 dps to be exact.
chaosgrimm
Synth Tech
#788 - 2014-05-15 20:50:48 UTC
Would like to see a minmatar bonus instead of gallente. Gallente impacting 5 of 7 pirate lines is stupid and ppl will still want a minmatar caldari ship. If adding a new faction isnt possible, why not add new lore to Mordus surrounding this ship?

Gallente have been getting quite a bit lately. Why devs <3 gallente so much? Moros, mega, t1 industrals, cap and med hybrids > proj since the TE nerf, drone buffs, armor buffs, 2 new pirate lines if you include this, 90% webs, etc.
Lephia DeGrande
Luxembourg Space Union
#789 - 2014-05-15 20:56:40 UTC
Stop whining about that Gallerte skills, god damit!

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scorchlikeshiswhiskey
Totally Abstract
O X I D E
#790 - 2014-05-15 21:00:58 UTC
Lephia DeGrande wrote:
Stop whining about that Gallerte skills, god damit!

It's legitimate whining, so stop whining about the whining! Big smile
Sweet Times
Riptide Riot
#791 - 2014-05-15 21:05:03 UTC
guys what are you taling about the role bonus is a gimic with no real benifit to the ship other than increasing the range of the missiles by 50%

the only other advantage it gives is if you manage to kill your target using rapid lights or heavies depending on the distance you may save 1 flight of missiles it does not inprove damage application in any way shape or from as a gal/cal missile pilot these ships are dead ducks before they get launched

the only benifit i see from them after the patch is all the kills in low from fools looking for the blueprints of them

looking foreward to the gila worn and rattler though those babies rock

mordus legion without a damage application bonus will be assigned ti station twirling for 2 years til its revisited and made into the faction missile boat a faction ship deserves
chaosgrimm
Synth Tech
#792 - 2014-05-15 21:11:35 UTC
Lephia DeGrande wrote:
Stop whining about that Gallerte skills, god damit!

legit concern, as a matter of fact looking back on the t1 industrial rebalance concerning racial inequality...

CCP Rise wrote:

We talked about specialized bays and other unique purposes, but ultimately decided that, for now, it was important to make sure that pilots from races other than Gallente weren't compelled to cross train for an Iteron 5...


also:
CCP Rise wrote:

Special purpose bays - This will be for Hoarder, Iteron Mark II, III, and IV. We wanted to do this originally, but held back because of concerns about racial inequality. Based on feedback I'm now hoping you guys will be fine with this inequality, as long as it isn't so favored towards Gallente that no one would ever train another race for hauling.


Frustrating that the gallente skill is being used just because of lore...
Sniper Smith
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#793 - 2014-05-15 21:52:10 UTC
To be fair.. the Gal are a very open and liberal people.. It makes sense for them to have presence in all areas.. for moreso than a race of Accountants, Heavens Gate Cultists, and extras from Mad Max..

Don't get me wrong, I wanted Caldari + Minm too.. But I see the lore reason for this, and for most of the others.. and can understand why the Gal would be more common an influence with all these factions.


The sad one is SOE.. Gal.. okay.. Amarr? Well the Amarr and SOE and negative to eachother.. made no sense..
Suitonia
Order of the Red Kestrel
#794 - 2014-05-15 22:09:48 UTC
I can definitely see the potential of the Garmur to be annoying, But it doesn't really strike me as that much worse than the Current Crow/Condor, aside from being slightly faster with approx 60% more non-kinetic locked damage and the scram range. Unlinked I think most Interceptors will have a hard time with it, but I think the Crusader in particular will give it a run for its money as it's equally fast and a Good sling-shot will get on top of it, and if the Garmur plays too defensively the Crusader can just leave, Damp Crows can run from it, I think the Malediction has a good chance of getting on top of it too, although I think a Garmur will beat a Malediction in a straight up duel if the Garmur does a web. The Imperial Navy Slicer has the potential to kill it too, if the Garmur gets too close (Slicer has 23+4km Optimal and out damages a Garmur and will not take full damage from it, if it is unwebbed, and unlinked, the Slicer will be able to just leave lock-range and warp off if the Garmur plays carefully at 30km or w/e. Standard Dual-Prop Dramiel is equally as quick, and has an AB and low-sig so if it gets a good-slingshot or on top of it, it can kill it easily, otherwise a Dramiel always has the option to leave the field. New Succubus can probably perma-tank the Garmur with AB running, New Cruor with the 20(26km) Vanilla web, or 28km(36.4km) Fed Navy web has the potential to kill it (I think this is a pretty good skill-matchup), DD is almost as fast and if the Garmur is bad it will die. Worm will probably die to the Garmur, but Garmur will probably have to shoot drones (which have 8k EHP)

I think when you add links & Snakes to the mix, it has the potential to become broken (But I think this is true of the Condor/Crow too) since Sensor Integrity + Rapid Deployment & Interdiction Maneuver links will allow it to become near-uncatchable and apply damage from 40km+. I think the same ships mentioned above on equal grounds though and with equal implants would give a linked+imp Garmur a run for its money.

Also worth pointing out that Evasive Maneuver gang link will hurt it's DPS a lot. I think a Garmur without a web vs other linked ships will have super low damage application (Especially Interceptors, Phantasm, Dramiel, anything with Dual Prop options and some kind of tank can probably permatank it) If it has a web then the web range on it I think is close enough that good piloting can land on top of the Garmur.

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Xequecal
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#795 - 2014-05-15 23:38:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Xequecal
Suitonia wrote:
I can definitely see the potential of the Garmur to be annoying, But it doesn't really strike me as that much worse than the Current Crow/Condor, aside from being slightly faster with approx 60% more non-kinetic locked damage and the scram range. Unlinked I think most Interceptors will have a hard time with it, but I think the Crusader in particular will give it a run for its money as it's equally fast and a Good sling-shot will get on top of it, and if the Garmur plays too defensively the Crusader can just leave, Damp Crows can run from it, I think the Malediction has a good chance of getting on top of it too, although I think a Garmur will beat a Malediction in a straight up duel if the Garmur does a web. The Imperial Navy Slicer has the potential to kill it too, if the Garmur gets too close (Slicer has 23+4km Optimal and out damages a Garmur and will not take full damage from it, if it is unwebbed, and unlinked, the Slicer will be able to just leave lock-range and warp off if the Garmur plays carefully at 30km or w/e. Standard Dual-Prop Dramiel is equally as quick, and has an AB and low-sig so if it gets a good-slingshot or on top of it, it can kill it easily, otherwise a Dramiel always has the option to leave the field. New Succubus can probably perma-tank the Garmur with AB running, New Cruor with the 20(26km) Vanilla web, or 28km(36.4km) Fed Navy web has the potential to kill it (I think this is a pretty good skill-matchup), DD is almost as fast and if the Garmur is bad it will die. Worm will probably die to the Garmur, but Garmur will probably have to shoot drones (which have 8k EHP)

I think when you add links & Snakes to the mix, it has the potential to become broken (But I think this is true of the Condor/Crow too) since Sensor Integrity + Rapid Deployment & Interdiction Maneuver links will allow it to become near-uncatchable and apply damage from 40km+. I think the same ships mentioned above on equal grounds though and with equal implants would give a linked+imp Garmur a run for its money.

Also worth pointing out that Evasive Maneuver gang link will hurt it's DPS a lot. I think a Garmur without a web vs other linked ships will have super low damage application (Especially Interceptors, Phantasm, Dramiel, anything with Dual Prop options and some kind of tank can probably permatank it) If it has a web then the web range on it I think is close enough that good piloting can land on top of the Garmur.


The thing is the Garmur can out-brawl most frigates in addition to being faster than most of them. The fitting is really generous, you can do DCU + MSE combo in both kiting and brawling fits. A rocket Garmur does the same DPS that a blaster Taranis does at point blank range, only it does it out to 12km. It's also faster than said Taranis, and has double the EHP as well. There is nothing that can catch it that it can't easily out-brawl, it can beat some of the Assault Frigates in a brawl.

Similarly, the LML kiting fits can't really be caught by anything, and escaping a 43km point (before skirmish links) on a ship that's faster than you is pretty much impossible.

The only frigates that it can't outright kill are other LML frigates that have more EHP than it does, and even those can't kill it, they can just drive it off.

Here's a fit I came up with:

Nanofiber II
IFFA
Micro B66 Core Augmentation (If you have Shield Upgrades V and AWU V, you can use a Pseudoelectron DCU and straight T1 MAPC instead)

Limited MWD
Warp Disruptor II
Faint Epsilon Scram/Fleeting web
MSE II

3x LML II

Polycarb I
Calefaction I
Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I

This easily kills every interceptor, frigate, pirate frigate, and every assault frigate except for LML Hawks.
Patri Andari
Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer
#796 - 2014-05-16 00:23:31 UTC
I still think they should have an appreciable increase in damage application over, and perhaps instead of, damage and warp disruption

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Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#797 - 2014-05-16 00:28:12 UTC
Patri Andari wrote:
I still think they should have an appreciable increase in damage application over, and perhaps instead of, damage and warp disruption
So another Golem/RNI type ship? Not sure how that would be at all better.
Sniper Smith
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#798 - 2014-05-16 01:21:35 UTC
While I think the Frig and Cruiser are fine, the BS really does need Damage Application.

I mean the best ship to compare the BS to is probably a Vindi. which gets TWO damage application bonuses (web and tracking).. Cross off the one that is the Faction feature, the web, and it still has the Tracking bonus.

While the speed/range bonus is nice, and I'd love to keep it, the fact is Torps have very poor damage application against anything that movies and has a sig smaller than a Titan lol. Having an application bonus that applies to the Torps/Cruise would greatly improve the ship.. though I still think she needs a little more dps also.. hence my suggestion before.

Make it a great partner to the Vindi.. I'd love it then.

Though it really would be nice if CCP Devs would start responding to these feedback threads.. I mean come on.. It's been what ? A month since there was a dev response in the drone thread, 3 weeks since one in the Pirate BS thread..
I don't expect a response to everyone, or even one every day, but every second day or so addressing some concerns, updates, etc would be really nice. If not, just lock the threads..
Sheimi Madaveda
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#799 - 2014-05-16 01:50:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Sheimi Madaveda
Medalyn Isis wrote:
Only a couple of ships which I can think of that have the range and tracking required to snipe this ship. Bearing in mind that it will be running with a sig at around 100 with mwd on and very high transversal. Even a corm which is probably the best ship to snip the Garmur has only around 0.035 tracking, which may not be enough when you consider how fast the ship will be able to travel. And most ships do not get that much of a bonus to railgun tracking either.


100 sig? The Garmur doesn't have a sig bloom bonus like an interceptor. Try closer to 180 unlinked (it's 192 without pimp MWD)

The Cormorant will track it pretty well. If you're using Spike against the Garmur, you need to stop. Here's why:

1. Corm can't dictate range or transversal vs MWD Garmur. Your tracking is bad, meaning you will miss the Garmur because it controls transversal.
3. The range Spike has over Lead is meaningless as the Garmur can't lock that far so it won't engage from that far. It will warp off if it does not wish to engage you.
4. Lead has more DPS than Spike.

Just get used to have ammo types in your Cormorant that aren't Antimatter/Javelin/Spike and you'll do pretty well vs Garmur. I gave you a general ammo type that projects quite well, and depending on your fit, another type may be better. Just watch out for the LML alpha in that paper tanked Corm, mmkay?

One thing I find interesting is that few people seem to want E-war + Speed tank on their Garmur like, say, a Condor tends to have. Part of me thinks it is because they will use the extra point range to stay much safer.

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Caleb Seremshur
Commando Guri
Guristas Pirates
#800 - 2014-05-16 03:46:19 UTC
The battleship will be like the ultimate missile carebear ship from a time efficiency standpoint.