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What have you learned recently?

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Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#81 - 2014-04-25 04:52:17 UTC
Drake Doe wrote:
I learned that fitting damage controls to bombers is redundant. (I feel naked without them)



Did you try to hull tank it? Cool

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#82 - 2014-04-25 06:11:55 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
Thread cleaned up a good amount. Keep it on topic and civil. Thank you.

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode

Senior Lead

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#83 - 2014-04-25 06:56:11 UTC
A bit heavy-handed, but understandable. Lol
Anyway, to restore the on-topic part of the answer:
Molic Blackbird wrote:
http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/insights-into-2013-production-and-destruction/

and

TornSoul wrote:

High-sec (14.3% of systems) : 27.8% of all destruction - 199.8B ISK/system
Low-sec (10.4% of systems) : 25.8% of all destruction - 153.1B ISK/system
Null-sec (42.8% of systems) : 36.9% of all destruction - 53.4 B ISK/system
WH-space (32.4% of systems) : 9.5% of all destruction - 18.1 B ISK/system


source: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4203786#post4203786

The problem is that it doesn't tell us much due to the varied usage of systems and since we're talking about risk (also, some of the percentages are a bit off). A better statistic would be this:

High: 145tn @ 71.5% of the population — normalised to 203tn.
Low: 110tn @ 8.2% of the population — normalised to 1,340tn.
WH: 45tn @ 5.4% of the population — normalised to 839tn.
Null: 176tn @ 15% of the population — normalised to 1,173tn.

Nothing particularly shocking. On an individual basis, null is about 5× riskier than high; wspace about 4×; and low creeping up on 7×, and on the whole, null itself handily out-destroys high in spite of massive tonnage loss spots such as Jita. If we take PotatoOverdose's legitimate (lost) comment about the results being skewed by station alts into account, it looks more like this:

High: 145tn @ 63.5% → 229tn.
Low: 110tn @ 7.6% → 1,446tn.
WH: 45tn @ 6.4% → 708tn.
Null: 176tn @ 20.7% → 850tn.

In fact, to go further than we did in the last version, if we go with the now-apocryphal estimate of 2.5 characters per account and ~450k accounts on TQ, we get an average per-character loss along the lines of:

Null: 821M, or somewhere in the region of 4–5 T2 cruisers.
WH: 684M, a T3 ship or two.
Low: 1,397M… what do people even use in low that would be a good reference point?! Lol
High: 220M, or roughly 1 battleship.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#84 - 2014-04-25 07:00:47 UTC
Tippia wrote:

Low: 1,397M… what do people even use in low that would be a good reference point?! Lol


Major problem with lowsec, such disparate groups, so many different ships. Hard to quantify.

It can be anything from cheap T1 frigates and cruisers to Ishtars and Lokis.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#85 - 2014-04-25 07:07:30 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Tippia wrote:

Low: 1,397M… what do people even use in low that would be a good reference point?! Lol

Major problem with lowsec, such disparate groups, so many different ships. Hard to quantify.

It can be anything from cheap T1 frigates and cruisers to Ishtars and Lokis.

So let's go with 200–300 Rifters then, mainly because of the absurdity of it all. P
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#86 - 2014-04-25 07:08:09 UTC
Tippia wrote:
On an individual basis, null is about 5× riskier than high; wspace about 4×; and low creeping up on 7×

low-sec.....

however if we speak about risk/reward.... it looks like 0.0 sec should not be on top of them all?

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#87 - 2014-04-25 07:09:58 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Tippia wrote:

Low: 1,397M… what do people even use in low that would be a good reference point?! Lol

Major problem with lowsec, such disparate groups, so many different ships. Hard to quantify.

It can be anything from cheap T1 frigates and cruisers to Ishtars and Lokis.

So let's go with 200–300 Rifters then, mainly because of the absurdity of it all. P


A fair statement, as despite how far it has fallen, the Rifter is still synonymous with both piracy in general and lowsec in particular.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#88 - 2014-04-25 07:10:09 UTC
Nice, I learned the area of space I live in, low-sec, is considered the riskiest in the game.
Josef Djugashvilis
#89 - 2014-04-25 07:10:32 UTC
That Tippia tends to post a lot, a lot, a lot, a lot...and so on to at least 3 million decimal places.

This is not a signature.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#90 - 2014-04-25 07:14:07 UTC
March rabbit wrote:
Tippia wrote:
On an individual basis, null is about 5× riskier than high; wspace about 4×; and low creeping up on 7×

low-sec.....

however if we speak about risk/reward.... it looks like 0.0 sec should not be on top of them all?

Weeell… lowsec has always had a completely screwed up risk/reward. You can't secure it the way you can null, which on its own would be sufficient to explain the higher risk, but then you have all the camped short-cut and nullsec entry systems that people keep hopping into in spite of being complete kill jars. So those probably bring the average up a whole bunch.

And if we add in the reward part, what are the rewards of low, really? A couple more POS options, meh:ish belt rats? I suppose there are a few popular M-sized exploration items that can be had, but those hardly support any kind of larger population.
Luwc
State War Academy
Caldari State
#91 - 2014-04-25 07:14:28 UTC
playing this game since six years.

I still dont really understand NOS mechanics.

http://hugelolcdn.com/i/267520.gif
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#92 - 2014-04-25 07:15:59 UTC
Tippia wrote:
March rabbit wrote:
Tippia wrote:
On an individual basis, null is about 5× riskier than high; wspace about 4×; and low creeping up on 7×

low-sec.....

however if we speak about risk/reward.... it looks like 0.0 sec should not be on top of them all?

Weeell… lowsec has always had a completely screwed up risk/reward. You can't secure it the way you can null, which on its own would be sufficient to explain the higher risk, but then you have all the camped short-cut and nullsec entry systems that people keep hopping into in spite of being complete kill jars. So those probably bring the average up a whole bunch.

And if we add in the reward part, what are the rewards of low, really? A couple more POS options, meh:ish belt rats? I suppose there are a few popular M-sized exploration items that can be had, but those hardly support any kind of larger population.


Furthermore, you also have to consider that lowsec is in fact highly inflated in terms of kill numbers thanks to Faction Warfare.

It would be really interesting to see how everything worked out if that were made into it's own category, or the numbers given separately.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#93 - 2014-04-25 07:18:34 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Furthermore, you also have to consider that lowsec is in fact highly inflated in terms of kill numbers thanks to Faction Warfare.

It would be really interesting to see how everything worked out if that were made into it's own category, or the numbers given separately.

Good point. Then again, FW is a solid earner so that's something I forgot on the reward side. But it requires you to be in the right systems and isn't something you can “just do” in low.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#94 - 2014-04-25 07:20:45 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Furthermore, you also have to consider that lowsec is in fact highly inflated in terms of kill numbers thanks to Faction Warfare.

It would be really interesting to see how everything worked out if that were made into it's own category, or the numbers given separately.

Good point. Then again, FW is a solid earner so that's something I forgot on the reward side. But it requires you to be in the right systems and isn't something you can “just do” in low.


Precisely, and it skews lowsec quite significantly, which makes it hard to account for.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#95 - 2014-04-25 07:23:56 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Precisely, and it skews lowsec quite significantly, which makes it hard to account for.

I mean, filtering out the systems isn't particularly hard — the question is what it does to population. Are FWers lowsec residents in the CCP censuses or are they spread over all kinds of space? Is there a known number of participants that can be subtracted from the population at large?
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#96 - 2014-04-25 07:47:34 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Weeell… lowsec has always had a completely screwed up risk/reward. You can't secure it the way you can null, which on its own would be sufficient to explain the higher risk, but then you have all the camped short-cut and nullsec entry systems that people keep hopping into in spite of being complete kill jars. So those probably bring the average up a whole bunch.

I think there is a fairly active portion of the lowsec population that measure their rewards in things other than ISK.

Particularly several of the FW Corps (Justified Chaos, Black Fox Marauders, etc.) and pirate Corps measure their reward more through pvp and don't really care if they are profitable or not, at least in their lowsec activities.
Mythrandier
Solace Corp
#97 - 2014-04-25 08:56:52 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
The Wire > The Shield.





This is possibly the most accurate thing ever uttered on EvE-O.


True story.

"In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." -  D. Adams.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#98 - 2014-04-25 09:51:42 UTC
handbanana wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
High sec is where you go to earn isk right now. Slightly less so come summer.


Why did goons occupy all those technecitum moons then when it was the thang?

Why do goons continue to do so today with the present hot moon goo?

Why would anyone pay 1bil+ or a lot more per month to rent in null if it's not a LOT more lucrative?




You do know that moon towers earn around the same as a miner right?

As for the renting null systems part, who knows. Some people also think ratting in carriers is a good idea and that GSF openly recruit.
Jarod Garamonde
Jolly Codgers
Get Off My Lawn
#99 - 2014-04-25 10:22:45 UTC
Dalto Bane wrote:
Thought this could be a fun topic. It is known fact that Eve has a steep learning curve. So steep that some players learn things, even trivial things after being considered a seasoned vet. What have you learned lately??Lol

Mine-Apparently you can block entire corps/alliances in chat. (Untested but hope it works for NPC corps)


I learned that it is actually scientifically possible to make the Kingdom of Zeal theme even better than the original version:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AV7JsFxhDMg

That moment when you realize the crazy lady with all the cats was right...

    [#savethelance]
Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#100 - 2014-04-25 11:07:19 UTC
I learned today that Alt+Space will focus on the Overview window. Also, someone showed me that I could drag my fits into the Market Quickbar.

Solecist, you changed.. again?

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.