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Standings Grind...The Future
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Patri Andari
Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer
#1 - 2014-04-17 00:24:10 UTC
What is the future of importance of having high standings with a corporation or faction in eve?

What direction do the current developers have in mind?

What should we expect to happen to the fruits of our labor (and game time which equals real money) if we spend it doing the grind?

I do not so much mind the direction the game is going. I also can adjust to the changes in time, but what I hate is the lack of transparency.


Please share with the player base what your overall plan looks like so that people can adjust accordingly. Many players log on and run missions solely to gain standings with a distant goal in sight. If the game will change so that those goals are diminished, why not alert us now...today... that those benefits are to be taken away?

I have perfect refine in many places. I can put up a POS in many places. I have jump clones in many places. I have access to many research agents. This because I made choices based on the rules in place for years.

If you plan to make changes to these or other things in the future, I feel that my past sub fees entitle me to some ( no matter how vague) warning that they will be devalued or washed away.

I am not asking that CCP stop making changes to the game. I am asking that you stop allowing people to waste time doing things you know will be useless when you know it right now!

In short, what other shoes do you plan to drop?

Be careful what you think, for your thoughts become your words. Be careful what you say, for your words become your actions. Be careful what you do, for your actions become your character. And character is everything. - author unknown
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#2 - 2014-04-17 00:26:03 UTC
If you leave Highsec now, you wont be surprised later.




Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#3 - 2014-04-17 00:28:33 UTC
Patri Andari wrote:

In short, what other shoes do you plan to drop?

Y'know, every single Eve player would probably like to know exactly what the future holds.

....I was probably going somewhere with this....hmmmm.....something something entitlement?
Yang Aurilen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#4 - 2014-04-17 00:29:59 UTC
TL;DR WAHH CCP I DON'T WANT CHANGE.

Post with your NPC alt main and not your main main alt!
Seraph Essael
Air
The Initiative.
#5 - 2014-04-17 00:33:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Seraph Essael
You need high standing with a factions corp if you want a Jump Clone with them still... Unless your corp has a Rorqual...

The only other thing you can do is join that JC corp (I forget its name)...

You won't need standings to put up a POS but other than that the JC stuffs the same... Not to mention if you want to run level 4s you still need the standing to do so...no?

Quoted from Doc Fury: "Concerned citizens: Doc seldom plays EVE on the weekends during spring and summer, so you will always be on your own for a couple days a week. Doc spends that time collecting kittens for the on-going sacrifices, engaging in reckless outdoor activities, and speaking in the 3rd person."
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2014-04-17 00:34:46 UTC
Its pretty simple really, whether you are highsec or bluesec, PvP or PvE, combat pilot or industrialist.

1. Being a spreadsheet game at heart - people soon work out what is optimal and publish it online somewhere
2. A large proportion of the EVE population then read this and spend fast amounts of time training for the current "optimal"
3. Forum trolls spot this and start claiming xxx is OP it needs to be nerfed or nullsec/highsec/widget-farming will die
4. CCP eventually respond by nerfing whatever is currently optimal

There are two conclusions from this:
1. blame the forums
2. if you train for whatever is currently optimal expect it to be nerfed to useless sometime soon :D
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#7 - 2014-04-17 00:38:43 UTC
Patri Andari wrote:
What is the future of importance of having high standings with a corporation or faction in eve?

What direction do the current developers have in mind?

What should we expect to happen to the fruits of our labor (and game time which equals real money) if we spend it doing the grind?

I do not so much mind the direction the game is going. I also can adjust to the changes in time, but what I hate is the lack of transparency.


Please share with the player base what your overall plan looks like so that people can adjust accordingly. Many players log on and run missions solely to gain standings with a distant goal in sight. If the game will change so that those goals are diminished, why not alert us now...today... that those benefits are to be taken away?

I have perfect refine in many places. I can put up a POS in many places. I have jump clones in many places. I have access to many research agents. This because I made choices based on the rules in place for years.

If you plan to make changes to these or other things in the future, I feel that my past sub fees entitle me to some ( no matter how vague) warning that they will be devalued or washed away.

I am not asking that CCP stop making changes to the game. I am asking that you stop allowing people to waste time doing things you know will be useless when you know it right now!

In short, what other shoes do you plan to drop?




I have a theory that if you can get a computer to send wireless signals on a tachyon carrier the signals will go back in time. Maybe you should log in on such a rig and let us know what happens. Or would we already know when you told us?


As for the standings thing, well, you made good use of it:

Quote:
I have perfect refine in many places. I can put up a POS in many places. I have jump clones in many places. I have access to many research agents. This because I made choices based on the rules in place for years.



So there you go. Are you irritated that there are going to be changes in regards to how faction is used? It happens in this game.

Learning skills, for example. And who complained when learning skills were taken away? Everybody who took the time to go Level 5 in all of them. But the refund of the SP also had others who didn't train all the way up complaining, thinking that it could not be refunded because then the SP for those who had them was "ill gotten".

I don't recall exactly how CCP worked it out but the Eve universe did not collapse.

We're lucky this outfit is not run like some other corporations that make these huge decisions with rooms full of marketers. But certain other "mainstream" games run like that are perhaps not going on so much notice because the people playing them are simply not aware. Tell them "Hey, they are going to change feature xyz in a few months" and they'll say "I like pie" or something.



My main hope is that we a POS can "go anywhere" they also end up like an MTU and can be shot by anybody but then I'm a bit of an a-hole so don't go on what I think.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Patri Andari
Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer
#8 - 2014-04-17 00:40:36 UTC
In Law there is a well known doctrine of Reliance

I have no interest in educating the trolls on the importance or niceties of this doctrine, but it basically holds that leaving someone holding a bag you know will go sour will make you liable if you know they relied on past promises and you know they will not apply in the future. While I have no intention of ever pursuing an action, I think the spirit of this doctrine makes for good neighbors.

Do not sell me a house you know will be condemned unless you share that knowledge.

Be careful what you think, for your thoughts become your words. Be careful what you say, for your words become your actions. Be careful what you do, for your actions become your character. And character is everything. - author unknown
Karen Avioras
The Raging Raccoons
#9 - 2014-04-17 00:43:02 UTC
You can still do COSMOS missions :D
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#10 - 2014-04-17 00:54:01 UTC
Patri Andari wrote:
In Law there is a well known doctrine of Reliance

I have no interest in educating the trolls on the importance or niceties of this doctrine, but it basically holds that leaving someone holding a bag you know will go sour will make you liable if you know they relied on past promises and you know they will not apply in the future. While I have no intention of ever pursuing an action, I think the spirit of this doctrine makes for good neighbors.

Do not sell me a house you know will be condemned unless you share that knowledge.

Internet Spaceship Lawyers.
*Sigh*

Do you know how you get trolls? You get trolls when people repeatedly and incessantly post the same garbage on a particular forum with little or no variation. A good example: applying RL law, precedent, and custom to what happens in a videogame.

"Intention of ever pusuing action" ~ lol. Do you want trolls? This is how you get trolls.
Patri Andari
Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer
#11 - 2014-04-17 00:56:02 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Patri Andari wrote:
In Law there is a well known doctrine of Reliance

I have no interest in educating the trolls on the importance or niceties of this doctrine, but it basically holds that leaving someone holding a bag you know will go sour will make you liable if you know they relied on past promises and you know they will not apply in the future. While I have no intention of ever pursuing an action, I think the spirit of this doctrine makes for good neighbors.

Do not sell me a house you know will be condemned unless you share that knowledge.

Internet Spaceship Lawyers.
*Sigh*

Do you know how you get trolls? You get trolls when people repeatedly and incessantly post the same garbage on a particular forum with little or no variation. A good example: applying RL law, precedent, and custom to what happens in a videogame.

"Intention of ever pusuing action" ~ lol. Do you want trolls? This is how you get trolls.


Video games is srius bidness!

Be careful what you think, for your thoughts become your words. Be careful what you say, for your words become your actions. Be careful what you do, for your actions become your character. And character is everything. - author unknown
Desimus Maximus
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#12 - 2014-04-17 01:12:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Desimus Maximus
You mean like spending 2 months of skill queue getting into an Orca and another full month of skilling to get into what was the largest subcap indy only to be bent over?

It is now 17d to get into an Orca for brand new toon and, and I cannot tell you how much this one pisses me off, 33 minutes, THIRTY-F*$@ING-THREE minutes to get into an Itty-V......... which is no longer the largest subcap indy, that goes to the Bestower, requiring those of us who already spent a month to get into the largest subcap indy to spend about another month to maximize the NEW subcap indy. I have no doubt that within the next year the Tayra (Badger mk II) will somehow be "re-balanced" into being the new largest subcap indy in the game.

CCP has one goal... make you spend more and more time skilling the same crap over and over. The sooner you realize this, the sooner you can accept reality.

They have no intention of revealing their changes because they have to suck the playerbase in one direction in order to make their scheme effective.
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2014-04-17 01:34:38 UTC
Just do not play the SP minigame and all will be fine.
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#14 - 2014-04-17 01:36:52 UTC
Patri Andari wrote:

Video games Internet spaceships is srius bidness!


FYP


☼

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.
Abyss Azizora
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#15 - 2014-04-17 01:54:50 UTC
Karen Avioras wrote:
You can still do COSMOS missions :D


Once. :D
Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
#16 - 2014-04-17 02:01:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Goldiiee
I sort of agree with the OP, the whole risk/reward factor we have been proclaiming is the 'Backbone of EVE' gets washed away a little more each time an expansion hits. This game was unique in things like Time Sink, Risk vs. Reward and individual choices becoming a permanent reflection of your character, but with this proposed expansion I can't help but think we are now paying for a homogenized version of the game I started playing years ago.

The risk of running missions and spending a huge amount of time, money and ISK to get the standings for a high sec POS, No longer necessary. The need to have two different training tacks, one for missions the other for science and industry, No longer necessary. Now all that risk and effort is thrown away for an expansion that rewards any Tom, Richard or Harry with the ability to make a toon and train two skill in less than an hour with a POS in any location they like.

I know any moment now the Forum will be filled with cries of 'I want the three months of my life back CCP, can you refund my credit card for the wasted time I spent to achieve a difficult goal'. That difficult goal that was supposed to allow me an advantage not available to others that didn't persevere. The proposed new POS dropping requirement is just a kick in the teeth, insult to injury, curing a pain in the ass by amputating the head, pick any metaphor they will probably all apply.

I would almost understand a 'moving the goal posts' idea/plan, but eliminating the goal entirely? In this game? I just don't know what to say to that.

I feel cheated, and I don't have the energy left to bother with a log-in screen.

So I went out and bought a the new X-Box today, it's my first Console.

Things that keep me up at night;  Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#17 - 2014-04-17 02:05:55 UTC
Goldiiee wrote:

The risk of running missions and spending a huge amount of time

I'm sorry, I stopped reading right there.
Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
#18 - 2014-04-17 02:08:04 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Goldiiee wrote:

The risk of running missions and spending a huge amount of time

I'm sorry, I stopped reading right there.

Yeah I understand, ADD customers are getting rather prolific in the game.

Things that keep me up at night;  Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2014-04-17 02:10:20 UTC
Goldiiee wrote:
I sort of agree with the OP, the whole risk/reward factor we have been proclaiming is the 'Backbone of EVE' gets washed away a little more each time an expansion hits. This game was unique in things like Time Sink, Risk vs. Reward and individual choices becoming a permanent reflection of your character, but with this proposed expansion I can't help but think we are now paying for a homogenized version of the game I started playing years ago.

The risk of running missions and spending a huge amount of time, money and ISK to get the standings for a high sec POS, No longer necessary. The need to have two different training tacks, one for missions the other for science and industry, No longer necessary. Now all that risk and effort is thrown away for an expansion that rewards any Tom, Richard or Harry with the ability to make a toon and train two skill in less than an hour with a POS in any location they like.



Its probably been recommended by marketing boys straight out of uni. Wizards took a similar approach with 4th ed D&D and pretty much handed the whole PnP tabletop RP market to pathfinder overnight. The sort of player that wants easy fun and things handed to them on a plate has a short attention spam and is not the sort of player that sticks with a game long term.

Another example of this is drones where the summer changes will make it possible for a new player to have virtually max sentry DPS with a fraction of the current skills.
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#20 - 2014-04-17 02:15:05 UTC
Goldiiee wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Goldiiee wrote:

The risk of running missions and spending a huge amount of time

I'm sorry, I stopped reading right there.

Yeah I understand, ADD customers are getting rather prolific in the game.

Could you elaborate on the risks faced by a T2 fit Raven or Dominix in Osmon?

I'm afraid I'm rather dumb when it comes to things like these, but I'd love to expand my horizons and to learn the tales of the heroic missioners of osmon and the dangers they brave every day!
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