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New Warp Effect

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Hiram Alexander
State Reprisal
#141 - 2011-11-22 16:13:36 UTC
There were a few conversations going on in local, so I've snipped anything that didn't have some kind of relation to this (chats about State Ravens, and Jove ships, for example...)

I've X'd out my Alt (no big secret, though...) ;)

(snip)
[ 2011.11.22 14:23:45 ] CCP Mankiller > no, sorry, I am just a gfx programmer in Reykjavik wokring on the trails atm
(snip)
[ 2011.11.22 14:25:18 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > CCP Mankiller, if you're working with the gfx team, could you ask them to fix the warp tunnel, so that it distorts the sun again...? That was amazing...
[ 2011.11.22 14:26:08 ] CCP Mankiller > you think so? we actually agreed on NOT doing this....
[ 2011.11.22 14:26:16 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > aaargh
[ 2011.11.22 14:26:33 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > it was superb
[ 2011.11.22 14:26:54 ] CCP Mankiller > cause technically the sun's lensflares are a camera lens effect, therefore happen only in the camera and are not distorted by some warp tunnel
[ 2011.11.22 14:27:52 ] The Antiquarian > In a sense, we capsuleers are using camera drones to look at the universe/space, so it's logical to have the sun's lensflare effect!
[ 2011.11.22 14:27:56 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > not sure if we're talking about the same effect -- it looked like a fireball when you warped - the way planets do (only fiery)
[ 2011.11.22 14:28:11 ] CCP Mankiller > yes, we are talking about the same
[ 2011.11.22 14:28:22 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > Aargh... plz bring it back.
[ 2011.11.22 14:28:55 ] The Antiquarian > and the effect complies "lore wise" as well, with the use of camera drones. The space we are seeing are with camera drones =P
[ 2011.11.22 14:29:09 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > there's a thread here about it...
[ 2011.11.22 14:29:12 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=398830#post398830
(snip)
[ 2011.11.22 14:53:55 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > CCP GFX Ppl... 2 Questions...1. How much work would it take to switch sun-warp-distortion back on..? and2. My Merlin has three engine nozzles (on wings), but only two flames, is that deliberate?
[ 2011.11.22 14:55:31 ] CCP Mankiller > 1. Not much.... Question is what the art director says...
[ 2011.11.22 14:55:35 ] CCP Mankiller > 2. checking.....
(snip)
[ 2011.11.22 15:00:02 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > CCP Mankiller, I'm not sure who the Art Director is, but could you please ask him/her to re-consider switching it back on, please? And to reply to this thread, if possible...
[ 2011.11.22 15:00:07 ] CCP Mankiller > hm, the merlin i am in atm has 5 flames
[ 2011.11.22 15:00:12 ] CCP Mankiller > 2 left, 1 middle, 2 right
[ 2011.11.22 15:00:14 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > rgr
[ 2011.11.22 15:00:20 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > two at each side
[ 2011.11.22 15:00:30 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > but each side has three nozzles
[ 2011.11.22 15:00:45 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > fly slower, and look at engines
[ 2011.11.22 15:01:39 ] CCP Mankiller > ah, ok! artist sitting across me says: "by design!"
[ 2011.11.22 15:01:57 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > oh, okay... thx :)
[ 2011.11.22 15:02:18 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > (thread for Art Director...)
[ 2011.11.22 15:02:20 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=398830#post398830
(snip)
[ 2011.11.22 15:03:43 ] CCP Mankiller > gotta go
[ 2011.11.22 15:03:54 ] XXXXXXXXX XXXXX > o/
Oberine Noriepa
#142 - 2011-11-22 16:41:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Oberine Noriepa
Lens flare I can get, but the distortion doesn't make a lot of sense. Your camera drones are in the warp bubble with you. The warp bubble is distorting the light from the sun. Surely the drones would see this? I mean, the bubble distorts light from everything else to begin with and the drones see it. What?

If a dev needs clarification, here's a video for what we're talking about. (Clicky)

EDIT: Oh wait. You can see the lens flare distorting as well. Hmm. Maybe it's a little trickier than I thought. I suppose at this point I'm fine with either result.

∃
Daedalus Arcova
The Scope
#143 - 2011-11-22 17:25:55 UTC
I still haven't seen a response from a Dev about why there are no engine trails in warp. If you have trails at subwarp speeds, it seems completely nonsensical that they don't also appear at warp speed.
Logan LaMort
Screaming Hayabusa
#144 - 2011-11-22 17:30:08 UTC
I don't really care about it being immersive or not... I just think the distorted sun was really cool, and I imagine engine trails in warp would be too.
Hiram Alexander
State Reprisal
#145 - 2011-11-22 17:36:53 UTC
Logan LaMort wrote:
I don't really care about it being immersive or not... I just think the distorted sun was really cool, and I imagine engine trails in warp would be too.

I've put up a post in General Discussion, and hopefully it'll help...
BlindFury
Genbuku.
Psycho Unicorn Squad
#146 - 2011-11-22 18:40:37 UTC
Daedalus Arcova wrote:
I still haven't seen a response from a Dev about why there are no engine trails in warp. If you have trails at subwarp speeds, it seems completely nonsensical that they don't also appear at warp speed.


This was how engine trails functioned back in 2003. The reason is because you are going to fast for them to display.

BF
Aethlyn
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#147 - 2011-11-22 19:39:26 UTC
Daedalus Arcova wrote:
I still haven't seen a response from a Dev about why there are no engine trails in warp. If you have trails at subwarp speeds, it seems completely nonsensical that they don't also appear at warp speed.

They slow down the moment they leave your ship, so you're just flying too fast to see them forming a trail.

Newton: Actio = Reactio

Means: The faster your ship moves forward, the faster the engine trail particles fly backwards (in the opposite direction). It's not exactly the same speed as your ship (because they start at your own speed), but it should as well mean that they'll fly faster than in normal space, which means the trails will be a lot longer/thinner/harder to see while in warp.

Looking for more thoughts? Follow me on Twitter.
Montevius Williams
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#148 - 2011-11-22 22:21:46 UTC
Yea, I was wondering why the warp effect looked nerfed - this is why, no Sun warp effect is was REALLY REALLY cool....C'mon CCP, bring it back

"The American Government indoctrination system known as public education has been relentlessly churning out socialists for over 20 years". - TravisWB
Solhild
Doomheim
#149 - 2011-11-22 22:23:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Solhild
Warp is initiated by a warp core (or something), a few seconds of engine trail is stretched across multiple AU in the warp tunnel behind you and wouldn't be visible but you should still see something leaving your ship - perhaps even a different effect that is unique to warp. In fact watching other ships warping off grid should show a cool effect around the departing ship rather than simply, ship speeds up and disappears.

As far as the sun effect is concerned, it looked great when everything outside the warp tunnel was disrupting all over the place. Warping toward the inner parts of each system showed the sun as a boiling mass throwing layers across the warp effect, looked fantastic - current sun = meh!
Lone Gunman
Forhotea Corporation
#150 - 2011-11-23 01:29:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Lone Gunman
iiiiiiiiiissssssss Back. Red\Blue doppler shift effect. Although the Blue is hard to see in Lonetrek, I would assume the same for the red shift in Minmi space. But in Black Rise, no problem.
Daedalus Arcova
The Scope
#151 - 2011-11-23 11:18:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Daedalus Arcova
Solhild wrote:
Warp is initiated by a warp core (or something), a few seconds of engine trail is stretched across multiple AU in the warp tunnel behind you and wouldn't be visible but you should still see something leaving your ship - perhaps even a different effect that is unique to warp. In fact watching other ships warping off grid should show a cool effect around the departing ship rather than simply, ship speeds up and disappears.


Yeah, but this is EVE, so real-world (or even theoretical) physics don't actually apply. Blink

We can already see our ships' thrusters burning away in warp, so to not show the trails is just inconsistent. Also, going to warp and dropping out of it would look awesome to observers if there were trails in warp. To be honest, warping is pretty much the only time when engine trails would look at all appropriate.
Tusseluring
#152 - 2011-11-24 21:49:50 UTC
Maybe i'm the only one, but imo the new warp effect is way too "heavy", i'ld like an esc-menu option to switch it off.
Crucis Cassiopeiae
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#153 - 2011-11-24 22:33:22 UTC
please get sun distortion back...

Vote Issler Dainze for CSM7! http://community.eveonline.com/council/voting/Vote.asp?c=470 
Avila Cracko
#154 - 2011-11-25 11:20:14 UTC
whats with the sun CCP???

truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.
Jarnis McPieksu
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#155 - 2011-11-25 11:27:24 UTC
I could see sun (well, everything outside the warp bubble/tunnel) distorted, yet any lens effects and overlay huds should not be. Could be a very complex issue depending on how the scene is drawn in the engine.

I'm fairly sure that it is too late to change it and no matter how it is, after the expansion ships, there will be noise about it either way. I just hope CCP has added :iterate: to their vocabulary and we get some further polising on it later.
Redklaw
Edge Of Infinity
True Reign
#156 - 2011-11-25 12:17:27 UTC
Well technically you shouldn't see anything behind your ship anyways, since you are moving faster than light while in warp and the light from your engine trails would never be travelling fast enough to reach you... Then again its a game set in a fictional world, once you throw a device like a FTL drive into the mix talking about real world physics is kinda pointless :P.

Personally I think engine trails while in warp would be kind of "too much" in an artistic sense. I prefer the tunnels on their own, I think throwing in engine trails would just make it look to busy.
Xenial Jesse Taalo
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#157 - 2011-11-25 12:29:54 UTC
Engine trails, cyno fields, Aura's voice...
Now we can add sun distortion to the list of effects that were once a lot cooler.
Montevius Williams
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#158 - 2011-11-25 16:23:05 UTC
CCP, please bring back the Sun distortion effect. I dont think you realized just how awesome this was.

"The American Government indoctrination system known as public education has been relentlessly churning out socialists for over 20 years". - TravisWB
Dewatts
We Come In Peaces
#159 - 2011-11-25 17:36:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Dewatts
Sun distortion - Looks nice
Lens Flare distortion - Not good

I'd say, add some non lens effect glow/atmosphere to the sun like this image, except a little more subtle.

Sun disc + atmospheric glow get distorted while warping
Lens flare remains undistorted

This would also look nice to see a subtle glow even when the sun is occlude by small objects.

Edit: this effect should become more and more noticeable the closer you get to the sun/star. AND, it'd be nice if there was a much greater difference in lens flare scale based on distance to the sun/star. When I'm at the edge of a solar system, I want it to reeeeally feel like I am reeeealy far away.
Kor'el Izia
#160 - 2011-11-25 23:07:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Kor'el Izia
Dewatts wrote:
When I'm at the edge of a solar system, I want it to reeeeally feel like I am reeeealy far away.

If I remeber correctly this was something that t0rfifrans wanted aswell...
edit: Source /edit

ShadowFire15 wrote:
it is nice. a video would be better but here some pics

Inside a planet

getting ready to leave the planet

Judging pic by pic
Pic 1: Oh I'm actually inside something, can't see the starfield or the sun...
Pic 2: Hey! What is that sun doing there!

It saddens me that one detail can ruin the whole picture, because now you are looking at the sun which your gut is saying shouldn't be there while the awesome exit effect is being neglected...

I'm full aware that those pics were taken 11 days ago and CCP has had time to add stuff into the final version, but has that sun been removed while inside planets? Or is that somehing we will have to wait for Crucible 1.X to adress?