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EVE: the Game you Wait to Play

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Eyrun Mangeiri
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#261 - 2014-04-11 07:30:13 UTC
Asia Leigh wrote:
Eyrun Mangeiri wrote:
Karak Kashada wrote:
Ah, another poster who completely misses the point. Try again?


No, you try at better explaining what your point is, because it is not clear what the hell you want at all.


Your just wasting your time... He is just trolling at this point. He believes he's right and everyone else is wrong.


Yeah, I thought so.

I can see what you see not - vision milky then eyes rot. When you turn they will be gone - whispering their hidden song.
Karak Kashada
Silver Talon
#262 - 2014-04-11 07:30:17 UTC
Asia Leigh wrote:

Last try then I'm going to lose it...
Your choice.

Asia Leigh wrote:
YOU CAN DO EVERYTHING YOU CAN DO IN A T2 SHIP IN A T1 SHIP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111!!!111!
Oh. My mistake. I thought there was a reason that they had T2 ships. I guess that makes them nothing more than training-time sinks. CCP has really let me down now!

Can you also do everything you can do in a T3 ship in a T1 ship? Or is that where the line is drawn?

Asia Leigh wrote:
There is no real pilot progression here, there also isn't an end game here either. Your end game is whatever you want it to be, but as you work towards that end game, doesn't mean you cant participate in your chosen field. It just makes you a little less efficient at it, and sometimes player skill makes up for that skill point discrepancy. Guess what You aren't gaining player skill by playing the "Skill queue game" either. You only get that by actually playing the game.
A point that I am very aware of, but which is entirely unrelated to the OP...

Asia Leigh wrote:
But I have the distinct feeling that I'm wasting my breath with you...

Posting off-topic material is always a waste of breath, but don't attempt to blame me for your doing it. And if you judge replying to me to be a waste of your time, stop replying to/reading my posts. Believe me, if you posted something with which I could, in good conscience, agree, I would not disagree!
Asia Leigh
Kenshin Industries.
Kenshin Shogunate.
#263 - 2014-04-11 07:32:44 UTC
Alyth Nerun wrote:
OP, since you love mindless grinding so much, have you tried mining?


Odds are he would rage quit the first time a catalyst even landed on grid with him let alone ganked :P
Apply the damn rules equally >.>
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
Sedition.
#264 - 2014-04-11 07:34:17 UTC
Karak Kashada wrote:

Can you also do everything you can do in a T3 ship in a T1 ship?

Yes, the answer to this question is yes.
Karak Kashada
Silver Talon
#265 - 2014-04-11 07:38:44 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:

I introduced no hypothetical. I introduced an api-verified fight that actually happened.
True.
PotatoOverdose wrote:

This fight, and others like it, disprove your assertion that you need to wait in Eve until you get T2 ships to have fun in lowsec pvp, amongst other points.
Only I did not assert that. Feel free, however, to quote me asserting it, and I will happily admit my error.

PotatoOverdose wrote:
You do not need to "wait to play".
That is true only under certain conditions. As is my point.
PotatoOverdose wrote:
You do not need a T2 ship to have fun.
As I have not asserted otherwise, this is a strawman argument.
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Player skill, not SP, not T2, does in fact dominate pvp in Eve. I assert this, and I support it not with "hypotheticals", but with fact.
Gee whiz. If only someone would tell this to highsec miners. They would be encouraged to know that all they need to dominate those three Catalysts blasting holes in their hull is a little bit o' "player skill." If they only knew it were so easy. Oh... you weren't talking about mining vessels, were you. You were talking about cargo ships. Roll
Asia Leigh
Kenshin Industries.
Kenshin Shogunate.
#266 - 2014-04-11 07:40:50 UTC
Karak Kashada wrote:
Asia Leigh wrote:

Last try then I'm going to lose it...
Your choice.

Asia Leigh wrote:
YOU CAN DO EVERYTHING YOU CAN DO IN A T2 SHIP IN A T1 SHIP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111!!!111!
Oh. My mistake. I thought there was a reason that they had T2 ships. I guess that makes them nothing more than training-time sinks. CCP has really let me down now!

Can you also do everything you can do in a T3 ship in a T1 ship? Or is that where the line is drawn?

Asia Leigh wrote:
There is no real pilot progression here, there also isn't an end game here either. Your end game is whatever you want it to be, but as you work towards that end game, doesn't mean you cant participate in your chosen field. It just makes you a little less efficient at it, and sometimes player skill makes up for that skill point discrepancy. Guess what You aren't gaining player skill by playing the "Skill queue game" either. You only get that by actually playing the game.
A point that I am very aware of, but which is entirely unrelated to the OP...

Asia Leigh wrote:
But I have the distinct feeling that I'm wasting my breath with you...

Posting off-topic material is always a waste of breath, but don't attempt to blame me for your doing it. And if you judge replying to me to be a waste of your time, stop replying to/reading my posts. Believe me, if you posted something with which I could, in good conscience, agree, I would not disagree!


Okay, I'm convinced your just ******** at this point.

If that's the way you feel just leave then... We won't miss you. Don't let the door hit you on the ass on the way out, and don't come back either.

Bye
Apply the damn rules equally >.>
Karak Kashada
Silver Talon
#267 - 2014-04-11 07:41:21 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Karak Kashada wrote:

Can you also do everything you can do in a T3 ship in a T1 ship?

Yes, the answer to this question is yes.

Good deal. Care to substantiate that with something other than your "personal guarantee"? I mean, you have all the evidence for the other points... Youtube vids and killboards, etc. No hypotheticals, remember. That's for us noobs.
Karak Kashada
Silver Talon
#268 - 2014-04-11 07:44:21 UTC
Asia Leigh wrote:

Okay, I'm convinced your just ******** at this point.
Autosuggestion is a wonderful thing, isn't it?

Asia Leigh wrote:
If that's the way you feel just leave then... We won't miss you. Don't let the door hit you on the ass on the way out, and don't come back either.

Bye
Ciao.
Asia Leigh
Kenshin Industries.
Kenshin Shogunate.
#269 - 2014-04-11 07:45:06 UTC
Karak Kashada wrote:
Gee whiz. If only someone would tell this to highsec miners. They would be encouraged to know that all they need to dominate those three Catalysts blasting holes in their hull is a little bit o' "player skill." If they only knew it were so easy. Oh... you weren't talking about mining vessels, were you. You were talking about cargo ships. Roll


You know that avoiding a gank is like the easiest thing, even for noobs. Using a phrase you like to use all the time "Try again?"
Apply the damn rules equally >.>
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#270 - 2014-04-11 07:45:28 UTC
Karak Kashada wrote:
Gee whiz. If only someone would tell this to highsec miners. They would be encouraged to know that all they need to dominate those three Catalysts blasting holes in their hull is a little bit o' "player skill." If they only knew it were so easy. Oh... you weren't talking about mining vessels, were you. You were talking about cargo ships. Roll


All the highsec miner needs to survive is to put even the tiniest amount of effort towards his own defense.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Abigail Sagan
Skeleton Liberation Front
#271 - 2014-04-11 07:46:19 UTC
Karak Kashada wrote:
masternerdguy wrote:


And you will get owned in your pimped out ship and get made fun of on EVENews24 and The Mittani. But then you might learn SP is not equal to skill.

You keep saying that you aren't wanting everything right now, but all your posts scream "I Want It Now!"

No, they do not. They scream—if they scream at all—"Make my in-game time worth something!"

And, for the record, no matter how many posters attempt to cram this "I want it now" nonsense down my throat, it will continue to be a strawman argument. Not once have I clamored for anything "right now." I will be happy to see the same amount of time pass before I can pilot a certain ship or fit a certain mod. I simply am not amenable to the mechanism CCP has built.


If I understood you correctly, you want your in-game time to be worth something. Here is what my in-game time is worth to me:
- Iskies
- Game mechanics experience
- Excitement
- Relationships
- And most importantly: Fun

I have never needed high skill points for any of those. Higher skills (I have some now) do help with getting the iskies though - to a point, but iskies are the least important of the five points above - a necessary evil really.

In-character skill training thankfully isn't part of that 'in-game time' deal. Even having to grind for iskies is often bad enough. I don't want to grind to learn skills too. Skill training in EVE is very good, not perfect though.
Eyrun Mangeiri
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#272 - 2014-04-11 07:46:25 UTC
Karak Kashada wrote:
Gee whiz. If only someone would tell this to highsec miners. They would be encouraged to know that all they need to dominate those three Catalysts blasting holes in their hull is a little bit o' "player skill." If they only knew it were so easy. Oh... you weren't talking about mining vessels, were you. You were talking about cargo ships. Roll


Yes, they can prevent getting ganked by playing better.

I can see what you see not - vision milky then eyes rot. When you turn they will be gone - whispering their hidden song.
Karak Kashada
Silver Talon
#273 - 2014-04-11 07:47:09 UTC
Asia Leigh wrote:
Karak Kashada wrote:
Gee whiz. If only someone would tell this to highsec miners. They would be encouraged to know that all they need to dominate those three Catalysts blasting holes in their hull is a little bit o' "player skill." If they only knew it were so easy. Oh... you weren't talking about mining vessels, were you. You were talking about cargo ships. Roll


You know that avoiding a gank is like the easiest thing, even for noobs. Using a phrase you like to use all the time "Try again?"

You're back! Awe, I'm touched. And here I was under the impression that you thought I was *********.

Oh, and the point of discussion (off-topic, though it is) was not "surviving a gank," but "dominating in PvP." Just FYI.
Asia Leigh
Kenshin Industries.
Kenshin Shogunate.
#274 - 2014-04-11 07:50:14 UTC
Karak Kashada wrote:
Asia Leigh wrote:
Karak Kashada wrote:
Gee whiz. If only someone would tell this to highsec miners. They would be encouraged to know that all they need to dominate those three Catalysts blasting holes in their hull is a little bit o' "player skill." If they only knew it were so easy. Oh... you weren't talking about mining vessels, were you. You were talking about cargo ships. Roll


You know that avoiding a gank is like the easiest thing, even for noobs. Using a phrase you like to use all the time "Try again?"

You're back! Awe, I'm touched. And here I was under the impression that you thought I was *********.

Oh, and the point of discussion (off-topic, though it is) was not "surviving a gank," but "dominating in PvP." Just FYI.


Who the hell shoots mining barges in catalysts in low sec? You know you meant suicide ganks, but nice try.
Apply the damn rules equally >.>
Karak Kashada
Silver Talon
#275 - 2014-04-11 07:52:07 UTC
Asia Leigh wrote:
Karak Kashada wrote:
Asia Leigh wrote:
Karak Kashada wrote:
Gee whiz. If only someone would tell this to highsec miners. They would be encouraged to know that all they need to dominate those three Catalysts blasting holes in their hull is a little bit o' "player skill." If they only knew it were so easy. Oh... you weren't talking about mining vessels, were you. You were talking about cargo ships. Roll


You know that avoiding a gank is like the easiest thing, even for noobs. Using a phrase you like to use all the time "Try again?"

You're back! Awe, I'm touched. And here I was under the impression that you thought I was *********.

Oh, and the point of discussion (off-topic, though it is) was not "surviving a gank," but "dominating in PvP." Just FYI.


Who the hell shoots mining barges in catalysts in low sec? You know you meant suicide ganks, but nice try.

Who said lowsec? Are you even reading these posts before you reply?
Asia Leigh
Kenshin Industries.
Kenshin Shogunate.
#276 - 2014-04-11 08:00:33 UTC
Karak Kashada wrote:

Who said lowsec? Are you even reading these posts before you reply?


Well then you meant high sec ganks so my original statement stands. The player skill in that type of engagement is to avoid the engagement all together and isn't all that hard... Wtf does dominating PVP have to do in that scenario... You only make yourself seem more foolish each time you post...
Apply the damn rules equally >.>
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
Sedition.
#277 - 2014-04-11 08:03:58 UTC  |  Edited by: PotatoOverdose
Karak Kashada wrote:

PotatoOverdose wrote:
You do not need to "wait to play".
That is true only under certain conditions. As is my point.

Then maybe that should have been the title of this thread: "EVE: the Game you Wait to Play if certain particular conditions are met." Maybe you should go and change the "wait to play" line every time it pops up in the original post. Also, I do believe the author can change the title of the thread. You should look into that.

Wouldn't want anyone getting confused over a simple misunderstanding, would we? Twisted

Karak Kashada wrote:

PotatoOverdose wrote:
Player skill, not SP, not T2, does in fact dominate pvp in Eve. I assert this, and I support it not with "hypotheticals", but with fact.
Gee whiz. If only someone would tell this to highsec miners. They would be encouraged to know that all they need to dominate those three Catalysts blasting holes in their hull is a little bit o' "player skill." If they only knew it were so easy. Oh... you weren't talking about mining vessels, were you. You were talking about cargo ships. Roll

Don't put words in my mouth. What I said about player skill is as true for mining ships as it is for any other.
Example. The miners accounted for 32.5% of total damage.
Another Example. All you need is a little damage to kill them before they kill you.

And those were just two examples from the last 100 kills involving catalysts TODAY.

Karak Kashada wrote:

Good deal. Care to substantiate that with something other than your "personal guarantee"? I mean, you have all the evidence for the other points... Youtube vids and killboards, etc. No hypotheticals, remember. That's for us noobs.

I would be happy to. Is there a particular T3 setup for which you'd like me to find a T1 counterpart that will do the same job? Or should I just pick one at random?
Karak Kashada
Silver Talon
#278 - 2014-04-11 08:05:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Karak Kashada
Asia Leigh wrote:
Well then you meant high sec ganks so my original statement stands.
Whether or not the point stands, your post diverted from the point being discussed. And while in-game lingo allows for a distinction between a lowsec attack and a highsec suicide gank, I have news for you... it's all ships blowing holes in other ships. Don't distract from the point by throwing pebbles.
Asia Leigh wrote:
The player skill in that type of engagement is to avoid the engagement all together and isn't all that hard... Wtf does dominating PVP have to do in that scenario...
Beats me. Ask PotatoMan here. It's his idea. If you disagree with it, take it up with him.
Asia Leigh wrote:
You only make yourself seem more foolish each time you post...

That's funny, I was thinking the same thing about you. Gosh. It's nice to have friends online, isn't it.
Karak Kashada
Silver Talon
#279 - 2014-04-11 08:08:15 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:
I would be happy to. Is there a particular T3 setup for which you'd like me to find a T1 counterpart that will do the same job? Or should I just pick one at random?

Oh, do yourself proud. Choose something impressive. Let's see something clearly designed for a T3 pilot being done by a T1 pilot. I will prepare to be impressed!
Big Lynx
#280 - 2014-04-11 08:11:29 UTC
Karak Kashada wrote:

That's funny, I was thinking the same thing about you. Gosh. It's nice to have friends online, isn't it.


Are you Gevlon or Lukas Kell's alt? just curious, because of your narrow minded verbal diarrhea.