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Why would anyone ever use Beams in PvP?

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Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#21 - 2014-04-06 20:58:52 UTC
Tarmaniel wrote:
Why are you ruling out Tachyons? Railguns are pretty much strictly superior to beam lasers on both medium and large platforms. The Zealot is the only good platform to put beams on because there's no HAC rail platform with damage, damage, range bonuses.

Rail Astarte does more DPS at greater range with one less damage mod than a beam Absolution. Also, did you know the Astarte gets 2000 more base armor than the Absolution, as well as more shield and structure? If you fit the same tank to both ships, they have the same EHP despite the Absolution's armor resistance bonus.

Tachyon Apocalypse and Abaddon are just hilarious jokes compared to rail Mega and Hyperion.

Apocalypse needs a RCU and faction hardeners to fit 8 Tachyons, MWD, two plates, DCU, medium injector, tracking computer, and three hardeners. Megathron can fit a full rack of rails and the same tank with no fitting mods and nothing but T2 mods, then still put a damage mod and 0 CPU adaptive nano plating in the last two low slots. This lets it have 20% more EHP than the Apoc, and have the same range and 20% more DPS with Plutonium than the Apoc with multifrequency.

Hyperion completely wastes a bonus, but can still set up to have 10% more DPS in exchange for 10% less EHP at the same range than the Abaddon, and of course it doesn't need an injector just to run its guns.

TL;DR - Lasers suck something awful unless you're got Scorch M loaded.


Deimos has a double damage bonus and a range bonus. The reason the Zealot is better is tank. Also the ishtar is better than both.

Beam abso significantly outperforms a rail astarte in everything but range and theoretical dps. The tank difference is quite significant, you don't get the same tank on both, stop being bad.

I stopped reading after that because you are clearly quite bad and the rest of your post is hardly better..


BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Tarmaniel
State War Academy
Caldari State
#22 - 2014-04-06 21:45:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Tarmaniel
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
Deimos has a double damage bonus and a range bonus. The reason the Zealot is better is tank. Also the ishtar is better than both.

Beam abso significantly outperforms a rail astarte in everything but range and theoretical dps. The tank difference is quite significant, you don't get the same tank on both, stop being bad.

I stopped reading after that because you are clearly quite bad and the rest of your post is hardly better..




Deimos gets a falloff bonus, not an optimal bonus. Obviously, the optimal bonus is way better. Yeah the Ishtar is better than both, but that's not this thread.

EDIT - Ugh, you got me. I had the wrong damage type selected when I ran the numbers. Of course Astarte looks similar when you have it set to kin/therm :\ The points about battleships still apply, though.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#23 - 2014-04-06 22:43:05 UTC
Tarmaniel wrote:
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
Deimos has a double damage bonus and a range bonus. The reason the Zealot is better is tank. Also the ishtar is better than both.

Beam abso significantly outperforms a rail astarte in everything but range and theoretical dps. The tank difference is quite significant, you don't get the same tank on both, stop being bad.

I stopped reading after that because you are clearly quite bad and the rest of your post is hardly better..




Deimos gets a falloff bonus, not an optimal bonus. Obviously, the optimal bonus is way better. Yeah the Ishtar is better than both, but that's not this thread.

EDIT - Ugh, you got me. I had the wrong damage type selected when I ran the numbers. Of course Astarte looks similar when you have it set to kin/therm :\ The points about battleships still apply, though.



The baddon is still the obvious choice due to tank.

But i'm a fan of the rail mega myself so i won't argue that. Also yes Optimal bonuses would be better than a falloff bonus but its still a rather significant range bonus.

You are reasonable, i promote you from bad to acceptable.

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

GreenSeed
#24 - 2014-04-07 00:12:46 UTC  |  Edited by: GreenSeed
absolution is king, as said before. but beams only work in a proper fleet, or a crap one with long webs.

still, having one or two viable beam platforms is no excuse not to have a proper T2 Short range Beam ammo. otherwise Scorch will continue to be non negotiable anywhere outside of a fleet.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#25 - 2014-04-07 00:51:28 UTC
GreenSeed wrote:
absolution is king, as said before. but beams only work in a proper fleet, or a crap one with long webs.

still, having one or two viable beam platforms is no excuse not to have a proper T2 Short range Beam ammo. otherwise Scorch will continue to be non negotiable anywhere outside of a fleet.


I think the flaws on t2 long range ammo is great.

I think t2 short range ammo should be made like that not vice versa. Scorch/null/ has waaaay too few drawbacks.

(i mean long range guns btw)

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Danny John-Peter
Blue Canary
Watch This
#26 - 2014-04-07 13:54:24 UTC
Snuff uses beam Absos these days, when properly supported they are superior to Pulses on non range-bonused hulls.

Rail Astartes do better DPS than them yes but they tank really ****, so yeah, you can't do DPS when you are dead.
RcTamiya Leontis
Magister Mortalis.
#27 - 2014-04-07 17:07:13 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
RcTamiya Leontis wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Because sniping combat was massively nerfed since probign became so easy and fast. Now beign able to fire from further than 150 km is not important anymore.



Defensive bubbles, ever heard of them ?


covops warpins, bombers and MJDs, ever heard of them?



well setup defensive bubbles wont allow covops warpins, even if the hostiles bounce, bombing runs are a danger, yes but this is the issue for most likely all nonheavytanked fleets, however 00 alliances usually have several fleets working together.
Perkin Warbeck
Higher Than Everest
#28 - 2014-04-10 10:09:45 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
Perkin Warbeck wrote:
Danny John-Peter wrote:
Perkin Warbeck wrote:
Because beam Coercers can never die. Fact.


http://kb.snuffboxcorp.com/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=91002

M8, I dispute your assertions.


Doesn't link to any kill mail I can see. The defence rests.


Copy it to your browser instead of clicking the link you scrub


Why the f**k would you fake a killmail? What is wrong with you people.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#29 - 2014-04-10 10:48:17 UTC
Perkin Warbeck wrote:
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
Perkin Warbeck wrote:
Danny John-Peter wrote:
Perkin Warbeck wrote:
Because beam Coercers can never die. Fact.


http://kb.snuffboxcorp.com/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=91002

M8, I dispute your assertions.


Doesn't link to any kill mail I can see. The defence rests.


Copy it to your browser instead of clicking the link you scrub


Why the f**k would you fake a killmail? What is wrong with you people.


0/10

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

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