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Remove stargates and high sec!
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Precentor Saggitus
Planet Express Transport
#21 - 2014-04-07 18:01:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Precentor Saggitus
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:
I'm still new to eve so would appreciate an explanation of why hisec is more profitable than lo and null, and how the refining changes etc aren't nerfing hisec in favour of losec and null.


Its not more profitable. It never has been for as long as I've been playing. It merely has somewhat less risk. Low risk, low reward. How profitable it is has been nerfed (for example there are less sources of the rare minerals in high sec than before) but not to a level where its completely worthless, nor should it be.

Quote:
I think people are moving to hisec more because they dislike flying in losec or null rather than for the profit.


Several things behind this I figure. First is more new players joining, and old players leaving. Lots of my null sec corp mates have left the game. this is typical of any MMO. Null sec sometimes seems pretty static as well. There's not a lot of room for new factions to muscle in. After all, how long have some of the current holders held their territory? Either way, don't matter, that's just how the game emerges.

Aglais wrote:
This isn't reasonable at all, unless ships cost roughly nothing and are easily replaceable. For a veteran player, this describes most T1 frigates. For people who are starting, this means they're stuck being killed in rookie ships until they decide to quit the game, because the game mechanics prevent them from getting a leg up on the competition at all. It does nothing more than solidify a hierarchy that discourages emergent content creation.



Exactly. Lots of veteran players don't seem to remember how daunting EVE can be to a new player. Especailly with the mechanics of EVE. One should keep in mind that due to all of the criminal playstyles that are valid gameplay in EVE, old players need to be wary of new characters and the learning curve is steep enough that newb players are going to do a lot of losing ships in the process and need somewhat of means of earning isk before one gets a leg in the door of the more profitable realms of EVE play. You can't expect that they always fall back to ratting or mining in a rookie frig to earn ISK. Who really believes that would be fun for everyone.

For me I figure my ISK generating capability would sustain a daily T1 cruiser loss, but I only have that ISK generating capability with the ability to risk better ships than that on other ventures, since I also have built up enoug of a buffer as it were to sustain a short time weekly BS, T2 loss as well. The lessons in making sure one's own logistical capabilities remain is one even many veteran player out there don't sometimes appreciate enough. I'm not sure how one could expect a new player to get it right off the start.

Few people understand the psycology of a highway traffic cop. Your average speeder will panic and immediately pull over to the side. This is wrong. It arouses contempt in the cop heart. Make the bastard chase you. He will follow.
Cloak n'all
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#22 - 2014-04-07 19:16:16 UTC
Samillian wrote:
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
W·T·F·?


I concur.

Seconded...
Cloak n'all
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#23 - 2014-04-07 19:33:50 UTC
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:
Stargates are required to hurl your ship across vast tracts of space. Removing hisec would simply cripple industry and totally cripple new players ...pay for concord? How would new players do this?

Hisec is already being nerfed repeatedly and really doesn't need any more. The new stargates that have ben mentioned will hopefully open up new areas of space to explore/pilfer/conquer for all soon...

Where have you seen CCP say there making new star gates?
Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#24 - 2014-04-07 20:14:46 UTC
Precentor Saggitus wrote:
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:
I'm still new to eve so would appreciate an explanation of why hisec is more profitable than lo and null, and how the refining changes etc aren't nerfing hisec in favour of losec and null.


Its not more profitable. It never has been for as long as I've been playing. It merely has somewhat less risk. Low risk, low reward. How profitable it is has been nerfed (for example there are less sources of the rare minerals in high sec than before) but not to a level where its completely worthless, nor should it be.

Quote:
I think people are moving to hisec more because they dislike flying in losec or null rather than for the profit.


Several things behind this I figure. First is more new players joining, and old players leaving. Lots of my null sec corp mates have left the game. this is typical of any MMO. Null sec sometimes seems pretty static as well. There's not a lot of room for new factions to muscle in. After all, how long have some of the current holders held their territory? Either way, don't matter, that's just how the game emerges.

Medalyn Isis wrote:
This isn't reasonable at all, unless ships cost roughly nothing and are easily replaceable. For a veteran player, this describes most T1 frigates. For people who are starting, this means they're stuck being killed in rookie ships until they decide to quit the game, because the game mechanics prevent them from getting a leg up on the competition at all. It does nothing more than solidify a hierarchy that discourages emergent content creation.



Exactly. Lots of veteran players don't seem to remember how daunting EVE can be to a new player. Especailly with the mechanics of EVE. One should keep in mind that due to all of the criminal playstyles that are valid gameplay in EVE, old players need to be wary of new characters and the learning curve is steep enough that newb players are going to do a lot of losing ships in the process and need somewhat of means of earning isk before one gets a leg in the door of the more profitable realms of EVE play. You can't expect that they always fall back to ratting or mining in a rookie frig to earn ISK. Who really believes that would be fun for everyone.

For me I figure my ISK generating capability would sustain a daily T1 cruiser loss, but I only have that ISK generating capability with the ability to risk better ships than that on other ventures, since I also have built up enoug of a buffer as it were to sustain a short time weekly BS, T2 loss as well. The lessons in making sure one's own logistical capabilities remain is one even many veteran player out there don't sometimes appreciate enough. I'm not sure how one could expect a new player to get it right off the start.

You have your quotes mixed up. I did not say that.
Precentor Saggitus
Planet Express Transport
#25 - 2014-04-08 00:15:50 UTC
My bad. Fixed.

Few people understand the psycology of a highway traffic cop. Your average speeder will panic and immediately pull over to the side. This is wrong. It arouses contempt in the cop heart. Make the bastard chase you. He will follow.
Egravant Alduin
Ascendance Rising
Ascendance..
#26 - 2014-04-08 12:12:55 UTC
The general idea is for everybody to be able to explore whole space high sec,low sec,null sec and have fun not afraid everything except high sec.Stargates are preventing you cause people are afraid of gate camps .In my opinion there should only be a few stargates for some distant places to reach each other and nothing more.Stargates and systems restrictions really limit the space frontiers.

Feel the wrath of the GECKO!
Zintex
Dead Council's Revenge
Askaantiuul Logistics
#27 - 2014-04-08 12:20:04 UTC
Cloak n'all wrote:
Samillian wrote:
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
W·T·F·?


I concur.

Seconded...


third ... removing the stargate's will never happen..
the only thing i can think of they might do is change how they work..
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2014-04-08 12:23:54 UTC
If you want to skip stargates the use WH's to travel around. The stargates are required as they link the fixed WH between systems. Ships simply don't have the power required to warp the distance between planets in any reasonable time. The gate building ships that create new gate pairs still use a WH to jump through and then fix it in place at the other end as far as I know.

Rather than removing the current (and working) sec system I wouldn't be averse to opening up deep space around systems beyond CONDORD patrol perimeters. The ability to anchor deep space stations fromed from mobile deployables at scanned down langrange points could be fun.
Egravant Alduin
Ascendance Rising
Ascendance..
#29 - 2014-04-08 17:04:37 UTC
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:
If you want to skip stargates the use WH's to travel around. The stargates are required as they link the fixed WH between systems. Ships simply don't have the power required to warp the distance between planets in any reasonable time. The gate building ships that create new gate pairs still use a WH to jump through and then fix it in place at the other end as far as I know.

Rather than removing the current (and working) sec system I wouldn't be averse to opening up deep space around systems beyond CONDORD patrol perimeters. The ability to anchor deep space stations fromed from mobile deployables at scanned down langrange points could be fun.


They can make ships have more power to travel with their own jump systems.Maybe smaller ships have less power to do that and need someone to travel them as the logic and sci fi themes general say.

Feel the wrath of the GECKO!
Bane Nucleus
Dark Venture Corporation
Kitchen Sinkhole
#30 - 2014-04-08 17:15:01 UTC
To the OP,:

Being a good troll is an art. As it stands, you have about as much artistic skill as a guy holding a paintbrush while having a seizure.

0/10.

No trolling please
Egravant Alduin
Ascendance Rising
Ascendance..
#31 - 2014-04-08 17:29:16 UTC
Bane Nucleus wrote:
To the OP,:

Being a good troll is an art. As it stands, you have about as much artistic skill as a guy holding a paintbrush while having a seizure.

0/10.


If you don t like something you can simply say it or say your opinion.Else please don't post and trying to destroy someone's post's.

Feel the wrath of the GECKO!
nia starstryder
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#32 - 2014-04-08 19:19:23 UTC
heres the big problem, (didn't read it all to see if someone one else said it) NOT EVERYONE ONES PVP 100% OF THE TIME.

some people don't want pvp at all, some people wants it half the time.

Most of the materials used by pvp are made in high sec. take away that and you will have to do your own mining and manufacturing. Most people that want to do pvp all the time don't want to take that time.

So getting rid of high sec will get rid of most of the ammo and weapons plus the ships you need.

this will make it too boring for those that want to pvp all the time and those that don't will find themselves doing combat too often to worth the risk, so they will quit.

end result, gave over.
Egravant Alduin
Ascendance Rising
Ascendance..
#33 - 2014-04-08 19:36:05 UTC
nia starstryder wrote:
heres the big problem, (didn't read it all to see if someone one else said it) NOT EVERYONE ONES PVP 100% OF THE TIME.

some people don't want pvp at all, some people wants it half the time.

Most of the materials used by pvp are made in high sec. take away that and you will have to do your own mining and manufacturing. Most people that want to do pvp all the time don't want to take that time.

So getting rid of high sec will get rid of most of the ammo and weapons plus the ships you need.

this will make it too boring for those that want to pvp all the time and those that don't will find themselves doing combat too often to worth the risk, so they will quit.

end result, gave over.


Agree on that but still there should be some more freedom in space since it s space and in current state it's too limited from stargates.

Feel the wrath of the GECKO!
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