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CSM Feedback to CCP

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The Lobsters
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#161 - 2014-03-30 15:51:20 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
*Snip* Please refrain from personal attacks. ISD Ezwal.

#2 obviously, but the other choices render that somewhat meaningless

That man is the noblest creature may be inferred from the fact that no other creature has contested his claim.
The Lobsters
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#162 - 2014-03-30 16:10:59 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
Ramona McCandless wrote:
2

I dont even know why this needs to be said really


I agree wholehearlty. I don't see the point of this thread or why I would invent 2 other options.

*Snip* Please refrain from personal attacks. ISD Ezwal.

That man is the noblest creature may be inferred from the fact that no other creature has contested his claim.
Beta Maoye
#163 - 2014-03-30 16:38:38 UTC
Option 2. It has been working for 10 years. It will work in the next 10 years. I believed 90% of players are mature persons and they care about other's well-being. No need to change the rules because of isolated case.
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#164 - 2014-03-30 21:05:50 UTC
if they go with no. 1 i am in trouble.

2 albeit not the perfect solution is the only workable one.

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Eric Stratton
Sanxing Yi
#165 - 2014-03-30 22:07:01 UTC
I wish something approaching #3 was possible, but realistically #2 is the best we can get in a game that anyone from the public can join. I am another one of those people who does not engage in any particularly grief-y behavior, but like the vibe of danger and harshness that Eve provides. When a person manages to lose it emotionally over what happens to them regarding this game, and that means it needs to be dialed back, I wish there was a magical way that instead of people needing to dial it back, we could have a player base where everyone involved could handle it. I know that isn't realistic, of course, hence why #2 is the best we can hope for in the real world.
Drakast
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#166 - 2014-03-30 23:17:37 UTC
option 1 and option 3 are extremes that wont work ( you knew that when you wrote them though)

leaving only option 2 as the sensible decision.

CCP handled this incident in the best way.

it wasnt the popular way for all the freaks who enjoy going to far.

but i am happy and one more creepy freak is banned.

keep it up ccp
Zeee Orlenard
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#167 - 2014-03-30 23:25:28 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
Malcanis wrote:

In other to get some actual numbers into the discussion, please can you select from one of the following three options for the CSM to present to CCP as the opinion of the community.:

(1) CCP should define abuse and harrassment at the lowest level possible so that essentially any potentially offensive communication is deemed unacceptable, and everyone has a clear idea of where the line is: don't say anything bad at all to another player. This is the choice of virtually every MMO in the game industry.

(2) CCP should continue with the status quo, and trust the members of the EVE community to have the adult intelligence and humanity to exercise discretion in how far they can take their communication with other players. And having exercised that discretion, to also be aware that we're all members of the game community and that while every kind of in-game space-villainy is legitimate, we're all actual human beings behind the screen and we should be careful with our out of game actions to each other. This option is, so far as I am aware, unique to CCP and EVE; if other MMOs place this level of trust and faith in their players I am unaware of them.


Somewhere between option 1 and 2 is necessary.

*Snip* Removed off topic part of the post. ISD Ezwal.
Berendas
Ascendant Operations
#168 - 2014-03-31 00:21:17 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
*Snip* Removed off topic part of the post. ISD Ezwal.

Option 1 would be devastatingly corrosive to EVE's long term well being. Our universe has grown to be cold and unforgiving, and that's been the selling point for many a new player to EVE. Making New Eden a 'nicer' place would take away one of EVE's most defining characteristics.

Previously, I would have immediately endorsed option 2. However, in the wake of Erotica 1's assumed banning, I do not feel that CCP went by Malcanis's wording of option 2. To my mind they interfered where it was not necessary and their actions fell somewhere between options 1 and 2. To me, this middle ground is a dangerous position because players are left with too much guesswork as to what is acceptable.

I'm not so naive as to support CCP's tolerance of illegal behavior as option 3 suggests. However, for a company whose employees put out a song called HTFU, CCP's recent action too much resembles the hand-holding that makes the rest of the MMO market so bland.

TLDR: Option 2, but make it 'harsher' and allow for more freedom of player behavior.
Deka Ekato
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#169 - 2014-03-31 01:24:56 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
Personally I choose Option 2, with some added points, *Snip* Removed off topic part of the post. ISD Ezwal.

These points can go something along the following lines :-

- Using in game mechanics to PVP / interact with others is acceptable
- Griefing players in / out of game is not acceptable
- Someting about not abusing the petition system concerning Griefing, ( I don't know how to put this coherantly ).

*Snip* Removed off topic part of the post. ISD Ezwal.
Khimes Quds
Eclipse Pulsar
Fraternity.
#170 - 2014-03-31 06:14:27 UTC
2
Talia Prime
Imperial Militia
#171 - 2014-03-31 07:51:20 UTC
The 2nd option, but with an investigation if the line is crossed severely. Then a community vote as to whether the participants should be banned.

Option 1, wtf? This is Eve, too draconian.

Option 3, lovely thought, but potentially damaging to my favourite game. So, no.
Khergit Deserters
Crom's Angels
#172 - 2014-03-31 14:56:25 UTC
(2)
Desivo Delta Visseroff
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#173 - 2014-03-31 18:05:46 UTC
Malcanis wrote:


(2) CCP should continue with the status quo, and trust the members of the EVE community to have the adult intelligence and humanity to exercise discretion in how far they can take their communication with other players. And having exercised that discretion, to also be aware that we're all members of the game community and that while every kind of in-game space-villainy is legitimate, we're all actual human beings behind the screen and we should be careful with our out of game actions to each other. This option is, so far as I am aware, unique to CCP and EVE; if other MMOs place this level of trust and faith in their players I am unaware of them.



I support this action.

I was hunting for sick loot, but all I could get my hands on were 50 corpses[:|]..............[:=d]
Faceless Parmala
State War Academy
Caldari State
#174 - 2014-03-31 18:31:51 UTC
2 is good
Soltys
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#175 - 2014-03-31 22:05:12 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
Quote:
(3) CCP should stand back and allow without comment the members of the community complete free reign in using CCP's IP and property to engage in and facilitate whatever activities they desire, regardless of damage done and regardless of the clear trend of escalating unpleasantness. This option, so far as I am aware, is not available anywhere and may in fact contravene the laws of quite a few nations including several which comprise large sections of the EVE playerbase.


This. And only this, considering recent bannings *Snip* Removed off topic part of the post. ISD Ezwal.

Jita Flipping Inc.: Kovl & Kuvl
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation
The Honda Accord
#176 - 2014-03-31 22:30:34 UTC
So #1 would have a variety of benefits, new folks would know where the lines are and we'd be consistent with other games. Also if I could have a unicorn that crapped out gold that would be great too. Both things are as likely as Eve being like other games and me finding that single horned horse to retire with.

Eve only works with #2. Hard to draw the line in a game that challenges you to find new ways to mess with all the other players. The line would have to be "actions not possible within the current bounds of the laws of physics are possibly discouraged by CCP, such actions may or may not result in actions by CCP against someone, such someone(s) will be at CCP discression".

Mostly what happens in Eve stays in Eve and when it really doesn't CCP should expect to be asked by the community to act. But its up to them after that.

Issler
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#177 - 2014-03-31 23:49:28 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
*Snip* Removed off topic part of the post. ISD Ezwal.
For what it's worth, obviously #2.

Option 3 is impractical, on several different levels.

Option 1 would eventually kill EVE.

This is a game about social interaction. Putting it under a microscope with no room for personal judgement or ability to take the situation into account on CCP's part would ultimately turn the game into a bad mining simulator... robbing it of the rich chaos that has kept it thriving for over 10 years.

Hell, you wouldn't even be able to "shudder" role play a villain (let alone actually act like one) without risking the ban hammer... that's how pathetic this course of action would be.

If I wanted to play a safe vanilla game, where I'm wrapped in the warm snuggely cocoon (straight jacket) of mindless completely safe social interaction and controlled game play I'd go play one of the hundreds available to me... and if you thought about it for more than 2 seconds you'd realize that if CCP did go that route, you'd be gone within 3 months.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#178 - 2014-03-31 23:52:32 UTC
Something between 2 and 3, closer to 2.

CCP should intervene against real life threats of physical violence, implied and actual serious harrassment. CCP should also intervene where people don't do this themselves, but actively incite others to do so. Examples: Mitten's fanfest outburst (inciting serious RL harassment), the threats of RL physical violence aimed at Erotica 1 this week, and people posting the worst racial slurs in in-game chat.

CCP should not intervene against things that are nasty but not out-of-game harassment, except perhaps with a 'Stop this or we'll ban you'.

Consistency is important. CCP must not be arbitrary or change enforcement in response to hyperbolic accusations using words like 'torture'.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com
Plug in Baby
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#179 - 2014-04-01 00:15:23 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
1 or 3.

*Snip* Removed off topic part of the post. ISD Ezwal.

This is not a forum alt, this is a forum main.
Kiryen O'Bannon
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#180 - 2014-04-01 15:46:59 UTC
Option 2. The other options are stated in such extreme terms that they are untenble, and do not represent a realistic basis for discussion. Option 1 is not actually what other MMOs do; they do not attempt to police every subjective offense taken by any given player but rather go with a commonly-accepted standard of what is offensive.

Eternal Father, King of birth, /Who didst create the heaven and earth, /And bid the planets and the sun/ Their own appointed orbits run; /O hear us when we seek thy grace /For those who soar through outer space.