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Breaking News - Ishukone meets with Gallente Senate on Caldari Prime
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Angelo Jovakko
Ishukone Overwatch
#61 - 2014-03-21 07:45:56 UTC
I'm grateful that at least Ishukone CEO Mens Reppola and Ishukone as a whole have a vision of peace and prosperity in comparison to Kaalakiota and Lai Dai that only have the shortsightedness of pettiness and greed. They're too shortsighted to see that Ishukone is taking steps to help our brothers on Caldari Prime.
Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Doomheim
#62 - 2014-03-21 08:07:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Stitcher wrote:
Gesakaarin-haani, the option you don't appear to be giving due consideration to is that perhaps Ishukone genuinely believes that the course they are charting is in the State's best interests, and that attempting to secure consensus and popular support would only result in damaging delays and harm to the Caldari people and their interests.

Unilateral action is not necessarily sinister, and maverick decisions are not necessarily unwise. Mens Reppola-haan is CEO of one of the Big 8: He earned the position on merit and thus far has done nothing substantial to evidence that he is incapable of living up to that responsibility, and much to evidence that he can and is.

I do not know (though I do trust) that Ishukone's actions are in the State's best interests... but I certainly don't think that veiled musings which stop just shy of being accusations are.


Hakatain-haan while I can respect your thought and opinion in this matter all I will say is that all the good intentions in the cluster are for naught if there is a failure in execution. What use are the good intentions of peace with the Federation if in executing them through unilateral actions of their own accord Ishukone manages affront and insult to the other members of the CEP at the very least, let alone the companies of the wider State, in making plain their disinterest in dialogue or consensus with fellow Caldari? If the perception becomes that Ishukone has turned their backs to the CEP and the Caldari people how can peace be accomplished when they have managed to deliver the metaphorical slap to the face of corporate leadership due to as you described, the maverick decisions of Chief Executive Reppola?

Ishukone is only one among Eight on the CEP and I believe the cause of peace has been ill-served because in undertaking unilateral actions with the Federation, it appears Chief Executive Reppola has managed to potentially generate enough disapproval and insult among its members that the necessary quorom to effect a peace or in the least a cessation or truce to armed hostilities with the Federation is made more difficult, not less so. For when it becomes a matter of not only personal honour among the leaders of the CEP but corporate pride due to the actions of Ishukone in having engendered the feelings of mistrust and hostility across the State then I can only remark that we were more than willing to fight and shed blood against the Federation for a century to preserve the honour, pride, and dignity of the Caldari people.

I can only think this as an unfortunate state of affairs for I at least believe peace more beneficial for the State at present if only I can see the pragmatic necessities of further economic decoupling from the Amarr Empire to prevent another domestic recession due to rift Trade Agreements and administrative mismanagement such under the Chamberlain Karsoth; a diversification and increase of foreign exports to the Republic, Federation, Kingdom, and Syndicate to ensure the robustness of Caldari corporate profitability to the benefit of their employees; and the amelioration of credit-risk exposure to CFU in particular but also to Kaalakiota, Lai Dai, and Wiyrkomi in underwriting the current war.

Kurilaivonen|Concern
Agiri Falken
Akagi Initiative
#63 - 2014-03-21 08:31:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Agiri Falken
So... Some of you seem to think you want to know why things are being kept opaque... Alright, I'll extrapolate as best I can, both from my experience in sensitive operations, and my experience as a citizen of Ishukone. The first part is just business... The second is a lot more personal. You won't like it.

From the standpoint of realism, it's simple. Ishukone is the only one of the Okusaikan, to my knowledge, to step forward and offer to talk. I've not heard a thing about Kaalakiota, Lai Dai, or any of the others sending envoys, diplomats, or even considering it. They just sit and *****. Frankly, what the hell makes you think you deserve something you won't help close the deal on?

Second, it really isn't in the best interests of anyone BUT Ishukone to close the deal and sign a treaty. We, by choice, did not gain from the spoils of war. Everyone else did, and would continue to do so if the war goes on. The surest way to keep it going is for Home to remain an object of contention. Think Kaalakiota, or anyone, gets to the top by being the nice guy? You're a damned fool if you do. Sure, we deal on the shady side, and admit it, but I dare you to find one other CEO who was willing to give up their palaces, orgies and drug parties so the people could benefit. Sure as hell wasn't Oiritsuus style. You really think one of the others wouldn't **** this up for you just to keep their profit margin? THATS why it has to remain opaque. Less chance of a foul up.

Now, on to the more personal part of this... Why we don't ******* trust you anymore...

In YC110, this guy named Heth, maybe you've heard of him, came to power. He wasn't chosen by the CEP, or put in power by shareholders... He got in by POPULAR VOTE. Know what they call that? Democracy. The State pulled a Fed, and choked on it. Now, this wasn't too bad at first, if you ignore the riots and other crap, but then came Malkalen... Concerned for their own citizens, the Federation reached out to US, Ishukone, the one Mega who'se leader wasn't kissing Heth's a**, and...

Offered an olive branch. And damn did we pay dearly for trying... And you know what?... In the end, after watching it over, and over, and over, years later, after all the rage turned to ash... That was the act of ONE MAN. One ******* man, not the entire Federation. But who cares about that... What really shaped our views of you backstabbing ***** came after...

It started with Malkalen. That was OUR station. OUR leader... Not just a CEO like that a** Oiritsuu, Gariushi might as well have been a father to us. And we lost him, and tens of thousands of others, on the sacrificial altar. Because we tried. What did you a******* lose? Nothing. Not a Winds damned thing. And yet, you've all got the gall to use Malkalen as YOUR cry for blood. And you had the ******* temerity to do it WHILE YOU WERE TRYING TO RUN US INTO THE GROUND!

Yeah, we sat out the war. We did what Gariushi wanted, to honor a man who has done more for us than the rest of you combined ever will. We accepted that we'd lose out on a golden opportunity for spoils. But that wasn't enough for you. While the carcass of our former headquarters still smoldered, damn near every one of the other Okusaikan were busy turning us into pariahs... WHILE SCREAMING ABOUT OUR LOSS!

You say Caldari Prime is a home for ALL Caldari? Where the hell was THAT sentiment when we had to turn into a black box to protect ourselves from YOU in the State? From our supposed fellow Caldari. We couldn't leave our territories. We had our doors kicked in on a daily ******* basis. I personally had to shoot it out with ******* DRAGONAURS in our own facilities, because we didn't support the popular vote. All of you turned a blind eye, or helped them along, hoping to scoop up what we had after the fact.

You think Heiian compels people to be sheep? You think we should have given everything we had left in the name of the same **** who sold you all out for a shot at taking down the Federation? Hah! That worked out really well, didn't it? And while we're on the subject of Heiian, where in there does it say 'lean on the wounded until they break'? Never once was a hand held out that wasn't a fist. Never once did someone say 'leave them be in their little corner'. Never once did ANY of you stop and think that we'd not only bore the brunt of Noirs betrayal, but now we had to distrust our fellow Caldari, just for the sake of SURVIVAL.

And now... When we would have lost Home, for good... And don't even try and bullshit me. We were DONE in Luminaire. Sure, our boys and girls ripped the guts out of the Federal taskforce. And they kept right on coming. The Feds absorbed the worst we could throw at them, and kept coming. Once we lost orbit, that was it. It was only a matter of time. And who steps up to lay whats left of their pride on the altar, AGAIN... Risking getting hammered, AGAIN... So Caldari Prime can be returned to the Caldari?...

It wasn't Kaalakiota. It wasn't Lai Dai. It wasn't Wyrikomi. It was us. Ishukone.

And all you bastards can do is sit there, hoot, holler, and tell us what we should be doing for you? For two hundred years, we were your countrymen. Your allies. Fellow Caldari. In less than six months, we were your punching bag for five years of hell. We don't owe any of you a Winds damned thing. You turned on us. **** you.

And whats worse... Is that the Federation has been dealing more squarely with us, than any of you have for years. Ancestors help us, out of everyone and everything, they're the closest to allies we have. Because we can't trust you. Not now.

And the sad part is... I know, in my heart, that Mens Reppola will do what Heiian demands, despite all this, and get all of you backstabbing bastards back on the soil of our ancestors. Where I'm sure you'll continue to whine about everything Ishukone never did for you.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#64 - 2014-03-21 09:26:04 UTC
... gods damn.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
TomHorn
Horn Brothers Holdings Inc.
#65 - 2014-03-21 09:56:18 UTC
Reppola gave away the 50% of sovereignty of the homeworld 3 years after it was liberated by Tibus Heth. Reppola criminalized Tibus Heth the liberator. If Ishukone and Reppola, can now fix the mistakes they made in the past then good. Thats all it will be a fixing of their mistakes.

Tread carefully in the city of Arcurio Reppola. For i doubt if all the people are for you.
Saya Ishikari
Ishukone-Raata Technological Research Institute
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#66 - 2014-03-21 09:57:18 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
... gods damn.

When patience departs, only harsh truth remains, it seems.

"At the end of it all, we have only what we've left in our wake to be remembered by." -Kyoko Ishikari, YC 95 - YC 117
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#67 - 2014-03-21 09:58:43 UTC
That and Provist lies on an infinite loop.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Bryen Verrisai
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#68 - 2014-03-21 10:04:48 UTC
That was an impressive (and informative) rant.

It also calls to mind a question I have for any Caldari willing to answer: the State was founded by corporations who felt they were getting a raw deal in the Federation. Theoretically speaking, what would happen if a corporation started to think it was getting a raw deal in the State?
Saya Ishikari
Ishukone-Raata Technological Research Institute
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#69 - 2014-03-21 10:10:26 UTC
Bryen Verrisai wrote:
That was an impressive (and informative) rant.

It also calls to mind a question I have for any Caldari willing to answer: the State was founded by corporations who felt they were getting a raw deal in the Federation. Theoretically speaking, what would happen if a corporation started to think it was getting a raw deal in the State?

That thought actually scares me. There are no precedents.

"At the end of it all, we have only what we've left in our wake to be remembered by." -Kyoko Ishikari, YC 95 - YC 117
Bryen Verrisai
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#70 - 2014-03-21 10:30:24 UTC
Saya Ishikari wrote:

That thought actually scares me.

I completely agree.
Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Doomheim
#71 - 2014-03-21 10:30:57 UTC
Bryen Verrisai wrote:
That was an impressive (and informative) rant.

It also calls to mind a question I have for any Caldari willing to answer: the State was founded by corporations who felt they were getting a raw deal in the Federation. Theoretically speaking, what would happen if a corporation started to think it was getting a raw deal in the State?


I suppose they could enter into unilateral negotiations with the Federal Senate and proceed to secede from the CEP by seeking a Gallentean domicile for their citizens.

Kurilaivonen|Concern
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#72 - 2014-03-21 11:01:46 UTC
Agiri Falken wrote:
What the hell makes you think you deserve something you won't help close the deal on?

The State pulled a Fed, and choked on it.

Gariushi might as well have been a father to us. And we lost him, and tens of thousands of others, on the sacrificial altar. Because we tried. What did you lose? Nothing. Not a Winds damned thing. And yet, you've all got the gall to use Malkalen as YOUR cry for blood. And you had the temerity to do it WHILE YOU WERE TRYING TO RUN US INTO THE GROUND!

on the subject of Heiian, where in there does it say 'lean on the wounded until they break'?

For two hundred years, we were your countrymen. Your allies. Fellow Caldari. In less than six months, we were your punching bag for five years of hell. We don't owe any of you a Winds damned thing. You turned on us.

And whats worse... Is that the Federation has been dealing more squarely with us, than any of you have for years. Ancestors help us, out of everyone and everything, they're the closest to allies we have. Because we can't trust you. Not now.

And the sad part is... I know, in my heart, that Mens Reppola will do what Heiian demands, despite all this, and get all of you backstabbing bastards back on the soil of our ancestors. Where I'm sure you'll continue to whine about everything Ishukone never did for you.


This is, terribly and painfully, exactly how I feel.

I'm glad one of us finally said it, and I'm glad it was you, Falken-ane*. I doubt I could have done even a fourth as good a job.

Mountain top, She screams
the truth: Winds carry her rage
and I resonate.



*Autotrans: Napanii - "sister". Used informally in this context, may denote strong fellow-feeling and solidarity.*

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders
Desiderya
Blue Canary
Watch This
#73 - 2014-03-21 11:20:04 UTC
Makoto Priano wrote:
Pardon, Oniseki-Charantes-haani; I forgot that we were protecting them from backlash due to their collaboration with the Sanshas.


You seem to know more about my folks and my decisions than I do. Nevertheless, if you ladies insist on airing dirty laundry in public be aware that I never leave home without plenty of ammunition.

Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise.
Noden Vorpalstar
The Knights of Polaris
#74 - 2014-03-21 11:59:25 UTC
It is my hope that Ishukone and the elected members of the Senate will be able to successfully lay the ground work for a prosperous and secure peace between both our peoples.

For those who expressed concern about armed escorts, it should be expected and is appropriate to the situation. Remember these negotiations are coming after years of tension and hot conflict. Extremist elements on either side could be awaiting an opportunity to derail further negotiations.

Public Channel:  Polaris-Public Roleplaying Channel:  Gallente Lounge
Ayallah
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#75 - 2014-03-21 12:39:44 UTC
And so as the air-gaps between the megacorps widen, nullsec solidifies, and the Tribes resurge,

...When is the federal elections again?

Goddess of the IGS

As strength goes.
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#76 - 2014-03-21 15:32:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Pieter Tuulinen
Bryen Verrisai wrote:
That was an impressive (and informative) rant.

It also calls to mind a question I have for any Caldari willing to answer: the State was founded by corporations who felt they were getting a raw deal in the Federation. Theoretically speaking, what would happen if a corporation started to think it was getting a raw deal in the State?


Fire.

As much as the birth of the State lies in a tragic misreaction to a cry for freedom, I cannot see the CEP permitting core systems of the State and an eighth of it's patrimony to simply depart in peace. There are some of you who think the departure of Heth was bad? This would be worse and all the more bitter for being infighting.

The sad thing is that Agiri has a point. Ishukone should never have been marginalised in the way that they were. At the very least, the Practicals should have stood back and the rest of the Liberal bloc should have rallied around them. That's the way the system was designed to work and, in this case, it did not. This is why the rule of the Executor was so alien, so ruinous, to the delicately balanced way of life that is the State.

We are designed to be eight players, eternally in opposition to each other, but never at war. Clearly something has broken.

Meanwhile, the one thing that I think Ishukone really does have to sacrifice is this victim complex. People claiming that Reppola got a rough deal under Heth need to remember that Oritsuu had it far worse. He lost some prestige - she lost her freedom. In many ways Kalaakiota suffered the worst, with Heth's policies pushing us to disaster. They also need to remember that when Gariushi tried for peace with the Federation it was the FEDERATION that betrayed him, not Kalaakiota. It wasn't Yanala who rammed a huge ship into Malkalen, it was Noir.

Now is the time for healing and not dissension. Whilst Ishukone is perfectly entitled to their independence perhaps if, just once, they acted within the mainstream of the State, they wouldn't be such outsiders?

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#77 - 2014-03-21 15:40:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Pieter Tuulinen
Stitcher wrote:

This is, terribly and painfully, exactly how I feel.

I'm glad one of us finally said it, and I'm glad it was you, Falken-ane*. I doubt I could have done even a fourth as good a job.

Mountain top, She screams
the truth: Winds carry her rage
and I resonate.


Rage is the truth, and perhaps the problem. The Wind I hear more clearly than all the others is Cold Wind, warning us of what happens when we carry rage inside us to ward us from the snows. Rage has a way of turning everything into fuel for itself and leaving nothing else behind.

Winds howl until truth
turns upon itself and breaks
lost in itself; noise.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#78 - 2014-03-21 16:31:54 UTC
Quote:
perhaps if they acted within the mainstream of the State, they wouldn't be such outsiders?


Would you accept this argument from a schoolyard bully who terrorized the bookish intellectual for being different to the "mainstream" clique? How about the thief who broke into a shop blaming the crime on the store's lax security?

I hold you in higher regard than that, Pieter. You're former police, I would have expected you to understand the invalidity of victim blaming.

Ishukone was wounded, was leaned on, and DIDN'T break. If there were some catastrophic flaw in the corporate culture, if we were doing something wrong, we would have dissolved. Instead, here we are, resurgent. It seems unlikely to me that a corporation mounting such an excellent recovery can be blamed for the hardships it has encountered, survived and even exploited.

Where's this antagonism coming from? What exactly has been done to earn it? Caldari are NOT ruled by the mob and by common opinion. What's "mainstream" has not been and should never be a guiding part of our decision-making process. Instead, corporations should be adept at seeing opportunities which they can turn to their advantage, and adroit at avoiding hazards which appear to be boons.

That's Meritocracy, applied and in action, and Ishukone appears to excel at it. Are we really going to suggest that success and competence are to be condemned if they are not mainstream success and competence? How shallow! Outside-the-box solutions, shrewd action and innovation should be hailed as virtues and examples, not disrespected and used as the excuse to alienate a linchpin of the State.

There is no orthodoxy in success. There is no such thing as heresy in Meritocracy - there are only results. And if the results are delivered, then do not sneer simply because the methods which produced them didn't conform to some arbitrary dogma. That's the Amarrian way, not the Caldari one.

Quote:
The Wind I hear more clearly than all the others is Cold Wind, warning us of what happens when we carry rage inside us to ward us from the snows. Rage has a way of turning everything into fuel for itself and leaving nothing else behind.


Cold Wind himself used rage as a tool where rage was appropriate. To blow away the banners, to freeze over the sigils, to force warring men to huddle together until their will to hate one another was spent and all they could see was how alike they truly were. I'm sure you remember the story.

Anger gets things done - aggression accomplishes what timidity will not. There is such a thing as a good fury, and it is one which burns in our hearts like the reactor at the core of a starship - powering us, driving us, giving us strength and energy to accomplish things, but only because it is contained, controlled.

Anger is a capacitor. You need a steady supply or else you'll never feel motivated to change things. But use too much, and you'll reach your limit and break. Just like a good pilot marshals their resources, expending their capacitor and overheating their modules at the precise moment they will have the best effect, so too is there a time to contain your rage and let it build, and a time to vent it.

Control, that's the important part. The difference between the fire that burns down your house and the fire that cooks your dinner and keeps you warm while the blizzard rips and rampages outside, is that the latter is controlled. Not damped, not absent nor extinguished: it's there, it's hot. It will burn you if you don't respect it. Its objective is not your well-being, fire just does what it does and doesn't care what it burns. But it's better than starving in the cold.

Sail fills with wind, but
The wind is fickle: we need
both sail and tiller.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders
Jurou Yuan
Wolfraam 74
#79 - 2014-03-21 16:46:20 UTC
Look upon me all
See how deep I am ladies
For the hole I lust

You're both nauseating. Is there a venue either of you don't try and peacock?
Claudia Osyn
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#80 - 2014-03-21 16:54:23 UTC
Jurou Yuan wrote:
Look upon me all
See how deep I am ladies
For the hole I lust

You're both nauseating. Is there a venue either of you don't try and peacock?

Where there's an audience....

A little trust goes a long way. The less you use, the further you'll go.