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TDF / Public banlist Dispute Settled.. Thread can be closed.
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Global Bullets
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#41 - 2011-11-13 17:38:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Global Bullets
carmelos53 wrote:
Global u can spin this anyway you want to satisfy whatever pride you have left ... It doesn't bother me^ at all.

Facts still remain: you "unbanned" griefers, people lost their ships in your channel and tdf cleaned up your mess. Take care.


You know i did not want to go any further on this matter here.. I am satisfied with the very well way cozmic cowboy is handeling this manner..

I now have a recorded voice convo of said pilot on kill mail stating facts that his killmail was NOT of wrongfull doing (kill mail even shows that it was not of wrongfull doing its nothing more than sansha on the mail),
As well a chat log of a second pilot being shocked that his mail is used for this....
Both pilots DID NOT send you any mails stating i had anything to do with this... Its completely false accusaions from YOU!
I have the proof man, you dont want it posted here than simply shutt your mouth... Your Overseer has done me right and i respect him, he has and is providing me TRUE JUSTICE.. I suggest you answer his eve-mail and stop trolling this thread as your looking very very bad ATM..

NOBODY LOST ANY SHIP IN MY CHANNEL Everything EVERYSINGLE THING you have said is a FLAT OUT LIE!
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
and it is now being investigated properly.. He may not give you consequence strong enough to my likeing for these actions.. You should have thought that i would convo those pilots with him in private convo long long before you posted their loss mails to what turns out to be the fault of TDF and has nothing to do with us what so ever... If you say one more thing on this manner.. i will be forced to release both the recorded converstaion, as well the Chat logs i have with these said kill mail pilots for the entire public too see....
I know what this is You targeted me, thought you could extort me, unerestimated me.. know this, the weak stay weak and attempt to leech off others while the strong pour salt onto thee......
I remember one time i was grinding Zelda for hours.. Our dog came in the room, bumped the nintendo, no save, screen went dead. The next day I said to my mom, uhm mom the dog ran away!
Killstealing
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#42 - 2011-11-13 17:50:01 UTC
bearfight!
Purpleton Faustron
Doomheim
#43 - 2011-11-13 21:24:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Purpleton Faustron
Carmelos is a total douche as many many people have found out. If you want to have a reasonable conversation about this, talk to Cozmic Cowboy.

Talking to Carmelos is like trying to reason with a small child.
Kaemon Akemi
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#44 - 2011-11-13 23:53:01 UTC
So amidst Global's ranting in 'Risk for Isk', I had pointed out that his grammar is horrible. This is a kick-able offense apparently. All for telling him that leadership is better respected when well spoken.

Pointing to a poorly constructed argument in the forums will not help your case. Most people won't take the time to read it. More flies with honey and all that. It will not help to be so reactionary. I was taking my time to look at the situation from all sides.

Now I just think you are an asshat.

Also, learn to use the quote function properly.
carmelos53
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#45 - 2011-11-14 03:46:40 UTC
Yes you are absolutely right bullets!! I targeted you specifically out of thousands of eve players. I just didn't like your name. I made a giant conspiracy but shh don't tell anyone. Especially agents Mulder and Skully from the FBI... The bureau doesn't like them so much. Oh crap did you see me^ put that tarp over the UFO in Roswell too? Dammit ... Oh well

Hey why are their blacklisted players getting into your channel's fleets? Oh wait... Yup they are. That's right... You unbanned them. Hmm oh well.
hermerdoo
Keep On Trucking Baby
Ligma Grindset
#46 - 2011-11-14 04:35:56 UTC
Interesting read..

Global Bullets
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#47 - 2011-11-14 09:31:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Global Bullets
The question lies where is your evediance of whom is in my fleets sir? everything you have provided thus far is false.
1 of these guys hasnt been onlnine (hibari) to clearify yet, however the other 2 kill mails you posted have nothing to do with me, and this is from their own mouths..
Proof is as shown, unfortunatly at the request of said members, Audio will not be Provdied.. I do respect peoples wishes..

http://freetexthost.com/oealckcqkw <-- 1st my convo with pan thu, I convo him ask a few questions, than i invite him to the private convo with Cozmic Cowboy.

http://freetexthost.com/edluf1lef4 <--- 2nd my convo with WU Phat, I ask questions, than invite him to the private chat with Cozmic Cowboy, myself, and pan thu.

http://freetexthost.com/msv2oasqlt <--- convo amongst myself, cozmic cowboy, pan thu, and wu phat.. led to being on my teamspeak server.

http://freetexthost.com/e1pcl0zux5 <---- a vonvo than followed again with pan thou..


Now whats interesting to me is you posted these peoples kill mails as proof that i did something wrong? you based these allegations off these peoples kill mails? WTF you are now back to square one with WHERE IS THE PROOF THAT I HAVE HAD LOSSES AND THAT I ALLOW PEOPLE TO GRIEVE???

NOTE: I DO NOT have permission to release the recorded conversation over teamspeak.. Thus making it illegal to US law for me to provide it to the public.. sorry guys this will just have to do..
I remember one time i was grinding Zelda for hours.. Our dog came in the room, bumped the nintendo, no save, screen went dead. The next day I said to my mom, uhm mom the dog ran away!
Global Bullets
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#48 - 2011-11-14 09:35:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Global Bullets
So i was able to contact hibari matsumura..
the convo led to show that he is either a good frind of carmelos, or in fact carmelos alt..
screen shot to back up these convo logs are not fake, they are true in their entirety..

Screeny

Chat log from this asshat.
http://freetexthost.com/gy0qsoljhq

Enjoy everyone.. :) the facts are all there.
this guy carmelos is placing people on the banlist with the attempt to recieve isk for their unban...
i dont care who, what, when, where, or why anyone thinks different.
The evidence collected by my own investigations PROVE that this has been a settup..
I remember one time i was grinding Zelda for hours.. Our dog came in the room, bumped the nintendo, no save, screen went dead. The next day I said to my mom, uhm mom the dog ran away!
Global Bullets
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#49 - 2011-11-14 09:36:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Global Bullets
This thread shall remain open while i spam the link to every public incursion chat. Many will skim over it.. many will read the entire thing. I will not stop spamming this link in trade hubs, and chats, untill my name, my corps name, and Deaths rage's name are removed from that banlist. I hope that every single TDF member, and every single person who follows their banlist gets a chance to see that YES the banlist is helpfull, but its also hurtfull and in fact being used for evil..
I remember one time i was grinding Zelda for hours.. Our dog came in the room, bumped the nintendo, no save, screen went dead. The next day I said to my mom, uhm mom the dog ran away!
Global Bullets
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#50 - 2011-11-14 11:18:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Global Bullets
Kaemon Akemi wrote:
So amidst Global's ranting in 'Risk for Isk', I had pointed out that his grammar is horrible. This is a kick-able offense apparently. All for telling him that leadership is better respected when well spoken.

Pointing to a poorly constructed argument in the forums will not help your case. Most people won't take the time to read it. More flies with honey and all that. It will not help to be so reactionary. I was taking my time to look at the situation from all sides.

Now I just think you are an asshat.

Also, learn to use the quote function properly.


#1. I dont care if i look stupid over my spelling and grammer.
#2. I do not spam this link for people to defend me, or for help in the case as you are saying.
#3. I spam this link for people too see for themselves what TDF diplos are doing to good people.
#4. You where kicked because you where asked 3 times to bring it into a private convo.
I remember one time i was grinding Zelda for hours.. Our dog came in the room, bumped the nintendo, no save, screen went dead. The next day I said to my mom, uhm mom the dog ran away!
Ludus Lucrius
WildCards 22nd
#51 - 2011-11-14 13:25:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Ludus Lucrius
Hi

My 5 cents on this :

Facts :
1. "Risk for Isk" allowed or still allows banned pilots on its channel
2. FCs and/or fleet recruiters can pick up pilots from "Risk for Isk" in their fleets (including "red" ones)

It is channel admins responsability to keep its pilots safe. Banlist provides a way to accomplish that goal.It might not be perfect or just at times but it does keep incursion pilots safer. Banlist admins might be overzelous at times but I personnaly think that in this particular case "Act now apoligize later" better serves a purpose than "inocent until proven guilty beyond reasonable doubt".

Now if your channel is ignoring guidelines to keep known "reds" from your channel you are knowingly putting yours and other fleets that are formed by picking pilots from your channel at potential risk.That said even if that caused no ship loss so far getting fleets from your channel still present an unnessesary risk as long as you allow "red" pilots in it.

Further more your recruiters are recruiting pilots from other channels appart your own (most of us do) therefore also indirectly putting at risk pilots from those other channels. One of those channels is TDF community channel which in order to protect its pilots from harm took action and decided to put you and your trusted FCs on banlist.

You were asked to reinburse pilots that lost their ship due to "reds" recruited from your channel.If they were recruited from your channel and that can be proven than my personnal opinion is that is a reasonable request.

But bottom line in my opinion is that you were not banned because of those losses but because of the fact that by ignoring the banlisted pilots your channel present a potential risk for any fleet that dares to recruit pilots from it.


Ludus Lucrius

"No Rest for the Wicked - WildHunt"
Global Bullets
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#52 - 2011-11-15 06:13:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Global Bullets
That certainly is a great fact, ludus, and its completly understood..
BUT, Just like TDF and every other channel out there, we are not all perfect and we make mistakes..
In our case, we had missed some names on the banlist, some corp's, and i was not aware that the "others" category included can flippers.. I was never notified of these "bad people" being in the channel to ban them... a simple, eve mail "hey global theres gop stop in your channel please review your banlist.. thank you" would have been a nice gesture , however nobody mentioned it untill the banlist had our names on it.

I assure everyone in the community, the list has been reviewed with caution, and we are doing our very best keeping all of our pilots as safe as possible.. We at "Risk for Isk" have a strong reputation for not having ship losses in our fleets. We use caution above and beyond that of normal fleets.. We also have rules in place, to insure that even if a red slips into a fleet, we are still as safe as if they where blue... For instance.. when warping between sites, if theres no mention of an afk, and a person dissapears, they are instantly rechecked for an aggression timer "BEFORE" entering the next site..

FC's use the "LOOK AT" alot in our fleets to monitor the activity of Logi pilots.. "watching to see if theu are doing what their jobs are before moving onto sites like OTA's" , we PURPOSLY never start a run with an ota to get a feel for our group unless our fleet is made up of well known or recognised pilots...

So with this information.. I would like to say.. thank you all that supported us, stood up with us...
Everyones comments have been welcomed good or bad, aside from the obvious trolls.
This manner has been resolved, ME, MY CORP, And Deaths Rage have been removed from the banlist...
Thanks everyone for taking the time to read through this thread..
Fly safe pilots, work hard, and get rewarded!
I remember one time i was grinding Zelda for hours.. Our dog came in the room, bumped the nintendo, no save, screen went dead. The next day I said to my mom, uhm mom the dog ran away!
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