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decentralise jita
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Malken
Sleiipniir
#1 - 2014-02-27 09:26:14 UTC
with the current jita situation and the load on jita decentalising the trade wich pulls everyone to jita could be the thing to release the strain.

my suggestion is that make all trades in jita and all systems 1 jump away share market and deliver any order bought to the system/station they are at in that ring of systems.

lets say i am in new caldari and buys something that has been put up for sale in jita 4-4 then i get it delivered to a new caldari station.

that would decentralise the load of the servers alot i think.

☻/ /▌ / \
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2014-02-27 09:35:09 UTC
Bit tricky when one jump from Jita you can be in any of three seperate regional markets.
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#3 - 2014-02-27 09:46:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Alvatore DiMarco
It wouldn't actually change anything. People would still go to Jita because there's no reason not to go to Jita like they always have done.

A long time ago, Yulai used to be the central market hub. The servers were much weaker back then and absolutely could not handle the strain. To alleviate the problem, CCP snapped the jump routes that connected Yulai to all the empires so conveniently. Something lore-wise was made up about fighting counterfeiting and smugglers. The hub moved to Jita, proving to CCP that if there's a way - any way - for there to be a central market hub, one will rise.

If it's interesting to you, Yulai quickly began to decay and is now a ghost town. The market in that system is still centered in the CONCORD Bureau station as it always was, and is still stocked with a few ships and a little ammo, but basically nobody goes there anymore except some macro miners.

The point is that even if you did manage to forcibly dethrone Jita - even if it took something as drastic as snapping gates (it would) - a new central hub would rise somewhere. Probably one jump before Uedama.

FWIW, I would love to see the market decentralized. I would love to see Dodixie return to its former splendor, Hek become the true shining star of Minmatar space and Amarr... well, Amarr's already sorta comparable to Jita so whatever. I would love to see regional markets actually be significantly different from each other (they're not really that different right now) with different prices for the same items and different sorts of things selling better here or there. Unfortunately the reality of things is that it's extremely unlikely without drastic and truly dramatic measures that I doubt CCP would be wise to even consider.

Instead, maybe CCP can restore those snapped jumpgates from so long ago and perhaps we can see the central trade hub move back to Yulai. It would certainly cut down on people having to choose their FW allegiances based on market accessibility and make a lot more sense from a lore point of view (if you care about that).
Lephia DeGrande
Luxembourg Space Union
#4 - 2014-02-27 10:09:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Lephia DeGrande
I prefer Amarr anyways.

BTW. Why not raise some Tax if you sell or buy stuff from other Factions for example, 1% Tax for Amarr Stuff in Caldari Space.

Meet the Mario Kart 8 - Capsuleer Club Cup
Malken
Sleiipniir
#5 - 2014-02-27 10:39:22 UTC
Hasikan Miallok wrote:
Bit tricky when one jump from Jita you can be in any of three seperate regional markets.



that can be fixed by making a brand new jita trade union region for those systems.

☻/ /▌ / \
Malken
Sleiipniir
#6 - 2014-02-27 10:42:10 UTC
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
It wouldn't actually change anything. People would still go to Jita because there's no reason not to go to Jita like they always have done.

A long time ago, Yulai used to be the central market hub. The servers were much weaker back then and absolutely could not handle the strain. To alleviate the problem, CCP snapped the jump routes that connected Yulai to all the empires so conveniently. Something lore-wise was made up about fighting counterfeiting and smugglers. The hub moved to Jita, proving to CCP that if there's a way - any way - for there to be a central market hub, one will rise.

If it's interesting to you, Yulai quickly began to decay and is now a ghost town. The market in that system is still centered in the CONCORD Bureau station as it always was, and is still stocked with a few ships and a little ammo, but basically nobody goes there anymore except some macro miners.

The point is that even if you did manage to forcibly dethrone Jita - even if it took something as drastic as snapping gates (it would) - a new central hub would rise somewhere. Probably one jump before Uedama.

FWIW, I would love to see the market decentralized. I would love to see Dodixie return to its former splendor, Hek become the true shining star of Minmatar space and Amarr... well, Amarr's already sorta comparable to Jita so whatever. I would love to see regional markets actually be significantly different from each other (they're not really that different right now) with different prices for the same items and different sorts of things selling better here or there. Unfortunately the reality of things is that it's extremely unlikely without drastic and truly dramatic measures that I doubt CCP would be wise to even consider.

Instead, maybe CCP can restore those snapped jumpgates from so long ago and perhaps we can see the central trade hub move back to Yulai. It would certainly cut down on people having to choose their FW allegiances based on market accessibility and make a lot more sense from a lore point of view (if you care about that).


it could as people wouldnt have to go all the way in to jita 4-4 to buy the stuff, they could be in maurasi or new caldari and thereby lessen the strain on the jita system itself.

and i would love to be able to do my shopping in yulai as in the olden days.

☻/ /▌ / \
Arh Mezz
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2014-02-27 10:48:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Arh Mezz
i don't really see a problem in jita.

it's perfectly fine for me.

If your argument is that the servers can barely handle 2k people in jita, i say to you that server cpu technologies don't stand still.
Samillian
Angry Mustellid
#8 - 2014-02-27 11:27:37 UTC
In order to decentralise the trade in Jita you have to change peoples desire to use large trade hubs with access to a large volume and diversity of market goods. While there are things that CCP could do to make Jita a poor place for a central market to be situated another would just rise in its place.

NBSI shall be the whole of the Law
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2014-02-27 11:55:52 UTC
Malken wrote:


it could as people wouldnt have to go all the way in to jita 4-4 to buy the stuff, they could be in maurasi or new caldari and thereby lessen the strain on the jita system itself.

and i would love to be able to do my shopping in yulai as in the olden days.



You can buy and sell stuff stuff in Jita from anywhere in region with the right trade skills.

Its moving it that might be an issue, but Red frog will move up to a Billion ISK of stuff at a time one jump out of Jita for just one million ISK.
Malken
Sleiipniir
#10 - 2014-02-27 12:14:14 UTC
Samillian wrote:
In order to decentralise the trade in Jita you have to change peoples desire to use large trade hubs with access to a large volume and diversity of market goods. While there are things that CCP could do to make Jita a poor place for a central market to be situated another would just rise in its place.



thats the issue, if it were changed by snipping routes and such another would just take its place like when yulai were snipped

thats why i thought of having the "jita Region" as a single market not by cutting it off from others but instead dispere the traffic to a single system for trade and instead have same trade accessed and delivered by the "jita trade union" to the station/system you are at in those systems.
wich would make everyone NOT needing to go all the way in to jita to shop and pickup stuff but could instead stop in niyabainen or maurasi for example.

maybe a little brainworm for the dev's to think about as you cannot stop the people to go to the location of the goods to shop but if you make the goods available over a bigger area then the congestions wouldnt be so annoying as the trade would still be centralised there but with spreading the congestion over a bigger area thus alleviating it.

☻/ /▌ / \
Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
#11 - 2014-02-27 13:45:27 UTC
You want to disperse trade?

Make hacking a thing. Let trade warriors bump other orders in their station off the market completely, cancel production and research orders, and in general make secure station services less secure.

I would bet the markets spread to the ends of space as people try and find out of the way corners to set up buisness that wont be immediatly torpedoed by the next guy in line.
Dolorous Tremmens
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2014-02-27 15:51:22 UTC
I don't think merging the markets would work, because iirc Jita gets a special node that's reinforced. I've been in battles where they've used the jita node to try to keep the battle from crashing due to number of players.

The reason, I have heard, is that you can't use multiple nodes for the same system. The amount of people doing the trades and the congestion in Jita local make it unlikely that CCP would want to pack more systems onto the jjita server, which would seem to be required if all trades are to go without a hitch in a linked market.

...and then theres the outposts, jita 4-4 is the place to go to sell, because its the place to go to sell. Tautological, yes, but people sell in that one station in that one system for the convenience of being in one place. I have stuff in all the other stations in jita I probably wont use because I'd have to undock to go get it, and bring it back. Too much of a PITA, and that the same thing that would happen if the market were expanded. Its not that jita is a trade hub, it is just that one station that is the trade hub.

Get some Eve. Make it yours.
Koffin Nail
Vinnell Corporation
#13 - 2014-02-27 16:05:26 UTC
Always gets rejected, but centralized market would fix any problem if it existed. dodixie, jita, amarr, hek, rens. List something for sale in Jita, can be bought in Amarr. Some teleportation sequence if buying from another region with say 1/2 hour delay. Instant if buying from the station. The market manipulators and bots would cry, but would make gameplay more enjoyable.
Zamyslinski
Beach Boys
The Minions.
#14 - 2014-02-27 16:08:26 UTC
Seperate empires with low/null sec problem solved, new trade hubs will emerge
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2014-02-27 16:09:51 UTC
This sounds like yet another good reason to separate the empires with low sec.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
JetStream Drenard
Jerkasaurus Wrecks Inc.
Sedition.
#16 - 2014-02-27 16:16:24 UTC
Zamyslinski wrote:
Seperate empires with low/null sec problem solved, new trade hubs will emerge

perhaps. but it wont stop jump freighters and blockade runners. But it could stop the vast majority of traffic in Jita. It might not create more price variety between hubs, at least with player built items, because the price is generally dependent upon manufacturing costs.

OP, the phenomenon of Jita is emergent gameplay, it should not be stopped with artificially induced market mechanics.
Fereval Kondur
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2014-02-27 16:25:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Fereval Kondur
Koffin Nail wrote:
centralized market would fix any problem if it existed. dodixie, jita, amarr, hek, rens. List something for sale in Jita, can be bought in Amarr. Some teleportation sequence if buying from another region with say 1/2 hour delay. Instant if buying from the station. The market manipulators and bots would cry, but would make gameplay more enjoyable.


Plain and simple Heresy.

I find the idea of highsec empire islands quite interesting however...

Vote for CSM 11!
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#18 - 2014-02-27 16:34:11 UTC
Malken wrote:

my suggestion is that make all trades in jita and all systems 1 jump away share market and deliver any order bought to the system/station they are at in that ring of systems.

lets say i am in new caldari and buys something that has been put up for sale in jita 4-4 then i get it delivered to a new caldari station.


The servers are fine.

Magic mailboxes were proposed just a few days ago and shot down. The answer is no.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.
Mario Putzo
#19 - 2014-02-27 16:45:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Mario Putzo
I made this...you made this...I made this.

This is my suggestion you thief.

And it would solve the issue with Jita if CCP sees it as a problem that is.

edit: You even used my example system.
editedit: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4272357#post4272357
Come on guy.
Malken
Sleiipniir
#20 - 2014-02-27 19:53:42 UTC
Mario Putzo wrote:
I made this...you made this...I made this.

This is my suggestion you thief.

And it would solve the issue with Jita if CCP sees it as a problem that is.

edit: You even used my example system.
editedit: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4272357#post4272357
Come on guy.



actually no i didnt.
i just been stopped at that damn jita gate to many times the last week that i started thinking about it a few times.
i had a similar thought way back when yulai was having problems and crashing.

and calling people thieves for thinking alike isnt smart either, it just shows that maybe the idea has some merit if more people see it as a problem and have similar ideas on fixing it.

and it is obviously a problem when the gates to jita is closed for hours several times a week.

☻/ /▌ / \
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