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Why are some people "afraid" of EvE?

First post
Author
Marsha Mallow
#121 - 2014-02-27 18:18:50 UTC
Divine Entervention wrote:
if you wish to speak with me about ship fittings, please send me an email.

I really really hope you're smarter than you're leading me to believe.
Don't expect helpful responses if you post like this. You clearly have no idea what you are talking about, and if you don't recognise advice when it's been given, it'll rapidly dry up. Even a cursory glance at the top killers on various killboards will demonstrate the popularity of smaller ships for PVP.

Tippia wrote:
Probably the same place I did: stuff every conceivable skill that affects a Titan and any (non-stupid) piece of equipment it can fit into EVEMon and ratchet all of them up to V.

Of course, at that point, it's nowhere near what you'd call a “focused” character, but he did ask for a MAXED one, after all… P
I trade characters so I tend to have different template skill plans on a blank character creator in Evemon for comparison. In reality even titan pilots claiming to be max skilled typically still need some work somewhere, and I suspect a lot of active titan pilots are a work in progress otherwise even long term players would have the ISK before they had a maxed out character.

James Amril-Kesh wrote:
If you start playing EVE, see this awesome expensive skillpoint-intensive ship and tell yourself you're going to gear your entire EVE experience around eventually flying this ship, you've already put yourself off to a bad start. That is absolutely not how you want to approach the game if you want any sort of longevity out of it.
This seems more a reflection of the gear grind mentality of other games, where having the best swag demonstrates your success ingame. I wish CCP would add something to the NPE to counter this mentality but it's unlikely to sink in.

Ripard Teg > For the morons in the room:

Sweets > U can dd my face any day

SKINE DMZ
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#122 - 2014-02-27 18:19:45 UTC
Divine Entervention wrote:
SKINE DMZ wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
SKINE DMZ wrote:
Titans are far from the best ships in eve(there are no best ships think of ships more like rock paper scissors, got to use the right one at the right time), they are tools against other big ships and can transport fleets from one place to another basically. You wouldn't go do anything in a Titan alone, they are only used with fleets so you wouldn't ever train to be in one on your main character.

You are extremely underestimating small ships, I did this too and I'm sure many others and only started flying frigates again a few months back. Within a year of playing you can be fully effective solo in faction warfare for example, winning fights and destroying ships of players who have been playing for longer than 5 years. The older character with lots of skill points will have the majority of their skill points in skills that are not relevant to the fight you will have with them.

People who think they need time to catch up don't understand EVE fully in my opinion, you can create a focused scanner guy right now and be more efficient in scanning than most pilots within just a few months.


Underestimating small ships. Wrong. I've flown in a frigate and been destroyed in 1 second by someone else. Maybe if you want to count target acquisition time, then it's still less than 10 seconds. 1 salvo = obliterated

Trust me, I am right.

If you keep playing you will understand all this by training, not player training and putting things into skill que online but mentally understanding the game, it's such a common mistake.

Here is some frigate PVP to show you anyway: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZIIp342qIY you can fly like this within months.


You heard it here first, folks. A tristan is a t1 frigate. Within MONTHS you'll be able to fly a t1 frigate around and start seeing results! Never mind it's a tier just above the rookie ship!


Try and be that smarter you are talking about, you can fly a tristan today but you won't have the player experience to do what he does for at least a couple of months. That guy has been playing for years and guess what he is flying.. frigates. Different ships different tools, some may take longer than others but you don't understand them so why do you need to fly them? :-)

I disagree

Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#123 - 2014-02-27 18:23:24 UTC
So, the Thread de-generates into a discussion of the viability of Frigs and Cruisers.

Not exactly about being "afraid" of EVE and why anymore is it ???????

Just mechanics bickering, as per usual. Roll Congratz.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882

Victoria Thorne
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#124 - 2014-02-27 18:23:29 UTC
To answer the actual question in the OP, from those friends of mine who tried EVE & did not stay:

One loved the game, but was unwilling to permanently subscribe to any MMO, he stayed for 6 months (he's cheap in RL).
One liked it, but also liked to switch MMO's on occasion, and EVE was too long term of a commitment, in his opinion.
One didn't like how long it took to travel.
Aargolos
Estrale Frontiers
#125 - 2014-02-27 18:24:24 UTC
Sir Jack Falstaff wrote:
As a relatively new player (7 months) I'll venture some guesses.

Sure, some people are going to get frustrated they can't get into capitals or strategic cruisers right away. There's not that much to do about these folks, as instant gratification is not-nor should it be-a feature of Eve

But Eve's intimidating learning curve rewards those who have the patience to stick it out past those first few months when you don't know what the heck is going on, when you start to figure out for yourself how fitting really works, how meta levels work, and a million other things. The slow skill grind is actually a blessing in disguise, I think, as you are forced to fly in frigates and destroyers for at least a little while. You learn how all the basics work, and that's rewarding.

And the importance of a good corp cannot be overstated. It is crucial. If new players don't find a good group of people to fly with, they are going to tire quickly of Eve's PvE content, which is pretty dull and repetitive.

I really don't think it's a matter of intelligence (although we like to congratulate ourselves that it is) but rather of an ability to delay gratification and the good fortune of connecting with like-minded people. Even flying a T1 frigate with no skills can be loads of fun if you're in a good group.



Good post.

I'm going on 4 1/2 or 5 years I thinkShocked and started after much hesitation because of friends who played, and were "forced to mine for their corp" and other "undock-and-die" horror stories. I spent massive amounts of time playing--and dying in fire--and it was hugely frustrating. But also addictive.

Exploding my first Tempest in a lvl 4 when I was scrammed/webbed was painful. Having rolled Matari, I soon found out it would be for a while. But I still had fun. The Hurricane is still one of my favorite ships because you can do almost anything with it. I've left piles of them burning in lowsec, but I have piles more fitted and ready to fly to their deaths again. It's addictive.

EvE is actually great once you get past the first few months. You're right: if you're looking for instant gratification, look somewhere else...that is, if you don't get hooked despite of it. I like the fact I can set a long skill, and not worry about being online every day to click a few buttons, or at odd hours of the night and **** like that. When I'm busy, I set a longer skill and forget about it. Check EveMon while I'm looking at the news/weather/email and forget about it.

4 1/2 years and 94-odd million SP later, I can pretty much fly most sub-caps and do whatever I want. I still prefer small-gang PvP. Usually in my trusty, rusty Hurricane. Logi 5! Have a couple Scimi's, never flown them. What's a T2 laser? I trained them for some reason or another.

Oh right! The fact that after 4 1/2 years and all this training, I've never flown anything that wasn't Matari other than shuttles, and Ishtars. I've got three other races' of ships I can fly but haven't. It'll be like starting all over again, but with more experience in the basics. Probably won't lose a Tengu in a lvl 4, but I'm still pretty bad at EvE so there's always a chance.

From hard-mode to Win-Matar without realizing it, and it's been more beneficial than flying a squid boat from day one. I should probably get a Drake.

Nah!
SKINE DMZ
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#126 - 2014-02-27 18:26:57 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
So, the Thread de-generates into a discussion of the viability of Frigs and Cruisers.

Not exactly about being "afraid" of EVE and why anymore is it ???????

Just mechanics bickering, as per usual. Roll Congratz.

Actually, I believe that is one of the main mis conceptions for new players and why they are afraid of EVE, they don't want to be stuck in small ships when in reality it may be exactly what may be more fun when you realise how slow big ships are, expensive to lose and in general hard to fly well when you're still struggling to understand the basic mechanics surrounding EVE.

I disagree

Aargolos
Estrale Frontiers
#127 - 2014-02-27 18:29:29 UTC
SKINE DMZ wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
So, the Thread de-generates into a discussion of the viability of Frigs and Cruisers.

Not exactly about being "afraid" of EVE and why anymore is it ???????

Just mechanics bickering, as per usual. Roll Congratz.

Actually, I believe that is one of the main mis conceptions for new players and why they are afraid of EVE, they don't want to be stuck in small ships when in reality it may be exactly what may be more fun when you realise how slow big ships are, expensive to lose and in general hard to fly well when you're still struggling to understand the basic mechanics surrounding EVE.


+1

That was certainly true for me.
Inxentas Ultramar
Ultramar Independent Contracting
#128 - 2014-02-27 18:30:22 UTC
Sir Jack Falstaff wrote:
ability to delay gratification


You just won the thread. It's all about this.

Plus indeed groups (corps) offer chances to faster (though still never instant) gratification. When my corp is out kitchen-sinking our ships doing a little "home defense" style PVP the new guy with webs + scrams quickly turns into the hero of the day, even if he just lands initial tackle and loses his ship. Good job! The corp is likely to provide a new frigate or the ISK to replace it twice over. Such a player feels a little more empowered, and might even learn enough mechanics to pull off a few solo kills without even requiring T2 equipment.

I do somewhat agree with the sentiment a new player has so much skills to catch up on, it can be extremely offputting. On the other hand it's our job to show these players what they can do with their limited skillset. With 2-3 year of active play I find myself shipping down to frigates often because it is so enjoyable to see a meta-3 ship obliterate a ship mutiple times it's own value by sheer fitting and flying. One of my favourite kills is a blockade runner I caught using meta-0 stuff only, because it illustrates so well how a really new character would be able to make a kill yielding proper loot and a 100m+ killmail.
Victoria Thorne
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#129 - 2014-02-27 18:31:40 UTC
SKINE DMZ wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
So, the Thread de-generates into a discussion of the viability of Frigs and Cruisers.

Not exactly about being "afraid" of EVE and why anymore is it ???????

Just mechanics bickering, as per usual. Roll Congratz.

Actually, I believe that is one of the main mis conceptions for new players and why they are afraid of EVE, they don't want to be stuck in small ships when in reality it may be exactly what may be more fun when you realise how slow big ships are, expensive to lose and in general hard to fly well when you're still struggling to understand the basic mechanics surrounding EVE.


Yes... I remember the first time a friend of mine joined me for a level 4 mission, while he was still in frigates... His first reaction was: "They are THAT slow?" Yes. They are.
Nicolai Serkanner
Incredible.
Brave Collective
#130 - 2014-02-27 18:33:44 UTC
Divine Entervention wrote:
SKINE DMZ wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
SKINE DMZ wrote:
Titans are far from the best ships in eve(there are no best ships think of ships more like rock paper scissors, got to use the right one at the right time), they are tools against other big ships and can transport fleets from one place to another basically. You wouldn't go do anything in a Titan alone, they are only used with fleets so you wouldn't ever train to be in one on your main character.

You are extremely underestimating small ships, I did this too and I'm sure many others and only started flying frigates again a few months back. Within a year of playing you can be fully effective solo in faction warfare for example, winning fights and destroying ships of players who have been playing for longer than 5 years. The older character with lots of skill points will have the majority of their skill points in skills that are not relevant to the fight you will have with them.

People who think they need time to catch up don't understand EVE fully in my opinion, you can create a focused scanner guy right now and be more efficient in scanning than most pilots within just a few months.


Underestimating small ships. Wrong. I've flown in a frigate and been destroyed in 1 second by someone else. Maybe if you want to count target acquisition time, then it's still less than 10 seconds. 1 salvo = obliterated

Trust me, I am right.

If you keep playing you will understand all this by training, not player training and putting things into skill que online but mentally understanding the game, it's such a common mistake.

Here is some frigate PVP to show you anyway: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZIIp342qIY you can fly like this within months.


You heard it here first, folks. A tristan is a t1 frigate. Within MONTHS you'll be able to fly a t1 frigate around and start seeing results! Never mind it's a tier just above the rookie ship!


You really should try some other game because with your attitude EvE is definitely not for you.

I am a member of Brave Newbies Inc. We are a corporation founded a year ago with the goal to let new players dive head first into this game with the sole reason to have fun!
We have one day old members flying in frigates in our fleets destroying T2 and T3 cruisers and even capitals. They get blown up a lot ... just like experienced players do ... and always come back for more.

You on the other hand sound worse than the bitterest of bittervets I have had the pleasure of encountering in these topics. Perhaps you should join a newbie friendly corp like Red vs Blue or EvE uni, or BNI and learn how to have fun instead of whining about your incompetence to understand the basic premise of a sandbox game.
Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#131 - 2014-02-27 18:35:16 UTC
Nicolai Serkanner wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
SKINE DMZ wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
SKINE DMZ wrote:
Titans are far from the best ships in eve(there are no best ships think of ships more like rock paper scissors, got to use the right one at the right time), they are tools against other big ships and can transport fleets from one place to another basically. You wouldn't go do anything in a Titan alone, they are only used with fleets so you wouldn't ever train to be in one on your main character.

You are extremely underestimating small ships, I did this too and I'm sure many others and only started flying frigates again a few months back. Within a year of playing you can be fully effective solo in faction warfare for example, winning fights and destroying ships of players who have been playing for longer than 5 years. The older character with lots of skill points will have the majority of their skill points in skills that are not relevant to the fight you will have with them.

People who think they need time to catch up don't understand EVE fully in my opinion, you can create a focused scanner guy right now and be more efficient in scanning than most pilots within just a few months.


Underestimating small ships. Wrong. I've flown in a frigate and been destroyed in 1 second by someone else. Maybe if you want to count target acquisition time, then it's still less than 10 seconds. 1 salvo = obliterated

Trust me, I am right.

If you keep playing you will understand all this by training, not player training and putting things into skill que online but mentally understanding the game, it's such a common mistake.

Here is some frigate PVP to show you anyway: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZIIp342qIY you can fly like this within months.


You heard it here first, folks. A tristan is a t1 frigate. Within MONTHS you'll be able to fly a t1 frigate around and start seeing results! Never mind it's a tier just above the rookie ship!


You really should try some other game because with your attitude EvE is definitely not for you.

I am a member of Brave Newbies Inc. We are a corporation founded a year ago with the goal to let new players dive head first into this game with the sole reason to have fun!
We have one day old members flying in frigates in our fleets destroying T2 and T3 cruisers and even capitals. They get blown up a lot ... just like experienced players do ... and always come back for more.

You on the other hand sound worse than the bitterest of bittervets I have had the pleasure of encountering in these topics. Perhaps you should join a newbie friendly corp like Red vs Blue or EvE uni, or BNI and learn how to have fun instead of whining about your incompetence to understand the basic premise of a sandbox game.


Yea well, too bad for you because it's not my intention to quit.

#dealwithit
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#132 - 2014-02-27 18:39:16 UTC
Nicolai Serkanner wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
SKINE DMZ wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
SKINE DMZ wrote:
Titans are far from the best ships in eve(there are no best ships think of ships more like rock paper scissors, got to use the right one at the right time), they are tools against other big ships and can transport fleets from one place to another basically. You wouldn't go do anything in a Titan alone, they are only used with fleets so you wouldn't ever train to be in one on your main character.

You are extremely underestimating small ships, I did this too and I'm sure many others and only started flying frigates again a few months back. Within a year of playing you can be fully effective solo in faction warfare for example, winning fights and destroying ships of players who have been playing for longer than 5 years. The older character with lots of skill points will have the majority of their skill points in skills that are not relevant to the fight you will have with them.

People who think they need time to catch up don't understand EVE fully in my opinion, you can create a focused scanner guy right now and be more efficient in scanning than most pilots within just a few months.


Underestimating small ships. Wrong. I've flown in a frigate and been destroyed in 1 second by someone else. Maybe if you want to count target acquisition time, then it's still less than 10 seconds. 1 salvo = obliterated

Trust me, I am right.

If you keep playing you will understand all this by training, not player training and putting things into skill que online but mentally understanding the game, it's such a common mistake.

Here is some frigate PVP to show you anyway: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZIIp342qIY you can fly like this within months.


You heard it here first, folks. A tristan is a t1 frigate. Within MONTHS you'll be able to fly a t1 frigate around and start seeing results! Never mind it's a tier just above the rookie ship!


You really should try some other game because with your attitude EvE is definitely not for you.

I am a member of Brave Newbies Inc. We are a corporation founded a year ago with the goal to let new players dive head first into this game with the sole reason to have fun!
We have one day old members flying in frigates in our fleets destroying T2 and T3 cruisers and even capitals. They get blown up a lot ... just like experienced players do ... and always come back for more.

You on the other hand sound worse than the bitterest of bittervets I have had the pleasure of encountering in these topics. Perhaps you should join a newbie friendly corp like Red vs Blue or EvE uni, or BNI and learn how to have fun instead of whining about your incompetence to understand the basic premise of a sandbox game.


This suggestion was already made to him, multiple times. He continues to ignore it and spew vitriol and judge everyone that does not validate his pity parade.

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!

Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#133 - 2014-02-27 18:40:28 UTC
Aargolos wrote:
BOOO!

So I was talking to some friends tonight that I used to play another "mmo" with. My question was, "why don't you play EvE?". They're still on the same ****** game for years. No development, no interesting changes, diminishing player-base.

These people have the potential to be "great" EvE players. They can find and exploit new features pretty effectively, use abstract tactics, and are willing to win at all costs. Also they like the "politics" aspect of gaming, and the meta-game.

Is it a fear of the learning cliff? Would they rather stay in the baby sandbox and "win" over taking a chance in the "big pond"?

Has anyone else had the same experience with their gaming "friends"?




"Some" other "people" just don't "like" spaceships games. "They" would rather be "playing" a "casual" game that didn't entail "losing" everything they "worked" for in an "moment" of inattention.

Mr Epeen Cool
SKINE DMZ
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#134 - 2014-02-27 18:42:10 UTC
You are missing this part from his post most importantly:

Nicolai Serkanner wrote:
I am a member of Brave Newbies Inc. We are a corporation founded a year ago with the goal to let new players dive head first into this game with the sole reason to have fun!
We have one day old members flying in frigates in our fleets destroying T2 and T3 cruisers and even capitals. They get blown up a lot ... just like experienced players do ... and always come back for more.


If you are not going to take peoples advise here seriously then you will either find this out:

A. In time
B. Never because you quit and never fully understood EVE

I disagree

BrundleMeth
Black Parrot
Sylvanas Super mercenary
#135 - 2014-02-27 18:42:31 UTC  |  Edited by: BrundleMeth
Aargolos wrote:
Has anyone else had the same experience with their gaming "friends"?
No... I have no RL friends gaming or otherwise...

But that's ok. People my age generally have kids or even grand kids. Kids aren't allowed in my house. Ever....
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#136 - 2014-02-27 18:52:54 UTC
SKINE DMZ wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
So, the Thread de-generates into a discussion of the viability of Frigs and Cruisers.

Not exactly about being "afraid" of EVE and why anymore is it ???????

Just mechanics bickering, as per usual. Roll Congratz.

Actually, I believe that is one of the main mis conceptions for new players and why they are afraid of EVE, they don't want to be stuck in small ships when in reality it may be exactly what may be more fun when you realise how slow big ships are, expensive to lose and in general hard to fly well when you're still struggling to understand the basic mechanics surrounding EVE.


Yeah. I've seen more newbies quit after losing their first BS with only 2 months or so of training. Those who just want to hop immediately into the big ships just don't get how bad an idea it is.

But the current generation wants it all, and they want it all right now.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882

Talia Prime
Imperial Militia
#137 - 2014-02-27 18:56:50 UTC
Kimmi Chan wrote:

This suggestion was already made to him, multiple times. He continues to ignore it and spew vitriol and judge everyone that does not validate his pity parade.


Unfortunately I have to agree, when I first read some of his posts I thought we had a intelligent poster that would give across some reasonable arguments but have come to realise the failure of my initial assessment. Nothing new to see here.
Your Dad Naked
Doomheim
#138 - 2014-02-27 19:00:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Your Dad Naked
The people I know who won't play usually state it's because of human nature, essentially.

EVE Online is a sandbox MMO that is primarily about the freedom it gives to it's players. The problem is: When you give human beings this level of freedom, they generally misuse it since we are a pathetic species as a whole.

We have rules in our society for a reason and it's because we are horribly flawed creatures that need these regulations to keep us in check.

In many ways the EVE universe represents the truly repulsive nature of humanity. That alone is enough to turn many people away from playing.

EDIT: Yes, this is a stealth nerf humanity post.
Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#139 - 2014-02-27 19:07:20 UTC
Your Dad Naked wrote:
The people I know who won't play usually state it's because of human nature, essentially.

EVE Online is a sandbox MMO that is primarily about the freedom it gives to it's players. The problem is: When you give human beings this level of freedom, they generally misuse it since we are a pathetic species as a whole.

We have rules in our society for a reason and it's because we are horribly flawed creatures that need these regulations to keep us in check.

In many ways the EVE universe represents the truly repulsive nature of humanity. That alone is enough to turn many people away from playing.



Great post, incredibly truthful. Thanks for your opinion and speak it more often.
Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#140 - 2014-02-27 19:11:00 UTC
I'm not taking your advice about T2 battleships or even regular battleships because personally I do not want one. I don't even want a titan.

I'm making statements about them because a battleship from WW2 is pretigious. People think battle ship and they're like, man I want to be the Arizona( not that one really cuz it sank)!

Or they'll look at the most expensive, powerful ship in the game, which is essentially a correlation to other game's best of the best armor and weapons they can get.

I'm simply making a prediction as to what new people might be interested in, and making statements about their attainability for information purposes.