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Mining barges protection buffs,
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Damien White
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#21 - 2014-02-24 20:54:47 UTC
Well, if you cet caught with a Scram or disruptor, as long as your attacker knows what he is doing, you are dead no matter what ship you use.

97% of girls would die if Justin Bieber were about to jump off a cliff. Post this in your sig if you`re part of the 3% yelling,

"DO A BARREL ROLL!"
Rowells
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#22 - 2014-02-24 20:55:26 UTC
Damien White wrote:
Well, he used a thermal bomb... realy bad idea, with 84.6% thermal is the highest resist of a tanked mackinaw.


But yes, you can tank even a Mackinaw well, as long as you dont go for absolute maximum yield.


EDIT: In case you wanna bomb an Exhumer and he is known to have a good tank, go for kinetic.

I don't think he used a bomb. He still has 2 in the launcher at the time of the kill. And i can't be sure of the fitting i had but i remember it being based off the local rats.
Damien White
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#23 - 2014-02-24 20:56:25 UTC
Ah, makes sense.

97% of girls would die if Justin Bieber were about to jump off a cliff. Post this in your sig if you`re part of the 3% yelling,

"DO A BARREL ROLL!"
Rowells
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#24 - 2014-02-24 20:57:59 UTC
Stephanie Rosefire wrote:
Rendiff wrote:
They already gave the mining barges a balance pass. If you want to use a Hulk mine with friends, if you need tank use a Skiff. The Skiff has EHP on par with a battleship if you fit it right.


skiffs and procs have no way of defending themselves, if you get caught with a scram or a disruptor, you are as good as dead. if you cant flee and you cant defend yourself, whats the point?

I think i just showed that there is potential to defend yourself. It all depends on pilot skill, if your prepared in your fittings, and a little bit of luck as always.
Stephanie Rosefire
EYES 3VERYWHERE
United Neopian Federation
#25 - 2014-02-24 20:58:12 UTC
Luna Arindale wrote:
Watch your overview, keep a flight of drones. A mining barge should not be able to tank null and lowsec rats. If you get warp scrambled, kill the frigate using your drones and be aligned and burning to the target you want to warp to. Mining barges are ment die easily, exhumers aren't.


there is a very small difference between T1s and T2s. yes, each class has their buffs, hulks can mine more then a covy, skiff is tougher then a proc, but in the end, with such small differences, they arent worth the 250mil price tag. high sec miners who bring them into low sec arent using their brains. bringing a T2 barge into pirate space is not worth the risk.
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#26 - 2014-02-24 21:00:30 UTC
Freiday wrote:
Rendiff wrote:
They already gave the mining barges a balance pass. If you want to use a Hulk mine with friends, if you need tank use a Skiff. The Skiff has EHP on par with a battleship if you fit it right.


That is great exaggeration, they are nowhere near battleship fittable in protection.


Here you go. Provided as a free service so you can stop being bad. It's a bit closer to low end BS tank, but it's up there.

[Skiff, This Is Impossible]
Mining Laser Upgrade II
Damage Control II

Medium Shield Extender II
Medium Shield Extender II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
EM Ward Field II

Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I

Medium Core Defense Field Extender II
Medium Core Defense Field Extender II

~200m isk, 108k EHP at all Vs.


Want to go cheaper? This is more BC than BS level, but it's also mere pennies in comparison.

[Procurer, Cheap Tanked Procurer]
Mining Laser Upgrade II
Damage Control II

Medium Shield Extender II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
EM Ward Field II

Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I

Medium Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I

~31m isk, 84k EHP.
Damien White
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#27 - 2014-02-24 21:01:38 UTC
Stephanie Rosefire wrote:


there is a very small difference between T1s and T2s. yes, each class has their buffs, hulks can mine more then a covy, skiff is tougher then a proc, but in the end, with such small differences, they arent worth the 250mil price tag. high sec miners who bring them into low sec arent using their brains. bringing a T2 barge into pirate space is not worth the risk.


Exactly, but thats not a problem of the ship but rather the lowsec not having its own minerals.

Btw, we are still talking about a >100k HP Skiff vs a 85k HP Procurer. No idea what you are thinking but some people happily pay the price for over 25% extra buffer, making you virtualy invulnerable in Highsec.

97% of girls would die if Justin Bieber were about to jump off a cliff. Post this in your sig if you`re part of the 3% yelling,

"DO A BARREL ROLL!"
Stephanie Rosefire
EYES 3VERYWHERE
United Neopian Federation
#28 - 2014-02-24 21:04:29 UTC
Gimme more Cynos wrote:
Mining barges can tank whole 0.0 spawns if you know how. Just learn 2 fit and learn to build non-****** mining fleets.

to say the obvious: Your suggestion is bad, will remain bad and you should feel ashamed for posting it. Only way to make up for your terribly bad suggestion is to biomass yourself after contracting all your stuff to me.


the forums are meant for constructive criticism. being intentionally rude and slanderous does not belong here. please keep you feelings about opinions that you do not like to yourself.
Rowells
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#29 - 2014-02-24 21:10:35 UTC
Stephanie Rosefire wrote:
Luna Arindale wrote:
Watch your overview, keep a flight of drones. A mining barge should not be able to tank null and lowsec rats. If you get warp scrambled, kill the frigate using your drones and be aligned and burning to the target you want to warp to. Mining barges are ment die easily, exhumers aren't.


there is a very small difference between T1s and T2s. yes, each class has their buffs, hulks can mine more then a covy, skiff is tougher then a proc, but in the end, with such small differences, they arent worth the 250mil price tag. high sec miners who bring them into low sec arent using their brains. bringing a T2 barge into pirate space is not worth the risk.

I currently have 2 skiffs mining ice right now in null. And with ice prices as they are i have made enough to buy 2 more skiffs in less than a week. Where do you think all the rare ores come from? somebody is out there mining them in skiffs, mcaks, procurers, and retrievers. And as a somewhat competent industrialist, I can say the price tag is worth it with either the extra defense or larger ore hold (Can't say much for the hulk but I've seen people do it).

While I will admit I dont mine in lowsec, I think the problem is there arent as many valuable ores with almost the same risk of getting blown up, if not by rats then by other pilots.
Damien White
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#30 - 2014-02-24 21:12:21 UTC
Rowells wrote:

While I will admit I dont mine in lowsec, I think the problem is there arent as many valuable ores with almost the same risk of getting blown up, if not by rats then by other pilots.


Thats the problem. Low Sec needs something you can only get in there, otherwise miners will either stay in highsec or 0.0.

97% of girls would die if Justin Bieber were about to jump off a cliff. Post this in your sig if you`re part of the 3% yelling,

"DO A BARREL ROLL!"
Rowells
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#31 - 2014-02-24 21:13:54 UTC
Damien White wrote:
Rowells wrote:

While I will admit I dont mine in lowsec, I think the problem is there arent as many valuable ores with almost the same risk of getting blown up, if not by rats then by other pilots.


Thats the problem. Low Sec needs something you can only get in there, otherwise miners will either stay in highsec or 0.0.

It's even riskier nowadays with people burning the belts for security tags.
Luna Arindale
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#32 - 2014-02-24 21:45:48 UTC
By no means is Low sec meant to be safe, and I would point out the difference between Null sec and High Sec mining is really just the Mercoxit spawns in Ore Sites and Rorqual Boosts. High Sec gets so many ore site Spawns with Hedbergite and Hemorphite, the "Low Sec." Ores, That it makes mining in low sec when coupled with the roaming gangs pointless. (You can be Safer, and get the same ores)

(That rant is over)

The Exhumers indeed are worth a lot of isk; however, the real issue is not the amount of tank your barge has. I believe the real issue is just your experience with fitting, and with tanking belt rat spawns. A skiff is able to tank those spawns with ease, and even trying to go at one solo is a risky endeavor. (Battle Skiffs do exist, they are rather scary) The Exhumer class as with the Mining barge are divided into three types of Ships. Harvesting, Capacity, and Tank. The Tank class (Skiff, Procurer) does what it is designed to do, tank. As it has been proven they can have a battleship sized tank. The Capacity Class (Retriever, Mackinaw), is a good Middle ground it is able to hold 25,000 - 35,000m3 and the Mackinaw can tank cruiser and some Battleship spawns in Ore Anoms in null sec. Overall that class is the best to use Solo as the Ore Hold size matters (Plus at a decent skill level with tech 2 crystals you can pull 4k m3 / 180s solo) . The Harvesting class (Hulk, Covetor), has the smallest tank, mines the most per cycle with Strip miners, and is the best to use if you are jet can mining in a fleet. That class by no means should be able to tank the same things that the Mackinaw or the Retriever can, just like the Mack and Retriever can't tank what the Skiff and Procurer can for the most part.

That wall of text being said, anyone who has been at the receiving end, or has actually ganked/Hotdropped a Mining Barge or exhumer, know exactly how fast some of those ships can melt. This is not a matter of their tank should be better, this is a matter of you or someone else being inexperienced to know how to avoid being hotdropped/ganked. If you are really worried about it, use a Venture with Deep Core Miner IIs, You can pull over 1,600 m3/180s Easily and be able to out maneuver and out run hostiles at little to no cost because Ventures can be gotten for almost nothing off of the market.

I recommend that if you are worried about costs, attempt to fly a venture around for awhile with DCM IIs. You will be pleasantly surprised at how effective they really are compared to Barges. They may not have the tank, but they are speedy and useful for what they do.
Rowells
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#33 - 2014-02-24 22:08:59 UTC
Now all that being said, i have always wondered how a skiff would fare if you traded its shield HP bonus for a drone damage bonus or an active tanking bonus. Just a thought.
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