EVE General Discussion

How do you generalise from the statements of a small sample, and how do you reconcile that generalisation with the statements from other gankers that they're doing it for any number of other reasons?

Do you have any evidence to support this supposed mass-exploitation?

It still doesn't support the claim that gankers and scammers — as a group — are only out to hurt people, and it doesn't even begin to address the question of whether or not this somehow distinguishes them from any other arbitrary group in the game.


e: Also, wrong thread Krixtal. I know it's many of the same people, but I'm guessing you're looking for the “afraid of EVE” thread.

I will state that I feel people who become upset upon losing pixels who respond with an irrational vitriol of hate and insults are placing an over emphasis on the importance of the items that were stolen from them. They should not let the loss of possessions upset them.

Regaring the interpretation of the griefers attempt to illicit anger/rage/tears from someone is in my opinion a valid excuse to label that person as someone you should not trust, in game and out. Why? because that person has demonstrated on at least one occasion where he is willing to pretend you are not a real person worthy of respect. Because of that, there is an aire of uncertainty regarding where the game of griefing ends for him.

Being a griefer does not necessarily mean he will choose to grief you outside of the game as well. He could very well be the nicest person. But considering the choices he's shown you he is willing to make to you, trying to negatively impact your game play and sense of happiness, you may question his motives and the extent to which he is willing to go with his desire to make you, and others, unhappy. Maybe it doesn't end online. Maybe he does it offline? It's impossible to know. All you do know is what he's shown you, and it is not good.

So do not concern yourself with a griefer trying to justify his choices. He could very well only be trying to regain your trust so he can con you again, proving once again how he is "superior" for being willing to debase his self by falling to the temptation of easy, cheap enjoyment at your expense.

It is obvious that there are alot of people in this game who will go the extra mile to make an attempt to establish dominance over you. The proof is in this thread, and littered throughout the entirety of these forums. But just as there is alot of evidence of people doing bad things, the good ones are still out there. We're still here. Not all of us are as determined as I am to speak our minds and condemn the actions we agree upon being wrong.

You don't have to accept their actions as sufficient examples of how people should be allowed to act. You apply your own morality onto determining right and wrong.

Now, despite my opinions on the persons who's goal is to inflict suffering. I do not wish for it to be removed.

Knowing these bad people exist make you good ones that much more special and enjoyable by comparison. They'll despise you. Think down upon you for having an opinion that is not their own, they have to for their ego's rationalization of their actions to maintain their sense of self.

Is it right what they do?
No.
Should their ability to act that way be removed?
No.

But their actions ultimately only reflect poorly on themselves.

Yes, and that's exactly how I feel as a gay man of 48 years about what just went down in Arizona. It's just the way life is. Everyone deserves to have whatever their beliefs and ideals are. The public as a whole will judge though, by reputation and observation.

It's always astounded me, this seemingly magical power I have to terrify those people straight out of their rational minds....down to pursuing political legislation of their beliefs. Now, that's a Super-Power, and most indeed

No, he hasn't. He has only pretended that your pretend-character has some pretend-stuff that he would like for his pretend-character. It is all pretend and reflects nothing on either your or his real person.

You may, but it makes little sense to do so. All he has done is play a game and achieve some form of win-condition within that game. Without any further indication than that, there is no reason to question it as anything other than trying to achieve a win-condition within the game — commonly one of the main points of playing games to begin with.

It's also somewhat tautological since we're dealing with a competitive game. Of course people will try to establish dominance in a game that revolves around establishing dominance. It's about as meaningful an observation as noting that people playing chess go the extra mile to capture the opponent's pieces.

Just one problem: there is nothing to suggest that they're bad people.

An interesting, if incredibly noisy and unreliable sample. How do you generalise from this sample and how do you reconcile it with the many gankers' claims that they do it a variety of completely unrelated reasons?

What do you have to support this claim? How does it separate them from every other group in the game?

There goes Krixtal Icefluxor answering his own questions again

When I came into the game in June of 2007, It never ever crossed my mind that I could never 'catch up to the people who started playing in 2003-6. I think most people who do that have the "solo player/gladiator" mindset that prevails in other MMOs and especially MOBAs like LoL.

That mind set (while supported) doesn't really fit into EVE the same way it fits into other games. I played WoW for a few months in 2008 and one of the things I noticed was how it really worked to keep people "on their level" via game mechanics that didn't let you go above your capabilities , there was a lot of stuff I couldn't access because of my low level. It would be like EVE not letting you into a 10/10 because you only have 7 million skill points or something lol.

It may be that some people can't deal with an "open world" type game like EVE, they need the structure and direction other games offer, and need to feel like they can be on a level playing field with others.

I think people more mentally suited to EVE's way of life don't give a solid flip about even playing fields, their too busy figuring out how they can use the uneven playing field to make isk, influence and maybe tears.

So you can't actually support your claim. You have no way of evaluating your sample. You have no way of generalising from your sample. You have no way of reconciling your claim with evidence that seems to utterly falsify it. And you have no indication whatsoever about how this distinguishes gankers and scammers from the population at large.

Asking you to prove your assertion is not dishonest. “Common knowledge” is not the same as fact — it's actually often the exact opposite — and if it truly was that common, you wouldn't have such insurmountable problems providing the supporting evidence you need.

It sure does. I defend almost all legitimate gameplay, especially when the arguments against them are completely nonsensical and utterly disconnected from reality.


…which no-one has actually refused to do.

How does it?

Is that a rhetorical question?

In that you yourself demonstrate the behavior and traits you are projecting onto someone else in that specific description of them.

I find your description of them, is actually more accurately a description of yourself, than it is of them.

You can believe what you like. But unless you can prove a connection, then others can dismiss your stance.
So just as you can believe you blew my attempt, you have again failed to prove it and thus I will dismiss your stance.

But thanks for playing.