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Getting ganked on a closed Jita gate

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Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#121 - 2014-02-23 20:36:19 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Domanique Altares wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:

i can't actually be bothered to type a proper response since you refuse to even read, let alone type a proper response.


So instead you make another childish, petulant reply. Excellent work.


i can't give a reply to some one who isn't even able to discuss the topic and would rather have a monologue with themselves.


Confirming that Dave Stark cannot reply to himself.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#122 - 2014-02-23 20:37:31 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
that's not what the op was about at all.
So you didn't read it, I take it. Let me quote it for you:
drummendejef maaktnietuit wrote:
most of us know, and don't forget, that Jita gets full from time to time. The gates close then sitting alot of big expensive ships with a more expensive load sitting duck.
[…]
This makes me wonder, shouldn't it be a good idea to make a player invulnerable when he presses the "take gate" button? That way the ships made for surviving null/lowsec can also survive highsec. (if not autopilotted, duh!)
So… the OP was about the implementation of a hideously idiotic gamebreaker just to cover for being sloppy and failing to use the information and mechanics at everyone's disposal — something that isn't an actual problem with the system but rather with the users.

Angeleh wrote:
No idea what Ender's game is, but when you transition system in Eve you can't be shot. And the transition is what should happen when you activate the gate.
You should read it. And no, the transition should happen when you transition, not when you just sit around waiting for your turn. If you can't risk sitting around, don't.

Quote:
It is not an intended design of the gate that it doesn't work
But the gate is working, as intended.
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#123 - 2014-02-23 20:38:34 UTC
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Angeleh wrote:
If the server could handle it, there would be no locked gate. Therefore the locked gate is a result of the game's fault to handle the load.


Wrong. The locked gate is a result of the players knowing the limitations of the game's ability to handle the load and then ignoring those limitations.



Look, Kimmi. In this world there will always be people why deliberately try to put eleven pounds of **** into a 10 pound bag, and will marvel as **** gets everywhere, subsequently blaming the bag for not holding enough.
Marsha Mallow
#124 - 2014-02-23 20:40:30 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Marsha Mallow wrote:
That doesn't justify dying on gates due to lag.
…but that's not what we're discussing either.

I think it is. You're attempting to justify a system that is currently so lagged out on a weekend it takes time to even log alts into system. Something is wrong. Gankers on gates around Jita are currently exploiting a game issue. It has something to do with common sense and planning ahead, but the reality is that people play more on a weekend and the current Jita node simply cannot cope. Which is not their fault. If we can only play a limited game on a weekend, we should rightly question how things can be improved, and arguing that players need to sharpen up simply isn't fair.

Tippia wrote:
Quote:
Even if you know it's there, traders, haulers and manufacturers in particular NEED to get in and out.
Not really, but if they feel they do, they can get in and out very easily.

I've done heavy manu/trade and whilst sensibly things should be done during the week, in reality we have other things to do. The majority of our spare time typically falls at a weekend, and the market is most dynamic at the point.

Are you suggesting that the sensible player will not play on a weekend at the core trading hub of the game?

Why shouldn't we challenge CCP as to why the game we play is effectively broken to an unplayable degree at peak times?

Ripard Teg > For the morons in the room:

Sweets > U can dd my face any day
Dave stark
#125 - 2014-02-23 20:40:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Dave Stark
Tippia wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
that's not what the op was about at all.
So you didn't read it, I take it. Let me quote it for you:
drummendejef maaktnietuit wrote:
most of us know, and don't forget, that Jita gets full from time to time. The gates close then sitting alot of big expensive ships with a more expensive load sitting duck.
[…]
This makes me wonder, shouldn't it be a good idea to make a player invulnerable when he presses the "take gate" button? That way the ships made for surviving null/lowsec can also survive highsec. (if not autopilotted, duh!)
So… the OP was about the implementation of a hideously idiotic gamebreaker


no, he quite clearly states that the issue is getting stuck on a closed gate.

however instead of discussing it you all decided you'd come in to the thread and say "HRURDURRWORKINGASINTENDEDHURRDURR" or "HURRDOON'TGOTOJITADURRRR" instead of just saying "that's not a suitable solution to the issue".

basically instead of discussing an idea, you just came to **** on a forum poster. nice one guys.
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#126 - 2014-02-23 20:43:30 UTC
drummendejef maaktnietuit wrote:
Hey guys,

most of us know, and don't forget, that Jita gets full from time to time. The gates close then sitting alot of big expensive ships with a more expensive load sitting duck.

This makes the Jita gate more dangerous than a lowsec gate to die on, while you should be on the safest part beeing in 1.0 space.

This makes me wonder, shouldn't it be a good idea to make a player invulnerable when he presses the "take gate" button? That way the ships made for surviving null/lowsec can also survive highsec. (if not autopilotted, duh!)

I'm talking about Blockade Runners, Covert Ops, T3's.


That's not a suitable solution to the issue.

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!
Rykuss
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#127 - 2014-02-23 20:43:39 UTC
Kimmi Chan wrote:
fondled on the gate.


How much for the happy ending?

You, too, can be a Solid Gold dancer.
Dave stark
#128 - 2014-02-23 20:45:06 UTC
Kimmi Chan wrote:
That's not a suitable solution to the issue.

will admit, that made me smirk.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#129 - 2014-02-23 20:46:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Dave Stark wrote:
no, he quite clearly states that the issue is getting stuck on a closed gate.
…which is an issue that only arises out of sloppiness. To solve this non-issue, he suggests the implementation of a hideously idiotic gamebreaker.

Marsha Mallow wrote:
I think it is.
How so, when there's no real lag involved? There's little to none in Jita and definitely none in the system where the OP's supposed problems manifest themselves.

Quote:
If we can only play a limited game on a weekend, we should rightly question how things can be improved, and arguing that players need to sharpen up simply isn't fair.
It seems entirely fair that people should apply some intelligence to solve their problems, especially when it will so easily deal with this particular one rather than sit around slack-jawed and boggle at how their inactivity leads to all kinds of undesirable outcomes.

Quote:
Are you suggesting that the sensible player will not play on a weekend at the core trading hub of the game?
Whatever gave you that idea?
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#130 - 2014-02-23 20:46:04 UTC
Marsha Mallow wrote:

I think it is. You're attempting to justify a system that is currently so lagged out on a weekend it takes time to even log alts into system.


Stop thinking, then. It's leading you astray.

System cap is not a consequence of lag. It's a measure to prevent lag and TiDi.

Personally, I wish CCP would open the floodgates and let Jita sit at 10% TiDi all day, everyday, and on down into the real lag enjoyed by nullsec fights.
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#131 - 2014-02-23 20:46:18 UTC
Marsha Mallow wrote:
Why shouldn't we challenge CCP as to why the game we play is effectively broken to an unplayable degree at peak times?


Because it's not broken. It's not unplayable.

Tippia can give a more accurate number but there are over 7000 systems in this game. The reason this one in particular is an issue is because people won't stop going there.

The other 6,999 systems get along just fine. You can jump in, jump out, jump in and shake it all about. Because THAT is what it's all about.

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!
Bertrand Butler
Cras es Noster
#132 - 2014-02-23 20:46:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Bertrand Butler
"I know what I'll do. I'll take my unscannable and slippery [insert loot pinata here], fill it with [insert absurd amount of loot] to the brim and then go to Jita on Saturday afternoon-ish to sell my stuff. Hell, the system is so stuffed to the ears with potential buyers, that even getting in is difficult. What could possibly go wrong? Imma gonna be riatch!!"

Roll
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#133 - 2014-02-23 20:48:02 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:

no, he quite clearly states that the issue is getting stuck on a closed gate.



Except that he's not stuck. He could leave and try again later. If he sits there long enough to get ganked, it's his own fault.
Dave stark
#134 - 2014-02-23 20:48:29 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
no, he quite clearly states that the issue is getting stuck on a closed gate.
…which is an issue that only arises out of sloppiness. To solve this non-issue, he suggests the implementation of a hideously idiotic gamebreaker.


no, that's not how it arises, at all.
Dave stark
#135 - 2014-02-23 20:50:10 UTC
Domanique Altares wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:

no, he quite clearly states that the issue is getting stuck on a closed gate.



Except that he's not stuck. He could leave and try again later. If he sits there long enough to get ganked, it's his own fault.


unless you warp instantly; you're stuck for an amount of time. anyone with half a brain needs but a few seconds to take advantage of that. an advantage that they wouldn't have if you'd have jumped though instead of being stuck with a silly pop up.
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#136 - 2014-02-23 20:53:23 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
no, he quite clearly states that the issue is getting stuck on a closed gate.
…which is an issue that only arises out of sloppiness. To solve this non-issue, he suggests the implementation of a hideously idiotic gamebreaker.


no, that's not how it arises, at all.


Does it arise through voodoo, Dave?

Do we hold a dark ritual and summon the avatar of Gatethulhu to strike down innocent industrialists?
Miasmos
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#137 - 2014-02-23 20:53:26 UTC
Analogy:

Jita gate lock ~ Nullsec fight jump tunnel crash. Both happen for the same reason, server load. Both are not the fault of the player but the fault of an imperfect system.

CCP's stance is to not reimburse/fix the nullsec tunnel but only as a specific exception to the reimbursement rule: large nullsec fights are not reimbursed in general. Because this is a specific exception, and Jita gate should be open in a functioning system, the losses at the gate should IMHO be reimbursed for consistency.

Either that, or a rule should be written on not reimbursing stuff lost due to population locked jump gates.

In any case the logs should reveal everything needed to make the right call on reimbursement petitions.
Ai Shun
#138 - 2014-02-23 20:54:08 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
unless you warp instantly; you're stuck for an amount of time. anyone with half a brain needs but a few seconds to take advantage of that. an advantage that they wouldn't have if you'd have jumped though instead of being stuck with a silly pop up.


Prevention needs to happen a bit earlier than being stuck on the gate to be successful.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#139 - 2014-02-23 20:54:13 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
no, that's not how it arises, at all.
So how does anyone get stuck on the gate if it he doesn't ignore all the signs showing that it would happen and fails to use the numerous mechanics to work around it? It's all there. There is no reason to get stuck anywhere other than pure sloppiness.
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#140 - 2014-02-23 20:54:21 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Domanique Altares wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:

no, he quite clearly states that the issue is getting stuck on a closed gate.



Except that he's not stuck. He could leave and try again later. If he sits there long enough to get ganked, it's his own fault.


unless you warp instantly; you're stuck for an amount of time. anyone with half a brain needs but a few seconds to take advantage of that. an advantage that they wouldn't have if you'd have jumped though instead of being stuck with a silly pop up.


Anyone with the other half of the brain doesn't go to Jita on a Sunday and expect instant entry.