These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Does Eve need new players?

First post First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#381 - 2014-02-25 02:14:42 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Ai Shun wrote:
I understand this can be done through a personal agreement between the CEOs / directors, but is there a game mechanic similar to transferrable kill rights / etc. that lets this happen?

There is the allies mechanism that allows decided Corps to bring allies in to assist.

Eve highsec wardec Corps like the Marmites are available to hire as allies, so decked Corps have the option to fight back through a third party (or several third party's)


More than a few of them will do it for free. It's a good way to get fights.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Ai Shun
#382 - 2014-02-25 02:15:36 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Ai Shun wrote:
I understand this can be done through a personal agreement between the CEOs / directors, but is there a game mechanic similar to transferrable kill rights / etc. that lets this happen?

There is the allies mechanism that allows decided Corps to bring allies in to assist.

Eve highsec wardec Corps like the Marmites are available to hire as allies, so decked Corps have the option to fight back through a third party (or several third party's)


Cool, so there is another mechanism supported in-game that gives you some way to fight back. It's even better for using other players to help build the sandbox. Thanks Scipio.
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#383 - 2014-02-25 02:19:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Scipio Artelius
Ai Shun wrote:
Cool, so there is another mechanism supported in-game that gives you some way to fight back. It's even better for using other players to help build the sandbox. Thanks Scipio.

No problems and sorry for the silly spelling errors. iOS seems to think it knows what I want to say better than I do. That may well be true half the time, but I still wish it would leave my typing unaltered sometimes.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#384 - 2014-02-25 02:26:26 UTC
Divine Entervention wrote:


Considering I, being a new player, am totally bored right now because there's next to nothing efficient for a new player to do except die alot and make people who need to kill new players to feel good about themselves; there needs to be something to do.



Then you're doing it wrong, because it was thanks to Griffins flown by newbs that I've lost a pimped-out 124mil isk pvp Ishkur, and a Cynabal. Maybe don't warp to zero next time?

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#385 - 2014-02-25 02:34:19 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:


Considering I, being a new player, am totally bored right now because there's next to nothing efficient for a new player to do except die alot and make people who need to kill new players to feel good about themselves; there needs to be something to do.



Then you're doing it wrong, because it was thanks to Griffins flown by newbs that I've lost a pimped-out 124mil isk pvp Ishkur, and a Cynabal. Maybe don't warp to zero next time?


I already told him to fly Griffins. He told me to go **** myself. LOL.

He also wants to get into a Kitsune AND THEN a Blackbird. Blink

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#386 - 2014-02-25 02:35:46 UTC
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:


Considering I, being a new player, am totally bored right now because there's next to nothing efficient for a new player to do except die alot and make people who need to kill new players to feel good about themselves; there needs to be something to do.



Then you're doing it wrong, because it was thanks to Griffins flown by newbs that I've lost a pimped-out 124mil isk pvp Ishkur, and a Cynabal. Maybe don't warp to zero next time?


I already told him to fly Griffins. He told me to go **** myself. LOL.

He also wants to get into a Kitsune AND THEN a Blackbird. Blink


It's almost like skillplans don't exist. Or that he thinks he's a special snowflake and the way things work don't apply to him. Not sure which.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#387 - 2014-02-25 02:37:08 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:


Considering I, being a new player, am totally bored right now because there's next to nothing efficient for a new player to do except die alot and make people who need to kill new players to feel good about themselves; there needs to be something to do.



Then you're doing it wrong, because it was thanks to Griffins flown by newbs that I've lost a pimped-out 124mil isk pvp Ishkur, and a Cynabal. Maybe don't warp to zero next time?


I already told him to fly Griffins. He told me to go **** myself. LOL.

He also wants to get into a Kitsune AND THEN a Blackbird. Blink


It's almost like skillplans don't exist. Or that he thinks he's a special snowflake and the way things work don't apply to him. Not sure which.


Not sure that I care. Horrible noob is horrible.

Eve needs new players NOT new asshats.

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#388 - 2014-02-25 02:42:09 UTC
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Not sure that I care. Horrible noob is horrible.

Eve needs new players NOT new asshats.


Best post.

/thread
Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#389 - 2014-02-25 02:45:28 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:


Considering I, being a new player, am totally bored right now because there's next to nothing efficient for a new player to do except die alot and make people who need to kill new players to feel good about themselves; there needs to be something to do.



Then you're doing it wrong, because it was thanks to Griffins flown by newbs that I've lost a pimped-out 124mil isk pvp Ishkur, and a Cynabal. Maybe don't warp to zero next time?


I already told him to fly Griffins. He told me to go **** myself. LOL.

He also wants to get into a Kitsune AND THEN a Blackbird. Blink


It's almost like skillplans don't exist. Or that he thinks he's a special snowflake and the way things work don't apply to him. Not sure which.


I didn't tell him to go **** himself. I assume he's become agitated or something? whatever, it's no matter.

I stated I do fly griffins when the opportunity presents itself.

I do have a skill plan going on right now. I'm about to get level 5 frigates done in like, 6 hours. After that, Longe range targetting to 5 so I can unlock EA ships.

In the mean time, there's really nothing exciting for me to do. I've already tried fitting frigates and rushing at other people. I've come to the conclusion, after looking at the employment histories of all these frigate/destroyer pilots I've attacked, that I'm heavily disadvantaged regarding potential.

If they've been playing for 5 years, they can fit a frigate to maximum efficiency, Most likely. I'd assume so. I mean, it's natural for people to want to be efficient when putting themselves into an competitive environment.

My statements are centered around other than waiting, I can not do anything efficiently. And until I can begin standing on an equal footing where the difference in wins and losses is not predetermined by fittings and researched skills, I'll not truly know what it is I'm capable of, there fore all experience will be skewed to a point of being inconsequential in later determining the tactics necessary to win evenly matched combat engagements.

I have to wait. I understand it. I'm letting you know that in the mean time, it's pretty boring and I would like something to do, some sort of game offered incentive to log in and perform actions. I've tried alot of actions thus far, and as of yet I've not found anything truly compelling to make me not want to play EvE Offline.
Ai Shun
#390 - 2014-02-25 02:50:31 UTC
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Eve needs new players NOT new asshats.


A friend of a very good friend asked some questions about EVE last night.

  • What level of time commitment do you need for EVE?
  • What is the long term motivation to play?
  • What is the biggest weakness in the game?


How do you answer those questions for somebody that hasn't played yet?

I found them interesting and ended up writing more than I thought I would on the subject. This thread and the attitudes shown in it as well as the thread from Doireen Kaundur were very helpful in explaining the attitude I think an EVE player needs.

Anyway, I offered to buddy him up and hopefully he'll give it a shot with an open mind and understanding!
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#391 - 2014-02-25 02:52:00 UTC
Divine Entervention wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:


Considering I, being a new player, am totally bored right now because there's next to nothing efficient for a new player to do except die alot and make people who need to kill new players to feel good about themselves; there needs to be something to do.



Then you're doing it wrong, because it was thanks to Griffins flown by newbs that I've lost a pimped-out 124mil isk pvp Ishkur, and a Cynabal. Maybe don't warp to zero next time?


I already told him to fly Griffins. He told me to go **** myself. LOL.

He also wants to get into a Kitsune AND THEN a Blackbird. Blink


It's almost like skillplans don't exist. Or that he thinks he's a special snowflake and the way things work don't apply to him. Not sure which.


I didn't tell him to go **** himself. I assume he's become agitated or something? whatever, it's no matter.

I stated I do fly griffins when the opportunity presents itself.

I do have a skill plan going on right now. I'm about to get level 5 frigates done in like, 6 hours. After that, Longe range targetting to 5 so I can unlock EA ships.

In the mean time, there's really nothing exciting for me to do. I've already tried fitting frigates and rushing at other people. I've come to the conclusion, after looking at the employment histories of all these frigate/destroyer pilots I've attacked, that I'm heavily disadvantaged regarding potential.

If they've been playing for 5 years, they can fit a frigate to maximum efficiency, Most likely. I'd assume so. I mean, it's natural for people to want to be efficient when putting themselves into an competitive environment.

My statements are centered around other than waiting, I can not do anything efficiently. And until I can begin standing on an equal footing where the difference in wins and losses is not predetermined by fittings and researched skills, I'll not truly know what it is I'm capable of, there fore all experience will be skewed to a point of being inconsequential in later determining the tactics necessary to win evenly matched combat engagements.

I have to wait. I understand it. I'm letting you know that in the mean time, it's pretty boring and I would like something to do, some sort of game offered incentive to log in and perform actions. I've tried alot of actions thus far, and as of yet I've not found anything truly compelling to make me not want to play EvE Offline.


What are the other people in your FW Corp doing? Are they also not logging in to pew pew?

Out of curiosity, why are you not training Caldari Cruiser to level I to get into your Blackbird? I mean 11 days to get into your Kitsune or 32 minutes to jump in a Blackbird. Are you sure you've thought this through? Is your corp really letting you twist in the wind like this? Do they know you're here and how your posting prowess reflects on them in game?

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#392 - 2014-02-25 02:52:46 UTC
Quote:
My statements are centered around other than waiting, I can not do anything efficiently.


You're incredibly wrong.

The people who actually have experience at this game (which you don't) have been telling you this for a while. The Griffin, even with hilariously half assed skills, is one of the cheapest force multipliers in the game for it's cost. That's why they die so much, because if you let one stay on the field for very long it's basically your death warrant. Doubly so the Blackbird. Both of those can be skilled into adequately after a few weeks.

Are they a solo ship? Hell no, go make some friends.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#393 - 2014-02-25 02:56:08 UTC
Ai Shun wrote:
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Eve needs new players NOT new asshats.


A friend of a very good friend asked some questions about EVE last night.

  • What level of time commitment do you need for EVE?
  • What is the long term motivation to play?
  • What is the biggest weakness in the game?


How do you answer those questions for somebody that hasn't played yet?

I found them interesting and ended up writing more than I thought I would on the subject. This thread and the attitudes shown in it as well as the thread from Doireen Kaundur were very helpful in explaining the attitude I think an EVE player needs.

Anyway, I offered to buddy him up and hopefully he'll give it a shot with an open mind and understanding!


These are some great questions!

I had to ask myself similar questions when I lost a Drake to a gate camp. I quit for a few months. I was really upset. I kept telling myself that the end game here was NullSec PVP and I had no interest in that so why should I bother playing. But in time I recognized that there is NO end game in this game. I recognized that PVP is going to happen but it is within my power to prevent or initiate it on my terms. I resubbed and found myself enjoying the game again, my way.

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!
Ai Shun
#394 - 2014-02-25 03:06:31 UTC
Kimmi Chan wrote:
I had to ask myself similar questions when I lost a Drake to a gate camp. I quit for a few months. I was really upset. I kept telling myself that the end game here was NullSec PVP and I had no interest in that so why should I bother playing. But in time I recognized that there is NO end game in this game. I recognized that PVP is going to happen but it is within my power to prevent or initiate it on my terms. I resubbed and found myself enjoying the game again, my way.


I can't say my experience was entirely similar. Gatecamps, yeah, I lost ships to them when I wasn't paying enough attention or taking what I thought was a well calculated risk. (It wasn't).

For me the whole idea of PLEX just rubbed me wrong. It felt like cheating because by spending a few hundred dollars I could suddenly inject stupendous amounts of ISK into my wallet and as a player I didn't know how to use that effectively. It was like a cheat code and that led to me losing a bit of motivation, idling and when I'd simply logged in to change skills for 3 months and had a few real world issues suck gametime away (When I'd just joined one of the best Australiasian corps I've ever encountered - Intersun Freelance, well worth checking out!) I just gave up for a while.

Then, some friends from Maryland started playing again and one of them went from being a total, can-flipping pirate to this placid, ISK churning miner. It was very amusing, but he talked me into coming back because they wanted somebody to refine for them. One of them set his goal as an Orca and worked his way up from a trial account to flying one in what seemed like a ludicrously short amount of time. They planned it well and they've executed it with almost military style precision. Three newbies and one (3m SP) veteran and then me, refining Big smile

I don't have any real ISK yet (Couple hundred million, working my way up to what I had before) but I'm enjoying it. I've taken the attitude of ships are just ships - they're like taking armour damage in other games. Inconsequential and meaningless as the clone and character survive and I'm now working on how to get the optimal ISK generation going.

Which means PI, using EVE Trade Finder (I like that tool) and fiddling around with some of the hauling contracts available. It's fun, isn't it?
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#395 - 2014-02-25 03:19:12 UTC
Divine Entervention wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:


Considering I, being a new player, am totally bored right now because there's next to nothing efficient for a new player to do except die alot and make people who need to kill new players to feel good about themselves; there needs to be something to do.



Then you're doing it wrong, because it was thanks to Griffins flown by newbs that I've lost a pimped-out 124mil isk pvp Ishkur, and a Cynabal. Maybe don't warp to zero next time?


I already told him to fly Griffins. He told me to go **** myself. LOL.

He also wants to get into a Kitsune AND THEN a Blackbird. Blink


It's almost like skillplans don't exist. Or that he thinks he's a special snowflake and the way things work don't apply to him. Not sure which.




I have to wait. I understand it. I'm letting you know that in the mean time, it's pretty boring and I would like something to do, some sort of game offered incentive to log in and perform actions. I've tried alot of actions thus far, and as of yet I've not found anything truly compelling to make me not want to play EvE Offline.


But you don't have to wait, and you don't understand it at all. You keep saying the same things over and over, and missing every point. I have a feeling that we could write it out on a neon sign and hang it right in front of your face, and you'd still ignore it, I imagine at this point just for the sake of having something to complain about.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#396 - 2014-02-25 03:32:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Divine Entervention
Remiel Pollard wrote:

But you don't have to wait, and you don't understand it at all. You keep saying the same things over and over, and missing every point. I have a feeling that we could write it out on a neon sign and hang it right in front of your face, and you'd still ignore it, I imagine at this point just for the sake of having something to complain about.


I don't have to wait? You mean I don't have to wait if I want to subject myself to repeated, needless deaths.

Sure, I can go try right now. But why? Why should I go try something when I already know the outcome?

The outcome being that before tactics ever get considered, the outcome is predetermined based on ship fittings I cannot possibly match yet due to a time constraint imposed through skill development.

To me, I do not find the prospect of empty, meaningless, unavoidable loss as a motivator.

Until I get 1 ship I can fully optimize through skill points things like power grid, cpu, navigation, and capacitor skills maximized, not even taking into consideration weapons/fittings, that fighting opponents who do have those skills already is nothing other than giving away free isk.

The only reason you want new people is for us to bring you free ****
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#397 - 2014-02-25 03:36:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Scipio Artelius
Divine Entervention wrote:
I don't have to wait? You mean I don't have to wait if I want to subject myself to repeated, needless deaths.
Every time I die I feel it's needless and it happens regularly.

There is no correct time to wait to if you want to pvp. Ship losses never stop and the ship you are flying today is already a write-off.

Dinine Entervention wrote:
Sure, I can go try right now. But why?
The advantage in starting early though, is not in protecting your ship from loss, but in building your skills as a player, which will make you a better pvp pilot later on.

Die, burn and get blown up now, while it's cheap. It will give you a great foundation for the future when you are in more expensive ships and fittings, because waiting won't change the rate of death later on, it will just make the process more expensive in ISK terms.

Divine Entervention wrote:
Until I get 1 ship I can fully optimize through skill points things like power grid, cpu, navigation, and capacitor skills maximized, not even taking into consideration weapons/fittings, that fighting opponents who do have those skills already is nothing other than giving away free isk.
If I could suggest, go check some players killboards and then look them up on eveboard and if they have entries, look at their skills.

Very few pilots fly ships they have fully mastered to level 5. There is no need, because you can be very effective in pvp through practice even while building your characters skills.

You are only hampering yourself by not starting pvp now if that's what you want to do. The ship you are flying is at best only a quarter of the factors that determine the outcome of a fight.

The other factors are (2) how you fly the ship, (3) how other ships are commonly fit and (4) how opponents fly their ships.

While you are waiting to build your ship fitting skills, you are missing out on building knowledge and skill in the 3 other areas, all of which are at least as important (and more important) than your characters fitting skills.
Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#398 - 2014-02-25 03:47:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Divine Entervention
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
I don't have to wait? You mean I don't have to wait if I want to subject myself to repeated, needless deaths.
Every time I die I feel it's needless and it happens regularly.

There is no correct time to wait to if you want to pvp. Ship losses never stop and the ship you are flying today is already a write-off.

Dinine Entervention wrote:
Sure, I can go try right now. But why?
The advantage in starting early though, is not in protecting your ship from loss, but in building your skills as a player, which will make you a better pvp pilot later on.

Die, burn and get blown up now, while it's cheap. It will give you a great foundation for the future when you are in more expensive ships and fittings, because waiting won't change the rate of death later on, it will just make the process more expensive in ISK terms.


But knowing I'll never win, why should I try?

I should wait until I have a chance. It's not about the deaths, it's about zero potential for a win. The only way I could win something right now is if the other guy is AFK, and being someone who gets no enjoyment taking things from others who can't fight back, an AFK win would be empty.

There's zero potential right now to possibly win a real fight, because it's already predetermined by skills I'll lose.

There's no possibility to win.

it's snowing outside. I don't want to be cold, i want to be warm.

Should I go outside and yell at the clouds, punch at them and try to beat them into submitting? To unleash some warmth?

No, that's stupid. . . . . The sun is the governor of heat. Why yell at the clouds? That's not smart. . . .

So I'll just sit inside next to the heater where it's warm and wait for spring.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#399 - 2014-02-25 03:51:32 UTC
Divine Entervention wrote:

But knowing I'll never win, why should I try?


Remember when I called you a prey animal?

This is why.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Karon Grandolf
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#400 - 2014-02-25 03:51:44 UTC
Ai Shun wrote:
Cool, so there is another mechanism supported in-game that gives you some way to fight back. It's even better for using other players to help build the sandbox. Thanks Scipio.


The issue here is that only one corner of the sandbox is being worked on, while the castles in the rest is being stomped out or not worked on. Those who like that corner will gladly invite everyone else to join their project of course, while the rest may go have fun on the swings.

The corner boys can then agree that the swing kids just don't get sandboxing.