CSM Campaigns

Quote from the August Summit minutes



You always have the option to fit the way you like but the min/maxers try for the best fit to get the most isk per tick. As long as missions are 'set pieces' then fits will be made for them, not for pvp.

If you want to stop people from fitting for the job make the job variable enough that you have to fit against all possibilities which is what you do in pvp. You make decisions not knowing who or what you will be facing. I assume that is what you meant (partially) by a pvp fit. That and points.

If I go into lowsec on a mission I fit very pvp not for the mission but for what else I might trip across.

But then I kind of need you to define which lowsec pve for me. Are we talking missions? Incursions? FW? Ratting? Exploration?

Each has its own style and needs, some leave you vulnerable more than others and some allow for the antithesis of pvp fits (I am looking at YOU, warp stabbed FW button orbitting frigs).

Do I still care about PvE? Yes
Do I still want to represent PvE to CCP? Hell yes

m

A wild CSM candidate attacks!

It's a real shame that PvP and PvE are so very different. There should be more similarities. I've seen people who have said that they're going to start out in PvE, to 'train' for PvP. Sure, some of the (player) skills are transferrable, but not so many. And the ship fittings certainly aren't.

Yeah, sorry about that.

In my defense, I asked how much discussion, not what discussion. I'm not trolling you for NDA violations, promise!

Good answer.

+1

Are there any podcasts that are too low for even you to stoop to go on?

How will you work to grow the ability of time-limited players to build new play capabilities or actual things in the world?

You mentioned giving up on a WH POS because of 'frustration.' I'm not sure of the background, or whether or not your corp continues to maintain POSes elsewhere. It's something I'm interested in doing, but the challenges seem pretty overwhelming -- fairly significant cost and something of a risk, as even once I've found a site it would be extremely difficult to defend it (a disassembled and stored POS is the same as no POS at all, and mercs are expensive and reliable only to a point).

So that's actually OK. I'll try my hand at it, eventually, as part of a small or midsize corp. I've even scouted a couple of backwater sites that might work for a solo corp. But if it fails, it's not actually the POS that I'm set on -- it's building, actively growing not just assets but actual capabilities.

The things I can do in the game will rise naturally with my skill points, but I can't (much) interact with or affect that (nor should that change). R&D agents are still around for the time being but they're somewhat limited in what they offer me (a minor revenue stream, without a POS or a very great deal of patience); I can also of course just rep grind... but to what end, competing with EACS someday? Deployable structures are exciting, but I'm not sure they offer a change-in-kind in the 'building' department. (Except Siphon units, which kind of do. Although I'm not sure how I feel about painting that big of a target on my head. Plus it means a good amount of daily chores added to my play time. ...Still, intriguing.)

The staring-me-in-the-face answer is to go be a nullbear, of course. But being a drone in someone else's corp isn't really what I'm looking for either; I don't want to get to build things with the caveat that I'm doing it when and where I'm told -- and facing the constant pressure of my higher-ups to commit more to the task.

So where will you take us in this new frontier CCP is hinting at? A land of opportunity for small business, smugglers, artisans and petty thieves? Or just another field to be conquered and divided by Alexander and Hannibal?

Okay, couple ways to come at this so bear with me if I seem to veer off track.

I like to represent the 'little guy' (or gal) but that does not mean that I object to a huge well run organization from having advantages due to BEING large and well run. Their accomplishment of organization in a game of paranoia and distrust should have its benefits. This applies to Goons, BNI, any big organization hi/low/null/wh.

but

I do want to see ways for an individual to make a difference. I don't want every problem to be solved by N+1 where N is the number of ships the other guys bring. I LIKE bombers where a small organized group can scare the hell out of a large fleet. I like deployables where a single guy can refit deep in enemy territory.

But

Look at the Fanfest images from the new frontier . . . it shows a gate being built. Others have commented on that but the takeaway I had was 'damn, gonna need a lot of materials/time/manpower' I just hope there are ways to sneak in the backdoor. Seriously, I got my covops ready and everything.

It comes back to a common cry for several CSMs now. Farms and Fields. If people have a reason to care about their space then an individual with a match will have a way to make them regret caring. I like that. Hannibal and Alexander (funny coincidence, that second name) may have their day but every army has been dogged and followed by the individuals. I'll be with them, waiting, watching, taking what I can and giving nothing back.

Carebears catch a bad rap for 'not playing the game right'. Man o man do I wish all the miners stopped for a week or two. Watched the supplies dwindle and the prices skyrocket. If a gate needs to be built? Materials have to come from somewhere.

To get back to your question

What I bring to the table is the individuals perspective. I am the one who asks 'what can one guy do here?' I look at it from my experience in PvE and highsec. From doing invention and manufacturing and marketing. I play the casual game partially BECAUSE I spend the rest of the time in the metagame . . . CSM and here in the forums. But when new things are proposed, when my opinion is sought that is one of the filters it goes through. I try to see the big picture but then I step to the sides and look at it in each light that I have and can shine on it. Every idea, every concept that has crossed the CSM's oversight I and others on the council have done this process. Maybe we missed things once or twice but I think we have done a good job, so far.

/me pants

if I was not clear, let me know and I will take another swing at it

m

TL;DR
Since its wordy and probably unclear,
What is your stance on healthcare? lol
Seriously, what is your stance on effort being put into a role, and CCP taking the liberty of changing that role and wasting the players effort?
More questions/clarification below, if your feeling ambitious.


Here's an issue that I think is appropriate for a CSM vet

For a game to stay interesting, it supposedly has to keep changing.

If I invest time (gametime=money) into a specific role/ship, then what guarantee, or confidence can I have that that role/ship isnt going to change, therefore waste the time it took training into it?

Marauders being an example, Marauders take a lot of time(money) to train into and utilize correctly. If I had trained into a paladin specifically for its web bonus to be used in incursions, then that time(money) was wasted due to "re-balance" since the Paladin lost its web bonus. That change was approved of by the CSM 8.

Since you were apart of that decision and have seen what sway you have when it comes to these things, what are your feelings about that person who lost what he worked for?
Do you feel that this is a problem, or just something to live with?
What are your feelings on having a say in things that might not be your cup of tea? Ex. assume you dont fly a webbing paladin in incursions, but yet you still have a say in whether the paladin keeps that ability or not.

I think this is an issue for any game that is "balancing" its game play AFTER players have committed to its game play.


Real world example,
You love cats, but the pet store is far away and will take a long time to get there. You take the time and walk to the store, and buy a cat. Somehow it turns into a dog. Is the solution to "learn to love dogs" as EVE would imply.

Personal disclaimers:
I didnt use the paladins web bonus, I just read about the tears, on the rubicon marauder re-balance.
I understand "adapt or die" mentality, dont like it in a game, but understand it.
I dont like cats (very important, i know)
This attention was brought to you by High Drag podcast.
Thank/blame them for it.

What do you see as the biggest failing of CSM8?
What do you see as the biggest failing of CCP over the last year?
What do you think YOU personally, could have done better in CSM8?
What advice do you have for the perspective CSM9 candidates?
What do you see as the largest issue facing CSM9?

I snipped a few bits out, for brevity sake but I hope I kept the gist of the question(s) intact.

I WANT gameplay to change over time so Eve does not become 'boring same old same old'. But the price we pay for change is a shift in what we can and cannot do. Every change has a ripple effect that shifts our abilities and someone is always calling it a nerf to their lifestyle or career choices. Yes, at times, there is a setback or loss of income but a lot of the skills I trained for Maruaders transfer to other ships, other circumstances. Cannot run Incursions? Try missions. Rebalance of frigates? see how they do for exploring/pvp/some new career I don't even know of.

What would (or do) I say to a person who feels robbed? That they still have the skills they did yesterday. They still have the ships and the assets and Eve is a big game. Reship if your marauder does not work and you still want to fly the style you did before. Repurpose if you want to fly the ship and are willing to change tasks to do so. Adapt. This is not an Eve unique problem. Every game has rebalances, nerf to this weapon, OP another and players shift to refocus. I feel it is an industry accepted standard.

When I can see that someone will be seriously affected by a change I do ask if this has been taken into account. Changes in a ship may alter the market values (By the way, Mynnna who is also running is excellent at foreseeing market ramifications and warning CCP of same) A shift that would make a ships main purpose radically shift we, as the CSM would try to make sure some ship still filled the specific role. I do not just comment on things that I fly or do . . . Eve is too interconnected to try to deal with any change in isolation. This is why it is a good idea to HAVE a council who come from all parts of Eve, so we can see it from a dozen different sides and try to cushion unintended impacts.

I liked your analogy but I disagree with how you see CCP and CSM responding.

Your cat is now sometimes a dog? We encourage you to come back and get the new 'real cat' and sell or keep your current cat/dog. Explore what an unexpected pet is like. Embrace the new chances and Vistas that come with a morphing animal. Oh and buy some banana, tomorrow it may get monkeyish.

On a personal note: I own a cat that is classed as the breed closest to thinking it is a dog. . . the Maine Coon. So maybe I am preconditioned to acceptance of uncertainty.

m

I agree that it seems to be the "Industry accepted standard" but I think its a bad standard, like fatal side effects to prescription drugs being an accepted standard. Anyway, Ill save my opinion and ideas for a highly flammable F&I thread.

I appreciate the time and honesty you put into your response.