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New Eden Stock Exchange is Now Open!
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Adams De Cobra
New Eden Stock Exchange
#21 - 2014-02-04 01:04:16 UTC
RAW23 wrote:
OP - I would strongly advise you read this guide to becoming a third party written by Grendell and then reconsider your decision to pursue this business. You are just not in a position to make this work because you have no more reputation for being trustworthy than does the next guy. If A and B don't trust each other, why would they bring in C as a middleman if they also have no reason to trust C?


Thank you for the link mate. But to answer you question it is the same reason people use Chribba to transfer super caps. However, to my knowledge, Chribba does not trade shares between parties. That is what we intend to work with, shares and ISK, nothing more, nothing less. If A and B hate each other anyway, they come to C so one doesn't cheat the other. They both however would rather both of them lose everything compared to one party claiming all of the ISK and the other party robbed. Now, yes, before I get a bunch of hate comments C is a party in the trade. However, C is neutral and will not sway to one party member or the other. So to answer your question, there is no real reason, but peace of mind. Thank you, and I hope that answered your question.
Adams De Cobra
New Eden Stock Exchange
#22 - 2014-02-04 01:13:10 UTC
Batelle wrote:
Even if it wasn't a scam, who would want this service?


Both parties benefit from trading shares. Corporations get ISK for projects or what have you. and the pilot is able to vote, get paid via dividends, and if enough shares are trade take the CEO position. Here is a link for more information on the power of what shares can do to a corporation and shareholders. I hope that answers your question.

https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Shares
Loraine Gess
Confedeferate Union of Tax Legalists
#23 - 2014-02-04 02:46:24 UTC
Cobra you haven't responded to my post.



I have an infinite (as many as you are capable of buying) amount of shares for you to buy. How many do I need to print to empty your wallet? More importantly, how big is your wallet? I need to know if it's worth the effort to even run the vote.
Adams De Cobra
New Eden Stock Exchange
#24 - 2014-02-04 03:07:59 UTC
Loraine Gess wrote:
Cobra you haven't responded to my post.



I have an infinite (as many as you are capable of buying) amount of shares for you to buy. How many do I need to print to empty your wallet? More importantly, how big is your wallet? I need to know if it's worth the effort to even run the vote.



N-EST is used as a last resort if you cannot find anyone who will buy your stock. Have you tried asking others to invest to your corp? If not, I suggest you do that first or ask N-EST to do so. If we don't find anyone that will invest in your stock then N-EST will. But please keep in mind that N-EST will not buy as high as an investor would.
Shares are like currency, the more there is of it, the less it's worth.
N-EST has no comment on it's finances publicly, however N-EST does make an average weekly profit of 500 million ISK. This number is based on all operations and donations, not just stock trades. Thank you for reminding me, and sorry for the delay.
Thoraemond
Far Ranger
#25 - 2014-02-04 03:29:20 UTC
Adams De Cobra wrote:
N-EST has no comment on it's finances publicly, however N-EST does make an average weekly profit of 500 million ISK. This number is based on all operations and donations, not just stock trades.

The phrase "not just stock trades", in that context, suggests that stock trades are something that you've done in the past or are doing now as a source of profit. Is that true? What volume of stock trades have you done (number of clients, number of stocks, amount of ISK that changed hands)? Is there no one who will post a testimonial about your work for them?

If, alternatively, the answer is that you have not done any stock trades for profit in the past, why should anyone think you'll be good at this now?


Adams De Cobra wrote:
N-EST as a middle man will receive a small cut of the profit from the trade
How will the "profit" of the trade be determined?


Adams De Cobra wrote:
Buyers are anonymous for security purposes, if the buyer does not want to be anonymous both parties must agree to have one conversation
How does either party to such a conversation confirm that the other party is anything other than your alt?


Adams De Cobra wrote:
Please keep in mind we do not have that many agents!

By "agents", you mean players, right?
How many agents do you have?
Who are they?

• Graph re Market Order Broker Fees (Updated 2016-04-28) • Diagram re Skills for Remote Trading •
Nedly Stark
ARAZ Engineering
#26 - 2014-02-04 04:40:11 UTC
Still waiting for question to be answered.
Castiel-zan Vex-ar
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#27 - 2014-02-04 05:03:21 UTC
Adams De Cobra wrote:
Dear Clients,

It has come to my attention that although it is safer for the buyer's name to be hidden, N-EST has changed its approach. N-EST would like to have a single conversation to ensure both parties are not scammed. We hope this will ensure an even safer trade between the two parties to show them both that we really do mean business here and do not plan on taking anything. I would like to thank the pilots that help us, N-EST, find better way and help us improve our trade relations. Here at N-EST we will adapt to what policies you want, not what we want. The client experience is what we are worried about the most. Once again a shout out to those that innovate us, we salute you!


I like this new approach better than the old is my investment really there? I feel that you should have started with this method before you made N-EST. Although stocks did flow, it didn't feel as safe then as the new improvements to the 'system'. After reading the OP though I think you should put these edits in there so that there is less confusion with the new and the old. But thank you for helping trade the stock between "the dawns light" and me. Although the corp is old and has a low member count I hope to see it rise with a new cash flow from the 200 stocks I purchased. I hope they do not waste it. However I am satisfied with my transaction thus far. Keep up the good work!! Big smile

PS I do hope that you will soon be able to get the bigger named corporations instead of the new corps that are starting out.
Thoraemond
Far Ranger
#28 - 2014-02-04 06:28:02 UTC
Castiel-zan Vex-ar wrote:
[...] thank you for helping trade the stock between "the dawns light" and me. Although the corp is old and has a low member count I hope to see it rise with a new cash flow from the 200 stocks I purchased. I hope they do not waste it. However I am satisfied with my transaction thus far.

When was this transaction?

How much do you claim to have paid for 200 shares?

How much did you pay "Adams De Cobra", or one of his "agents" to do so?

What has caused you, thus far, to be satisfied with your transaction? Has that corporation paid dividends?

What would prompt anyone to buy shares in a corporation that the CEO described as "defunct" in 2012, at which time he tried to sell the corporation?

• Graph re Market Order Broker Fees (Updated 2016-04-28) • Diagram re Skills for Remote Trading •
Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises
Otherworld Empire
#29 - 2014-02-04 06:58:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Chribba
Adams De Cobra wrote:
However, to my knowledge, Chribba does not trade shares between parties.
I assist in pretty much anything that requires trust that pilots need (even trading corpses), but can't say shares is among the common types, but it has been done from time to time.

Also a thought on this;
Quote:
*-Your name will not be mentioned and two chats will occur. This is to keep you anonymous to protect the buyer. Only on special occasions and mistakes made on N-ESTs side will any information be shared.
You are aware that the moment the shares land in the buyers wallet, the selling corp can see who owns shares in their corp right?

/c

★★★ Secure 3rd party service ★★★

Visit my in-game channel 'Holy Veldspar'

Twitter @ChribbaVeldspar
RAW23
#30 - 2014-02-04 07:34:18 UTC
Adams De Cobra wrote:
RAW23 wrote:
OP - I would strongly advise you read this guide to becoming a third party written by Grendell and then reconsider your decision to pursue this business. You are just not in a position to make this work because you have no more reputation for being trustworthy than does the next guy. If A and B don't trust each other, why would they bring in C as a middleman if they also have no reason to trust C?


Thank you for the link mate. But to answer you question it is the same reason people use Chribba to transfer super caps. However, to my knowledge, Chribba does not trade shares between parties. That is what we intend to work with, shares and ISK, nothing more, nothing less. If A and B hate each other anyway, they come to C so one doesn't cheat the other. They both however would rather both of them lose everything compared to one party claiming all of the ISK and the other party robbed. Now, yes, before I get a bunch of hate comments C is a party in the trade. However, C is neutral and will not sway to one party member or the other. So to answer your question, there is no real reason, but peace of mind. Thank you, and I hope that answered your question.


You missed the point of the question, I'm afraid:

Quote:

If A and B don't trust each other, why would they bring in C as a middleman if they also have no reason to trust C?


Without already having a well-established reputation, introducing a third party C just doubles the avenues of risk for A and B without mitigating any trust issues at all.

There are two types of EVE player:

those who believe there are two types of EVE player and those who do not.
Loraine Gess
Confedeferate Union of Tax Legalists
#31 - 2014-02-04 09:24:16 UTC
Adams De Cobra wrote:
Loraine Gess wrote:
Cobra you haven't responded to my post.



I have an infinite (as many as you are capable of buying) amount of shares for you to buy. How many do I need to print to empty your wallet? More importantly, how big is your wallet? I need to know if it's worth the effort to even run the vote.



N-EST is used as a last resort if you cannot find anyone who will buy your stock. Have you tried asking others to invest to your corp? If not, I suggest you do that first or ask N-EST to do so. If we don't find anyone that will invest in your stock then N-EST will. But please keep in mind that N-EST will not buy as high as an investor would.
Shares are like currency, the more there is of it, the less it's worth.
N-EST has no comment on it's finances publicly, however N-EST does make an average weekly profit of 500 million ISK. This number is based on all operations and donations, not just stock trades. Thank you for reminding me, and sorry for the delay.




Please quote me an exchange rate so I can start printing shares.
Setsune Rin
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#32 - 2014-02-04 14:29:55 UTC
how the hell does a presumably 2y+ pilot not know that corporation stocks are a joke?

they have some VEERRRYYY limited uses, and using them like you would actual RL stocks is not one of them



this entire thread had made me both laught and cringe though, but i thank you for the moments entertainment
Adams De Cobra
New Eden Stock Exchange
#33 - 2014-02-04 21:08:37 UTC
Nedly Stark wrote:
Still waiting for question to be answered.


Sorry for the delay. Stocks can change by how well a corporation is doing. For example, if a corporation is getting more kills and less losses then said corporation would have a higher stock price than if it were the other way around. It also depends on how many shares have been created within the corp. For example, A corp that has 1,000 shares would have a higher share price, and a corporation that has 1,000,000 shares would have a lower share price. However, both are variables within the price equation. N-EST may suggest a price on a share if both parties do not agree with each other if wanted. Another variable is how much the buyer is willing to pay for the shares versus what the seller wants for them.
Adams De Cobra
New Eden Stock Exchange
#34 - 2014-02-04 21:25:08 UTC
@Thoraemond:

Q: The phrase "not just stock trades", in that context, suggests that stock trades are something that you've done in the past or are doing now as a source of profit. Is that true? What volume of stock trades have you done (number of clients, number of stocks, amount of ISK that changed hands)? Is there no one who will post a testimonial about your work for them? If, alternatively, the answer is that you have not done any stock trades for profit in the past, why should anyone think you'll be good at this now?
A: Yes, we have done a few stock exchanges in the past, but on a small level, normally around 1-10 thousand shares, and in the past I have worked with a few clients. I don't believe people are posting testimonials because in the past I have worked solo and now I am going to try and grow this type of trade.

Q: How will the "profit" of the trade be determined?
A: Very easily, N-EST will take 10% normally, this can change if we are having some sort of celebration or if you have a higher standing with N-EST. Having a high standing with N-EST is simple; the more trades you do, the higher your standing. And the standing system is easy to fallow. For every point of standing you gain 0.1% tax is reduced from N-EST's profit.

Q: How does either party to such a conversation confirm that the other party is anything other than your alt?
A: I only have one alt and that alt is being deleted. If you would like the name I will post it. However, you can always ask the CEO of the corporation either party is in if they have any alts and who they are. Excluding NPC corporations of course.

Q: By "agents", you mean players, right? How many agents do you have? Who are they?
A: Agents refers to the pilots that work for N-EST, correct. Currently N-EST has two agents, but we do plan on growing. Currently only myself is in the N-EST Corporation, however we are awaiting reply of other pilots. Our other agent's name is Arin De Cobra.

If you have further questions go ahead!
Adams De Cobra
New Eden Stock Exchange
#35 - 2014-02-04 21:27:53 UTC
@Chribba

Q: You are aware that the moment the shares land in the buyers wallet, the selling corp can see who owns shares in their corp right?
A: Yes, I am aware that is why we changed having two convos to only having one. I did not update the original post, that was my fault and I'm sorry for the confusion.
Nedly Stark
ARAZ Engineering
#36 - 2014-02-04 21:41:12 UTC
So you could raise a stock price from 100 isk to 15,000 with a snap of the fingers. Seems legit.
Adams De Cobra
New Eden Stock Exchange
#37 - 2014-02-04 21:43:10 UTC
@Loraine Gess

Please convo or message me and we will work out a deal. Also note that the more shared you "print" the less the shares are worth. However to prove that I'm willing to trade shares with you, Seeing that your corp consists of 4 members, but is highly effective in combat. I would quote your shares, if at 1,000, approximately 25,000 ISK/Share. However, since you are trading with N-EST the deduction will be 20%. This in mind the share price will be reduced to approximately 20,000 ISK/Share. Keep in mind that it is a good idea for the CEO to handle 51% of the shares. N-EST will negotiate on a price for your shares.
Adams De Cobra
New Eden Stock Exchange
#38 - 2014-02-04 21:46:07 UTC
Nedly Stark wrote:
So you could raise a stock price from 100 isk to 15,000 with a snap of the fingers. Seems legit.


It wouldn't be in the snap of a finger, it would take time depending upon the circumstances. N-EST however only will offer a price, not dictate the price of the stocks. If that makes sense.
Nedly Stark
ARAZ Engineering
#39 - 2014-02-04 21:58:14 UTC
No it doesnt make sense. Price of stocks move on supply & demand through automation when traders buy and sell. I guess what im getting at here is stock valuation and If you dont dictate the stock price, then what/who does? And how?
Jamwara DelCalicoe Ashley
New Eden Tech Support
#40 - 2014-02-05 23:11:18 UTC
This entire thread is worthless ... except for what Chribba said.

Thank me later :D
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