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SOE Nestor Battleship discussion

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Phaade
LowKey Ops
Snuffed Out
#41 - 2014-02-01 00:38:15 UTC
In fact, it's actually comical that some developer in CCP thought this through for weeks, and STILL released it!
The Djego
Hellequin Inc.
#42 - 2014-02-01 02:52:04 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:

The bonus to probing and hacking is hilarious.

Nestor warps to sig. If Nestor is not scrambled by intie while aligning, Intie will be waiting for it at sig when it arrives.

Nestor is at hacking site, intie jumps in warps to site, scrambles Nestor before its even halfway to warp..

Its just not practical to have a billion + isk battleship doing hacking when you have interceptors that can literally lock, warp and run circles around battleships with impunity.


Well my major problem is mostly that the bonus combination together with the slot layout, cap, sig and other stuff doesn't really make it useful for a particular task. I would agree that a relative slow moving BS is not the ideal platform in hostile territory to do plexing, however every BS can be tackled by a interceptor without much chances to counter it, so it isn't really a exclusive problem of the nestor.

Improve discharge rigging: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=246166&find=unread
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#43 - 2014-02-01 02:59:06 UTC  |  Edited by: IIshira
Okay so from what most posters are saying it's an expensive collectible. With the multiple sentry drone nerfs of Rubicon 1.1 maybe a drone boat wasn't such a great idea for a new battleship.

I was hoping it had a use other than ship spinning and I was just missing it Sad
Mario Putzo
#44 - 2014-02-01 03:32:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Mario Putzo
IIshira wrote:
Okay so from what most posters are saying it's an expensive collectible. With the multiple sentry drone nerfs of Rubicon 1.1 maybe a drone boat wasn't such a great idea for a new battleship.

I was hoping it had a use other than ship spinning and I was just missing it Sad


2 of these bad boys is all you need.

[Nestor, Nestor]

2x 500W Infectious Power System Malfunction
3x E500 Prototype Energy Vampire
Large S95a Remote Shield Booster
Large 'Solace' Remote Armor Repairer

2x Large Shield Extender II
2x Dread Guristas Adaptive Invulnerability Field
Dread Guristas EM Ward Field
Dread Guristas Thermic Dissipation Field

2x 1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II
Damage Control II
3x Imperial Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane

Large Anti-Explosive Pump II
Large Anti-Kinetic Screen Reinforcer II
Large Capacitor Control Circuit II

5x Heavy Shield Maintenance Bot II
5x Heavy Armor Maintenance Bot II
5x Heavy Armor Maintenance Bot II
5x Heavy Shield Maintenance Bot II


Effective HP: 231,965 (Eve: 205,720)
Tank Ability: 122.90 DPS
Damage Profile - Omni-Damage (EM: 25.00%, Ex: 25.00%, Ki: 25.00%, Th: 25.00%)
Shield Resists - EM: 79.14%, Ex: 81.57%, Ki: 82.30%, Th: 83.31%
Armor Resists - EM: 82.32%, Ex: 73.83%, Ki: 77.02%, Th: 77.02%
Ersahi Kir
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#45 - 2014-02-01 05:37:15 UTC
Mario Putzo wrote:
2 of these bad boys is all you need.

[Nestor, Nestor]

2x 500W Infectious Power System Malfunction
3x E500 Prototype Energy Vampire
Large S95a Remote Shield Booster
Large 'Solace' Remote Armor Repairer

2x Large Shield Extender II
2x Dread Guristas Adaptive Invulnerability Field
Dread Guristas EM Ward Field
Dread Guristas Thermic Dissipation Field

2x 1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II
Damage Control II
3x Imperial Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane

Large Anti-Explosive Pump II
Large Anti-Kinetic Screen Reinforcer II
Large Capacitor Control Circuit II

5x Heavy Shield Maintenance Bot II
5x Heavy Armor Maintenance Bot II
5x Heavy Armor Maintenance Bot II
5x Heavy Shield Maintenance Bot II


Effective HP: 231,965 (Eve: 205,720)
Tank Ability: 122.90 DPS
Damage Profile - Omni-Damage (EM: 25.00%, Ex: 25.00%, Ki: 25.00%, Th: 25.00%)
Shield Resists - EM: 79.14%, Ex: 81.57%, Ki: 82.30%, Th: 83.31%
Armor Resists - EM: 82.32%, Ex: 73.83%, Ki: 77.02%, Th: 77.02%


This is why we need downvotes.
Bertrand Butler
Cras es Noster
#46 - 2014-02-01 07:34:07 UTC
When the only thing you can think of for a hull is a very expensive bait setup because everyone wants to kill it with fire, then the hull in question has a lot of problems to begin with.

[Nestor, LPS N B-J]

1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II
1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II
Corelum C-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Corelum C-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Reactive Armor Hardener
Damage Control II

True Sansha Heavy Capacitor Booster, Navy Cap Booster 800
Federation Navy Stasis Webifier
Federation Navy Stasis Webifier
Republic Fleet Warp Scrambler
Republic Fleet Warp Disruptor
Core C-Type 100MN Microwarpdrive

Cynosural Field Generator I
Heavy Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Heavy Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Heavy Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Heavy Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Dual Heavy Beam Laser II, Microwave L
Drone Link Augmentor II

Large Trimark Armor Pump II
Large Trimark Armor Pump II
Large Trimark Armor Pump II

Garde II x5
Bouncer II x5
Hornet EC-300 x5
Vespa EC-600 x5
Warrior II x5
Warrior II x5
Warden II x5
Boudacca Sangrere
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#47 - 2014-02-01 18:57:02 UTC
Mario Putzo wrote:
Boudacca Sangrere wrote:
EvE is about choices. About having your cake OR eating it. In my opinion the crux with the Nestor is that it is neither good at getting the cake, nor at eating it (I hope you excuse my food based analogy, but I am hungry).

Fear not, there are solutions. I do think a Cov Ops cloak would be quite nice actually and very, very useful. Alas, it would seem to be a bit overpowered. So how about "greying" out all high slots (and locking the drone bay) while having one fitted? Especially, with some of the nice new modules (mobile depot, D-scan inhibitor, etc.) it would give pilots an incentive to use these (and use up cargo), which leads to making choices...

An additional low (at the cost of an mid slot) would be also very helpful (the Nestor IS an Armor ship after all), in order to give the Nestor a place and proper role.

Just fly,

B.



That doesn't even make any sense.

if I wanted a cloaky cargo bay id just befirend a Covops Hauler.



I think you missunderstood. The point is, that WHILE you fit a cov ops cloak, you won't have too much combat abilities. But thanks to Mobile Depot you can swap the cloak out and have the full dps abilities... Remember, having cake OR eating it.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#48 - 2014-02-02 04:38:56 UTC
The Djego wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:

The bonus to probing and hacking is hilarious.

Nestor warps to sig. If Nestor is not scrambled by intie while aligning, Intie will be waiting for it at sig when it arrives.

Nestor is at hacking site, intie jumps in warps to site, scrambles Nestor before its even halfway to warp..

Its just not practical to have a billion + isk battleship doing hacking when you have interceptors that can literally lock, warp and run circles around battleships with impunity.


Well my major problem is mostly that the bonus combination together with the slot layout, cap, sig and other stuff doesn't really make it useful for a particular task. I would agree that a relative slow moving BS is not the ideal platform in hostile territory to do plexing, however every BS can be tackled by a interceptor without much chances to counter it, so it isn't really a exclusive problem of the nestor.

Yeah I see what you're saying. Just that none of the other battleships have bonuses to hacking. It might be doable to use it with a improved cloak, just have to hope and pray that your not in the process of catching can spew if something comes into local since I think can spew would prevent you cloaking up quick.

And yeah the slot layout is junk.

T3 with hacking systems so much better.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#49 - 2014-02-03 08:40:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Kagura Nikon
Hiton Kado wrote:
From what I've read many people use spider tanking Dominix's, especially in wormholes but also in other parts of EVE. Would the Nestor not just fill exactly that role but do it even better?



at 12 times the cost does not qualify as better.. when the slot layout cancels the advantage of the resist bonus. 5 mids were enough for the cruiser.. so the Battleship shoudl have kept 5 mids and got 1 more low slot. THat woudl have made HUGE difference on ship potential.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#50 - 2014-02-03 08:41:40 UTC
Bertrand Butler wrote:
When the only thing you can think of for a hull is a very expensive bait setup because everyone wants to kill it with fire, then the hull in question has a lot of problems to begin with.

[Nestor, LPS N B-J]

1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II
1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II
Corelum C-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Corelum C-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Reactive Armor Hardener
Damage Control II

True Sansha Heavy Capacitor Booster, Navy Cap Booster 800
Federation Navy Stasis Webifier
Federation Navy Stasis Webifier
Republic Fleet Warp Scrambler
Republic Fleet Warp Disruptor
Core C-Type 100MN Microwarpdrive

Cynosural Field Generator I
Heavy Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Heavy Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Heavy Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Heavy Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Dual Heavy Beam Laser II, Microwave L
Drone Link Augmentor II

Large Trimark Armor Pump II
Large Trimark Armor Pump II
Large Trimark Armor Pump II

Garde II x5
Bouncer II x5
Hornet EC-300 x5
Vespa EC-600 x5
Warrior II x5
Warrior II x5
Warden II x5


Why not use a marauder for that? A bit under half the price.... will live longer...

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Bertrand Butler
Cras es Noster
#51 - 2014-02-03 09:29:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Bertrand Butler
You could also use a Prophecy or even a Navy auguror if oyu wanted to spend less money. The reason for suggesting a Nestor is that everyone wants to kill a Nestor...C:
Ersahi Kir
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#52 - 2014-02-03 15:09:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Ersahi Kir
The ship is just so limited in any role that it would have. it lacks the powergrid to be a lazer sniper, it lacks the lows to be a brick tank, and it has all of the limitations of a battleship when it comes to exploration. I tried to play with a remote rep fit and it was comically bad compared to a guardian. The only thing the ship had going for it, being a drone boat, is less useful now that drones have been nerfed somewhat.

I was hoping there would be some tiny niche for this ship where it would be ok, but this ship is the poster child for the idea that if a ship isn't designed to do something well it's going to be terrible at everything. At least that gives it plenty of time to frolic in the asteroid belts with the other misfit spaceships like the tempest.
Steph Livingston
Neko's Blanket
#53 - 2014-02-03 16:48:35 UTC
I've played around with the Nestor a little bit, and I agree it has a few issues. I don't think it's a terrible ship, but the lack of focus really hurts it's effectiveness in... well everything.

If you ignore the Nestor's price for the time being, and compare it to a similar ship like the Armageddon, the weaknesses become apparent. The first, and most important, weakness many people have touched on in this thread already. The Nestor has around 80% the power-grid of the Armageddon, and gains 20% more CPU. On paper this sounds like a decent trade off, but in reality it's quite excessive. Even though the Nestor may have lost a low, and gain two additional mid slots, I'm not sure why this swing was so drastic, it makes fitting highs extremely difficult.

Personally, I'd like to see the Powergrid shifted to around: 12125-12850 mW, and the CPU to around 580-600 TF, around a 5% to 10% shift instead of the excessive 20% change we currently have.

Second, and slightly less apparent, is the Nestor's lack of speed. I know the SoE ships are supposed to be trading top speed for agility and sustainability, but without a cloak (note: I still dont think the Nestor should have the covert ops) the Nestor's top speed is a liability that detracts from several of the role bonuses. Because it gets a large energy weapon optimal range, and not tracking or damage bonus, the Nestor should be attempting to set the combat range. The problem is, it has no way to manage that, it's slower then the majority of other BS vessels which makes the window where optimal range makes a difference very small.

This can also be a problem when using remote reps. Although the Nestor is fine in a static engagement, when a fleet is on the move it will probably have issues keeping up with it's rep targets. Not a pleasant situation.

I don't think it should be the fastest BS, but it should have a respectable max speed in order to have some options. I'd like to see it in the 105-110 m/s range, but it's hard to gauge with the lower mass.

If those two issues were fixed I think the Nestor would be a respectable ship, not as feared as some, but usable.
Z'zauoe Euopaeqorua
Doomheim
#54 - 2014-02-05 08:47:43 UTC
No cov ops cloak. It's the same **** than Black Ops.

Good for reprocessing. It melts down nicely in reprocessing facility.
Shpenat
Ironman Inc.
#55 - 2014-02-07 14:49:13 UTC
Z'zauoe Euopaeqorua wrote:
No cov ops cloak. It's the same **** than Black Ops.

Good for reprocessing. It melts down nicely in reprocessing facility.


There is never going to be cov ops cloaky battleship. So please stop asking for one.

Nestor has quite strong focus but lacks stats to support it. It could serve as really great black ops logistics ship, but it does not belong to black ops family. It has way to weak capacitor to actually use that huge rep bonus it has. It does not offer much on the field of firepower that would justify its usage.

I personally would vote for nestor becoming pirate variant of black ops ships. The only problem with that is the general concept of T2=specialization, Navy and pirate= all around better.
Kiryen O'Bannon
SUNDERING
Goonswarm Federation
#56 - 2014-02-07 15:13:46 UTC
The Nestor suffers from trying to resemble to 2 smaller SOE ships too much in stats. The exploration bonuses serve no purpose. Those should be removed and replaced for a BLOPS style cloak speeds bonus. Trading some CPU forPG would be good to. Those changes would at leastmean it had bonuses useful on a BB hull and had a niche as a cloakable RR battleship.

Eternal Father, King of birth, /Who didst create the heaven and earth, /And bid the planets and the sun/ Their own appointed orbits run; /O hear us when we seek thy grace /For those who soar through outer space.
Z'zauoe Euopaeqorua
Doomheim
#57 - 2014-02-07 16:35:21 UTC
Shpenat wrote:
Z'zauoe Euopaeqorua wrote:
No cov ops cloak. It's the same **** than Black Ops.

Good for reprocessing. It melts down nicely in reprocessing facility.


There is never going to be cov ops cloaky battleship. So please stop asking for one.
Oh yeah? Do you work at CCP?

Any black ops ship with covert ops cloak would still be just very expensive and very bad battleship.
Damien White
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#58 - 2014-02-18 20:16:49 UTC
Z'zauoe Euopaeqorua wrote:
Oh yeah? Do you work at CCP?

In the "CCP asks the players about the Nestor" Thread it was statet multiple times by CCP that there will be no Cov Ops Cloack BS.

The thread itself is an interesting read with lots of interesting ideas for the ship wich then got ignored by CCP although that beeing the reason for the thread.


Anyway, now, nearly a month after implementation, has anyone found a niche for this ship where he would pay the money for it and doesnt want to change back to a different Ship?

97% of girls would die if Justin Bieber were about to jump off a cliff. Post this in your sig if you`re part of the 3% yelling,

"DO A BARREL ROLL!"
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#59 - 2014-02-18 23:39:17 UTC
Damien White wrote:
Anyway, now, nearly a month after implementation, has anyone found a niche for this ship where he would pay the money for it and doesnt want to change back to a different Ship?

I would like to know this too.

At about double the price of other pirate faction battleships I would expect the Nestor to do something awesome
Victoria Thorne
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#60 - 2014-02-18 23:54:43 UTC
IIshira wrote:
Damien White wrote:
Anyway, now, nearly a month after implementation, has anyone found a niche for this ship where he would pay the money for it and doesnt want to change back to a different Ship?

I would like to know this too.

At about double the price of other pirate faction battleships I would expect the Nestor to do something awesome



It has achieved awesomeness. It has managed to become a Pirate Faction battleship that (seemingly) no one thinks is OP. That has to be the greatest achievement of any ship.