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Providing the 'New Player Experience' Ourselves
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Sand Shardani
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#21 - 2014-01-15 13:01:35 UTC
dexington wrote:
Sand Shardani wrote:
Vets can sign up voluntarily to be mentors and new players that sign up will be given a mentor. I think a personal chat room for the two would be sufficient. The newb asks questions and the vet guides. They don't have to be in the corp but could, they don't have to be in the same space, etc. Match it to timezone and the like.


That's how the npc corps work.


Have you been in an NPC recently? Or the rookie channel? Can feel very over whelming to a new player. I only suggest an alternative that would be more one-on-one.

The only problem I see is it gives d-holes an opportunity to bait newbs to low sec for tears. Which I agree is part of the game but there is a time a place for everything.
Angelica Dreamstar
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#22 - 2014-01-15 13:02:00 UTC
Sand Shardani wrote:
I support this idea and or service.

But I think CCP could code it in the game. It would be great if in addition to the corp system there was a mentor program. Vets can sign up voluntarily to be mentors and new players that sign up will be given a mentor. I think a personal chat room for the two would be sufficient. The newb asks questions and the vet guides. They don't have to be in the corp but could, they don't have to be in the same space, etc. Match it to timezone and the like.

It would simply give the new player a more personal experience with learning the game.

We don't need that crap. What we need are more people actually playing with them. You keep talking crap, I do the rest. You lot manage to make it even worse than it is now. It's your fault it came to this in the first place!

bingo, his pig not being a goat doesn't make the pig wrong, just him an idiot for shouting at his pig "WHY ARENT YOU A GOAT!" (Source)

-- Ralph King-Griffin, about deranged people playing EVE ONLINE
Angelica Dreamstar
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2014-01-15 13:03:18 UTC
Sand Shardani wrote:
The only problem I see is it gives d-holes an opportunity to bait newbs to low sec for tears. Which I agree is part of the game but there is a time a place for everything.
This clearly shows that you lack any qualification for this kind of thing and that you have no clue what you are talking about. On so many levels.

bingo, his pig not being a goat doesn't make the pig wrong, just him an idiot for shouting at his pig "WHY ARENT YOU A GOAT!" (Source)

-- Ralph King-Griffin, about deranged people playing EVE ONLINE
Bel Tika
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#24 - 2014-01-15 13:09:51 UTC
The brutal truth of the matter is Eve is 10 year old, in that time it has had nigh no competition to its genre and still it lacked the draw to bring in relevant numbers, ppl have constantly came left an came again but never stuck around. after 10 years and now with other space mmo's on the horizon i honestly dont think anything will change, if anything it dont look bright.

People keep saying newbs leave because there not prepared blah de blah, you ever thought newbs leave because your play style doesnt interest them at all an they just wannae be left to do there own thing?

Every "MMO" i have played has been primarily made up of pve players, games ranging from SWG to SWTOR, ultima, wow,EQ,EQ2 etc an the thing i found in most is even though players will join guilds/corps etc an be chatty for the most part they just want to login an do there own thing an maybe participate in corp activities once or twice a weeks, the "problem" or lack there of with eve is well you cant do that for the most part its that simple.

PPl that play mmo for the most part i find play for the progression, the feeling of constantly advancing, bettering yourself so to speak, in eve thats what you fly at the basic core of it, so it takes you to the fundamental problem and rule, do not fly what you cannot afford to lose, the problem with that is alot of ppl join with the mindset of BIG is good so inherently go for a Battleship that is ridiculously easy to train for and well everyone probably knows that outcome.

I'm rambling so i shut up with one more thing, the problem with Eve is Eve
Angelica Dreamstar
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2014-01-15 13:13:15 UTC
Bel Tika wrote:
The brutal truth of the matter is Eve is 10 year old, in that time it has had nigh no competition to its genre and still it lacked the draw to bring in relevant numbers, ppl have constantly came left an came again but never stuck around. after 10 years and now with other space mmo's on the horizon i honestly dont think anything will change, if anything it dont look bright.

People keep saying newbs leave because there not prepared blah de blah, you ever thought newbs leave because your play style doesnt interest them at all an they just wannae be left to do there own thing?

Every "MMO" i have played has been primarily made up of pve players, games ranging from SWG to SWTOR, ultima, wow,EQ,EQ2 etc an the thing i found in most is even though players will join guilds/corps etc an be chatty for the most part they just want to login an do there own thing an maybe participate in corp activities once or twice a weeks, the "problem" or lack there of with eve is well you cant do that for the most part its that simple.

PPl that play mmo for the most part i find play for the progression, the feeling of constantly advancing, bettering yourself so to speak, in eve thats what you fly at the basic core of it, so it takes you to the fundamental problem and rule, do not fly what you cannot afford to lose, the problem with that is alot of ppl join with the mindset of BIG is good so inherently go for a Battleship that is ridiculously easy to train for and well everyone probably knows that outcome.

I'm rambling so i shut up with one more thing, the problem with Eve is Eve
I should wardec your corp just to see what's inside. ^^

bingo, his pig not being a goat doesn't make the pig wrong, just him an idiot for shouting at his pig "WHY ARENT YOU A GOAT!" (Source)

-- Ralph King-Griffin, about deranged people playing EVE ONLINE
Bel Tika
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#26 - 2014-01-15 13:16:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Bel Tika
Angelica Dreamstar wrote:
Bel Tika wrote:
The brutal truth of the matter is Eve is 10 year old, in that time it has had nigh no competition to its genre and still it lacked the draw to bring in relevant numbers, ppl have constantly came left an came again but never stuck around. after 10 years and now with other space mmo's on the horizon i honestly dont think anything will change, if anything it dont look bright.

People keep saying newbs leave because there not prepared blah de blah, you ever thought newbs leave because your play style doesnt interest them at all an they just wannae be left to do there own thing?

Every "MMO" i have played has been primarily made up of pve players, games ranging from SWG to SWTOR, ultima, wow,EQ,EQ2 etc an the thing i found in most is even though players will join guilds/corps etc an be chatty for the most part they just want to login an do there own thing an maybe participate in corp activities once or twice a weeks, the "problem" or lack there of with eve is well you cant do that for the most part its that simple.

PPl that play mmo for the most part i find play for the progression, the feeling of constantly advancing, bettering yourself so to speak, in eve thats what you fly at the basic core of it, so it takes you to the fundamental problem and rule, do not fly what you cannot afford to lose, the problem with that is alot of ppl join with the mindset of BIG is good so inherently go for a Battleship that is ridiculously easy to train for and well everyone probably knows that outcome.

I'm rambling so i shut up with one more thing, the problem with Eve is Eve
I should wardec your corp just to see what's inside. ^^


rofl angelica you'd find tumbleweed the now

edit well guess you'll find out for yourself lol
Angelica Dreamstar
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2014-01-15 13:16:48 UTC
Bel Tika wrote:
rofl angelica you'd find tumbleweed the now
Over 30 members.

You can do better than tumbleweed.

bingo, his pig not being a goat doesn't make the pig wrong, just him an idiot for shouting at his pig "WHY ARENT YOU A GOAT!" (Source)

-- Ralph King-Griffin, about deranged people playing EVE ONLINE
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#28 - 2014-01-15 13:23:39 UTC
Sand Shardani wrote:
dexington wrote:
Sand Shardani wrote:
Vets can sign up voluntarily to be mentors and new players that sign up will be given a mentor. I think a personal chat room for the two would be sufficient. The newb asks questions and the vet guides. They don't have to be in the corp but could, they don't have to be in the same space, etc. Match it to timezone and the like.


That's how the npc corps work.


Have you been in an NPC recently? Or the rookie channel? Can feel very over whelming to a new player. I only suggest an alternative that would be more one-on-one.

The only problem I see is it gives d-holes an opportunity to bait newbs to low sec for tears. Which I agree is part of the game but there is a time a place for everything.


I'm in a npc corp every time i log in, so yes i've been in one recently.

I agree with it might not be obvious to new players how the npc corps actually work, and what they are. There are people trying to grief and scam in the npc's, but there are always players pointing out the obvious scam. You can't really protect people from fleet ganks, but in general if some says he lost a ship there almost always someone who gives some isk to get a new ship.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.
Ptraci
3 R Corporation
#29 - 2014-01-15 13:46:40 UTC
Bel Tika wrote:
The brutal truth of the matter is Eve is 10 year old, in that time it has had nigh no competition to its genre and still it lacked the draw to bring in relevant numbers, ppl have constantly came left an came again but never stuck around.


That's because people come expecting something like "Freelancer" which is, after all, what the "genre" was before EVE. Freelancer or Elite or even something like Starflight. I can't believe the amount of times I've heard newbies ask how they can control their ship directly with the mouse. When they learn that EVE is about strategy and tactics, not pointing the front of your ship at the plus sign and shooting, most leave disappointed.

The rest who stick with it for longer are bewildered by the size and complexity of the economy. It's hard to make ISK when you have no idea what you're doing. They end up wasting money on buying the wrong modules that they're missing skills on, they get scammed both on the market and off. Etc. Those final few who manage to make it through the initial phase of the learning curve might have a chance at sticking around even longer to discover other player organizations outside of mission gankers and miner bumpers.
Victoria Sin
Doomheim
#30 - 2014-01-15 14:09:51 UTC
Ptraci wrote:

That's because people come expecting something like "Freelancer" which is, after all, what the "genre" was before EVE. Freelancer or Elite or even something like Starflight. I can't believe the amount of times I've heard newbies ask how they can control their ship directly with the mouse. When they learn that EVE is about strategy and tactics, not pointing the front of your ship at the plus sign and shooting, most leave disappointed.


Yes, CCP's marketing of Eve is extremely misleading especially videos which are rendered outside of game. Actual game-play is often nothing like the renders and movies in the adverts.
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#31 - 2014-01-15 14:22:30 UTC
Bel Tika wrote:
The brutal truth of the matter is Eve is 10 year old, in that time it has had nigh no competition to its genre and still it lacked the draw to bring in relevant numbers, ppl have constantly came left an came again but never stuck around. after 10 years and now with other space mmo's on the horizon i honestly dont think anything will change, if anything it dont look bright.

People keep saying newbs leave because there not prepared blah de blah, you ever thought newbs leave because your play style doesnt interest them at all an they just wannae be left to do there own thing?

Every "MMO" i have played has been primarily made up of pve players, games ranging from SWG to SWTOR, ultima, wow,EQ,EQ2 etc an the thing i found in most is even though players will join guilds/corps etc an be chatty for the most part they just want to login an do there own thing an maybe participate in corp activities once or twice a weeks, the "problem" or lack there of with eve is well you cant do that for the most part its that simple.

PPl that play mmo for the most part i find play for the progression, the feeling of constantly advancing, bettering yourself so to speak, in eve thats what you fly at the basic core of it, so it takes you to the fundamental problem and rule, do not fly what you cannot afford to lose, the problem with that is alot of ppl join with the mindset of BIG is good so inherently go for a Battleship that is ridiculously easy to train for and well everyone probably knows that outcome.

I'm rambling so i shut up with one more thing, the problem with Eve is Eve


Confirming that most of the time I just want to be left alone to do my thing. Blink

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!
Haedonism Bot
People for the Ethical Treatment of Rogue Drones
#32 - 2014-01-15 14:34:44 UTC
Angelica Dreamstar wrote:
Eveuni ... corrupt leadership, decadent, bloated, creates and supports hivemind stupidity and hiding behind the group.


A couple of years ago all of those things were absolutely true. The last CEO, Kelduum Revaan, was dangerously incompetent and made E-Uni the laughing stock of EVE. Since he stepped down, widespread reforms have been made. EVE Uni still isn't perfect, but it is a much better home for newbies than it once was.

www.everevolutionaryfront.blogspot.com

Vote Sabriz Adoudel and Tora Bushido for CSMX. Keep the Evil in EVE!
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#33 - 2014-01-15 14:45:43 UTC
Jessica Danikov wrote:
...Let's be brutally honest here- ...
The new player experience consists of being scammed, ganked, or just griefed... until you either adapt or leave the game.
Seven Koskanaiken
Shadow Legions.
SONS of BANE
#34 - 2014-01-15 15:03:40 UTC
Waiting for all the euni haters to show us their newbie training corps....
Erufen Rito
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#35 - 2014-01-15 15:25:32 UTC
Jessica Danikov wrote:
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
So, do your part. Go pop a newbie. Just, when you do, explain what they did wrong, teach them how to fit a ship, and encourage them to go have fun.


Newbie griefing is practically defined by not doing that last bit. Instead, they antagonise them and milk them for tears then share those tears with their fellow bitter vets for amusement and social validation within that circle. Not that I'd say I'm against griefing (unless it's a breach of the EULA)- I love that EVE has the freedom to enable that style of play.

I do think you're right, blowing someone up could be an awesome way to make friends in EVE. An old adage I strongly stand by is 'friends shoot friends'. The longer you play EVE, the more people you know, the more likely someone you know well who's moved on to other places is going to end up in your crosshairs and that should never be taken personally.

To build on this a bit more. I just recently popped a fairly new player, and I tried to convo him. After his damn CSPA pop up came up, he declined convo. I sent him a mail, telling him to convo me for his sake. He did, and was a bit uninterested in what I had to say. I gave him my play by play as to how we caught him and why he died, and ways to prevent that from happening again. He was honestly happy, and kept on asking me things about the game. I got my kill, he got some experience and knowledge at the cost of his ship. Im fairly certain this guy will tick around for a while.

This is as nice as I get. Best quote ever https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4137165#post4137165
Angelica Dreamstar
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#36 - 2014-01-15 15:27:57 UTC
Erufen Rito wrote:
Jessica Danikov wrote:
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
So, do your part. Go pop a newbie. Just, when you do, explain what they did wrong, teach them how to fit a ship, and encourage them to go have fun.


Newbie griefing is practically defined by not doing that last bit. Instead, they antagonise them and milk them for tears then share those tears with their fellow bitter vets for amusement and social validation within that circle. Not that I'd say I'm against griefing (unless it's a breach of the EULA)- I love that EVE has the freedom to enable that style of play.

I do think you're right, blowing someone up could be an awesome way to make friends in EVE. An old adage I strongly stand by is 'friends shoot friends'. The longer you play EVE, the more people you know, the more likely someone you know well who's moved on to other places is going to end up in your crosshairs and that should never be taken personally.

To build on this a bit more. I just recently popped a fairly new player, and I tried to convo him. After his damn CSPA pop up came up, he declined convo. I sent him a mail, telling him to convo me for his sake. He did, and was a bit uninterested in what I had to say. I gave him my play by play as to how we caught him and why he died, and ways to prevent that from happening again. He was honestly happy, and kept on asking me things about the game. I got my kill, he got some experience and knowledge at the cost of his ship. Im fairly certain this guy will tick around for a while.
Nice work!

bingo, his pig not being a goat doesn't make the pig wrong, just him an idiot for shouting at his pig "WHY ARENT YOU A GOAT!" (Source)

-- Ralph King-Griffin, about deranged people playing EVE ONLINE
Etria Issen
Imperial Varista
#37 - 2014-01-15 15:37:30 UTC
Victoria Sin wrote:
Ptraci wrote:

That's because people come expecting something like "Freelancer" which is, after all, what the "genre" was before EVE. Freelancer or Elite or even something like Starflight. I can't believe the amount of times I've heard newbies ask how they can control their ship directly with the mouse. When they learn that EVE is about strategy and tactics, not pointing the front of your ship at the plus sign and shooting, most leave disappointed.


Yes, CCP's marketing of Eve is extremely misleading especially videos which are rendered outside of game. Actual game-play is often nothing like the renders and movies in the adverts.


This is unsurprising. The trailers actually make the combat look fun and dynamic.
The actual combat is about as interesting to watch as... well. Not a lot. A lot of the stuff of combat is more in the hidden complexities it offers.

The actual combat still looks boring as hell though. Particularly given the trailers make it look far more dynamic and fun, with ships weaving in and out of fire, and explosions and stuff.

Honestly, Star Trek Online does space combat better then EVE, it's just the rest of the game is pretty terrible. EVE's bigger claim to fame is simply the news stories that crop up of the horrible scamming that goes on from time to time. Or the politics of large alliances. I can't say the combat has ever sold anyone, unless you judge it on a trailer which is a horrendous lie.
Khergit Deserters
Crom's Angels
#38 - 2014-01-15 16:29:06 UTC
Zappity wrote:
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
CCP really should add that into the NPE, somewhere. "Hi newbie. Go engage in combat with another player. Don't come back till you've done some damage. You can duel, try to suicide gank, head to lowsec, start a war...anything. Just go get on a kill/lossmail."

There is much truth in this. One of the hardest things about PvP is pressing F1 against another person for the first time.

I wonder about a player fund for this. Maybe an api check of createDate (is it a newbie account?) plus a kill board reference.

Unfortunately, trying to formalize it in any way would ID newbies to the general EVE population. Which would just expose them to scam attempts, wardecs, ganking, trolling, and any other kind of predatory thing people might dream up. But there's no reason people can't quietly, informally help out newbros that they run across.
Anslo
Scope Works
#39 - 2014-01-15 18:18:18 UTC
For the record, and speaking from experience, one does not need a formal program or corp to mentor newbros.

One simply need not be a lazy ass.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#40 - 2014-01-15 18:18:34 UTC  |  Edited by: BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Angelica had been trying to help new players for the last several days. Trying to get them to respond in local is a real challenge. I think a mentoring program is a great idea. Eve and all of its intricacies can be a bit overwhelming to a new player. There is the New Citizen Q&A Forum but how many of them are aware that it exists? There are corps like Eve-U but I'm not sure how many they are still enrolling.

Eve-Uni recently managed to get their interview backlog down to a week or so from the one month it was at previously. I just hope it stays there. Come hang out in their public chat some time.

Victoria Sin wrote:
Yes, CCP's marketing of Eve is extremely misleading especially videos which are rendered outside of game. Actual game-play is often nothing like the renders and movies in the adverts.

The videos use the same engine as the game though... The primary different is the ability to accurately place props, and a few higher resolution textures/particle effects. There was an article around here about it a month or two ago.

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