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Ganking
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Jill Chastot
Black Water Oasis
#41 - 2014-01-14 22:46:03 UTC
Just remember folks http://www.mightyape.co.nz/product/EVE-In-Space-Mens-T-Shirt-Large/21555543

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=298596&find=unread OATHS wants you. Come to the WH "Safety in eve is the greatest fallacy you will ever encounter. Once you accept this you will truely enjoy this game."
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#42 - 2014-01-14 22:49:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Tyberius Franklin
Kimmi Chan wrote:
I think the thing that gets me most about the people that complain about ganking is that they're not considering what a small thing it is.

How much money have you made in that max yield retriever before you got ganked?

If it was enough to buy another retriever (or better a procurer or skiff) then you're not really losing anything.

How much money have made in the blinged out Raven Navy Issue before you got ganked?

If it was enough to buy another RNI (or better something that doesn't have a huge bullseye on it) then you're not really losing anything.

Not sure how this makes sense. If you've been ganked you've clearly lost the value of your lost ship compared to someone doing the same that hasn't been ganked.
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#43 - 2014-01-14 22:55:20 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
Kimmi Chan wrote:
I think the thing that gets me most about the people that complain about ganking is that they're not considering what a small thing it is.

How much money have you made in that max yield retriever before you got ganked?

If it was enough to buy another retriever (or better a procurer or skiff) then you're not really losing anything.

How much money have made in the blinged out Raven Navy Issue before you got ganked?

If it was enough to buy another RNI (or better something that doesn't have a huge bullseye on it) then you're not really losing anything.

Not sure how this makes sense. If you've been ganked you've clearly lost the value of your lost ship compared to someone doing the same that hasn't been ganked.


I get what you're saying but what you're missing is that it's not relative to what happens to someone else but relative to the value of the ship compared to how much ISK that ship has profited you.. The point being that the ship you just lost to a gank has made you how much money? To scream and carry on about it just seems infantile to me.

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

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Edwin McAlister
Empire Hooligans
#44 - 2014-01-15 04:57:41 UTC
while this topic kinda deviated from what I was curious about....

How is balance maintained??

on side note, the person that mentioned get rid of concord from high sec...
you know deep down, that would totally and completely destroy this game ....
high sec is a necessary evil .....

no other game that I have played can compare to pvp in EVE.... no other game that I have played can you suffer the potential loss of equipment/resources/wealth when you are killed in pvp as you can in EVE.

...... eliminate kill mails completely.....

that would eliminate a huge portion of ganking...

so much of this game revolves around the bragging rights of kill boards....

I always thought it was about expanding outward, building empires, conquering territory.......

get the game moving in the direction of expansion and conquest....
Plastic Psycho
Necro-Economics
#45 - 2014-01-15 17:41:59 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:

Now, just because the ganking ship is lost, this has nothing to do with "gankbears" - it has everything to do with being able to leisurely select or wait for a target that justifies the expected loss of the ship per the cost of killing it and the worth of the target (KB) or what the target is carrying (loot). I don't understand this "hurrr durrr I'll be losing my ship therefore it's PVP and I'm leet" mentality. If you lose a 70 million ISK ship to pop a ship having 10 times that value in loot, or cost 10 times that in ISK, and KB or loot was your goal, then the ship is basically on the same level as ammo in cost effect and usage.


OK, I see this poiont, though I disagree that it's greater risk, more than it's just a different environment; Just so you know, when I go a'ganking, it's not about being 'elite' - And the cost of my target isn't all that import, either. I'm going to kill, for my reasons, which are good and sufficient for me. Many others feel this way as well.

But yes, if you're ganking for profit, then you *would* need to adapt some, to find your best targets before undocking your gankfleet. Not that it would be hard - the tactics already exist.
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#46 - 2014-01-15 19:18:01 UTC
Edwin McAlister wrote:
while this topic kinda deviated from what I was curious about....

How is balance maintained??


Everyone who talks about ganking inevitably talks about how 'unbalanced' it is. If you think about how many people are flying ships in highsec at any given time vs how many are ganked, you will see that it is indeed a very very small percentage.

It takes a special breed of people to actually gank something. The only reward we see is from the lulz and what drops. Loot droppage is NOT an absolute by any means. One time you may get a huge payday, the next time, nothing. Its a chance based payout, and its split between lots of people. Our ships are not reimbursed by insurance, and many times our own ship loot is scooped by opportunists.

How about chance of survival? There is always a chance in any gank that the victim will survive long enough for CONCORD to show up and save them. But for us, the chance of ship survival is always zero. Out ship is ALWAYS destroyed, the vicitms is only SOMETIMES destroyed. Once again, its a chance based mechanic. Sure, we can always swing the chance more in our favor, but its never 100%.

If you also think about it, ganking does more for teambuilding and group play than almost any other highsec profession, excluding Incursions of course (But we all know that incursion runners are more zombie then the zombies theyre fighting..so..yeah).

So, is ganking balanced? That's not really the question at all. Ganking isn't balanced because ganking itself is a tool of balance, and it helps to balance out the most unbalanced mechanic of all, Highsec.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#47 - 2014-01-15 20:16:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Katran Luftschreck
WASPY69 wrote:
Oh look, it's this thread again...


Actually, no it isn't. OP is taking a neutral standpoint and, instead of soapboxing their opinion, asking others what they think. Such a lack of egocentrism is a rare thing in EvE and should be treasured.

Edwin McAlister wrote:
so much of this game revolves around the bragging rights of kill boards....


This is sadly true, though I really have to question the validity of "bragging rights" over the destruction of unarmed ships. That's like bragging about clubbing seals. Not exactly the fast path to popularity, unless you happen to be playing EvE from the inside of a prison in Juarez.

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#48 - 2014-01-15 21:24:07 UTC
Ganking threads on the rise because one group is ganking mission runners.

in the immortal words of Joey Styles;

'OH

MY

GOD'

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it
Edwin McAlister
Empire Hooligans
#49 - 2014-01-16 03:53:36 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Edwin McAlister wrote:
while this topic kinda deviated from what I was curious about....

How is balance maintained??



So, is ganking balanced? That's not really the question at all. Ganking isn't balanced because ganking itself is a tool of balance, and it helps to balance out the most unbalanced mechanic of all, Highsec.




I whole heartedly agree ganking is a very useful tool in balance.....

But there is a careful balance that must be maintained, if the scales shift too far out of balance, then the entire mechanism will collapse and total chaos will result which is a very bad thing.

And yes, I do agree there are some balance issues with highsec, I have read various posts about the isk faucet that is the mission running of highsec...... however highsec is a necessary evil .... the game NEEDS highsec, and anyone that understands balance on a large scale, will realize that it is essential for the continued existence and growth of the game / game community

Still the question remains, how do we maintain balance,

This game needs miners
This game needs industrialists
This game needs mission runners
This game needs mercenaries
This game needs pirates
This game needs players for the game to be successful

Damn fun game, and very successful game, but we still need players to play the game
Angelica Dreamstar
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#50 - 2014-01-16 07:08:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Angelica Dreamstar
Indeed, balance is needed, but it already shifted too far into one direction.

Suicide ganking is on a low, according to CCP. What risk do people in highsec face, if not the one of getting ganked? Wardecs are easily avoidable! What else? ... Right! So many people. Unharmed. As if it was too safe already.

Look at it. Tens of thousands of people who DON'T get killed by suicide ganks every day in highsec.

People will always make a fuzz about ganking. If it's only 100 people a day ... a part of these 100 will whine. And then all the whiteknights come and demand another nerf, although it's only a 100 people.

So whenever somebody says that there is too much ganking going on, the only thing needed to do is to point at space and ask ... "Where is all this 'too much ganking' you speak of?"

bingo, his pig not being a goat doesn't make the pig wrong, just him an idiot for shouting at his pig "WHY ARENT YOU A GOAT!" (Source)

-- Ralph King-Griffin, about deranged people playing EVE ONLINE
Dirk Massive
D.O.O.M.
#51 - 2014-01-16 07:18:41 UTC
I have been monitoring an increase of high sec mission runner ganking going on in the more popular level 4 mission running systems lately. Especially since the mobile tractor units have been out. Little frigates, and destroyers taking out mighty faction battleships, and the like. Just got to be more aware of the game mechanics, and be sure drones are set to passive if you have those MTU's out.

Another thing I've personally done is I've fit my Kronos a little bit more for pvp than I used to, for running missions. So much shinanighans going on, you just never know when you might become a target.

**Bringing WAR and TERROR to a system near you.... **
Angelica Dreamstar
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#52 - 2014-01-16 08:03:17 UTC
Dirk Massive wrote:
I have been monitoring an increase of high sec mission runner ganking going on in the more popular level 4 mission running systems lately. Especially since the mobile tractor units have been out. Little frigates, and destroyers taking out mighty faction battleships, and the like. Just got to be more aware of the game mechanics, and be sure drones are set to passive if you have those MTU's out.

Another thing I've personally done is I've fit my Kronos a little bit more for pvp than I used to, for running missions. So much shinanighans going on, you just never know when you might become a target.

You need cap boosters. The first thing people call for, in regards to marauders, are neuts.

bingo, his pig not being a goat doesn't make the pig wrong, just him an idiot for shouting at his pig "WHY ARENT YOU A GOAT!" (Source)

-- Ralph King-Griffin, about deranged people playing EVE ONLINE
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