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What would happen if CCP finally nerfed hisec?

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Erin Crawford
#421 - 2014-01-12 11:23:24 UTC
blabla4711 wrote:
http://cdn1.eveonline.com/community/QEN/QEN_Q4-2010.pdf said 11% Nullsec. CCP wouldnt be surprised by this number i guess. They provided it.

But i admit that i forgot the low/wh numbers and just tallied up. search and replace 89 with 80%.




That's actually a very interesting read, especially with the added graphs. Is there a link to a more newer version. Silly question, i know, as i'm guessing you'd have posted that instead, but maybe someone else knows?

"Those who talk don’t know. Those who know don’t talk. "
Dave stark
#422 - 2014-01-12 11:25:45 UTC
Eryn Velasquez wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
blabla4711 wrote:
But now we put this "80% of all bots" percentage into the "89% of eve playerbase live/work in highsec" scheme and it says ..... exactly ... nothing. Statistics just say what you want to see.



you mean, the fact that most people, and bots, operate outside of null sec, means nothing? are you sure.


There are more ways to look at these numbers - they also tell, that low/null residents use nearly twice as much bots as hiseccers

Edit:
Forget this - just read the document about populations in high/low/null/wh


yeah there are; and every way you've looked at it has had no bearing on the topic. the bot:player ratio is irrelevant. the fact is, both bots and players flock to high sec. that's the relevant statistic here. both the bots, and the real players have forsaken null sec. there has to be a reason for that, and you're doing everything humanly possible to avoid discussing that point.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#423 - 2014-01-12 11:26:43 UTC
Kimmi Chan wrote:


Call it inference Ruby. If you make your ISK where you live, what reason is there to ever go to HS? On that third quote, he is forced to build in empire. Forced. Meaning that if he had a choice (which he does) he would not build in empire and would simply make his ISK where he lives - and never have the need to set foot in Empire again.



CCP have stated that they want us to be almost self sufficient. We would still import faction items/ships and whatever we are short of but the bulk of our needs would be serviced by the industry within our empire.

Now I must ask, why do you hate industry players?
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#424 - 2014-01-12 11:41:18 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Kimmi Chan wrote:


Call it inference Ruby. If you make your ISK where you live, what reason is there to ever go to HS? On that third quote, he is forced to build in empire. Forced. Meaning that if he had a choice (which he does) he would not build in empire and would simply make his ISK where he lives - and never have the need to set foot in Empire again.



CCP have stated that they want us to be almost self sufficient.


Source?

baltec1 wrote:
Now I must ask, why do you hate industry players?


Oh you precious little thing. I don't have it my heart to hate.

What does cause my "tears" is all of the people who can not play the game as it is.

That includes miners who want to handicap gankers - not by fitting a tank on their hull or paying attention but by lobbying for a change to a game that they claim to love playing.

That includes mission runners who want to handicap baiters - not by paying attention or understanding aggression mechanics or by not being lazy and manually controlling their drones and leaving their MTU at home but by lobbying for a change to a game that they claim to love playing.

That includes the people that want to handicap scammers - not by blocking them in Local or just avoiding those systems but by lobbying for a change to a game that they claim to love playing.

I'm just going to leave this here again.

Kimmi Chan wrote:
Is there a reason why people can't just pay their sub and play the game as it is? I swear, CCP Devs must absolutely hate their jobs. All day, every day:

Nerf ganking!
Buff ganking!
Nerf AFK Cloaker *******!
Nerf Drone Assist!
Nerf SuperCapitals!
Nerf Incursions!
Nerf Bastion Modules!
Change Bastion Modules!
******* MTU got me killed - MTU is ******* fail! (MTU for CSM!)
Nerf High Sec!
Nerf Null Sec!
Buff Corpses!

All day long - these poor bastards at CCP put together a pretty ******* awesome game and everyone playing it apparently ******* hates it because they come here on a daily basis to argue about the changes that it absolutely must have or:

Eve will die
I and my 8 accounts will quit
Things will be unbalanced
The sky will fall
Player base will stagnate
New players will leave

Seriously, what kind of sense does that make?

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!
Artemis Ellery Sazas
Shock and Awe Inc.
#425 - 2014-01-12 11:43:05 UTC
These threads created by the same null sec whiners over and over and over again is so annoying. They complain about the cost of null sec and the upkeep of sov and how boring their life is there and the constant steam of "poor me's".

The solution is very simple; eliminate sov. Turn the sov regions and systems into 75% low sec and 25% high sec. People are actually happy in high sec, which from what I read in these stupid nerf high sec threads is not the case in null. So why bother having sov in the game, if all they do is complain about it? If people want lawless land their are always wormholes, which are far too scary for most null sec players since it's pretty hard to cyno a blob to come help them when trouble arrives. Not to mention there's no local, so they can run and hide in their station until a neutral leaves the system.

There is one way to make high sec more challenging that would not much effect of the real "carebear" way of life. I would suggest eliminating 25% of the stations in high sec, 40-50% of the research slots and 25% of the production slots. Most players I know use towers anyway and a slight reduction in facilities would probably not even be noticed by the high sec population, but create a little more competition between players. After all, do we really need 14 stations in Jita? I think it's time for some takeovers and consolidation between the npc corps in EVE!
TharOkha
0asis Group
#426 - 2014-01-12 11:45:44 UTC  |  Edited by: TharOkha
baltec1 wrote:

Why should they be forced to import everything from ships to ammo and drones because they are unable to build these things where they live?


From the same reason why hisec industrialists dont go to null to mine mercoxit (morphite) or build POS for moon goo or farm Pirate LPs for Pirate ships BPC. They simply buy it from the market from someone else who mined it /did it earlier in null.

You know, there is a basic principle even in RL industry. If something is cheaper to buy from market, rather than produce it yourself, then buy it from market then.

Thats why we dont see complains and tears from hisec industrialists about how inefficient is to mine mercoxit in deep null so they can supply their industry inputs.

I bet that you are socialist and leftist in RL, because they lacks basic principles of industry and economy too. And instead of adaptability, they prefer to nerf the successful ones.

CODE. Venture hunt contest in a nutshell
Josef Djugashvilis
#427 - 2014-01-12 11:45:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Josef Djugashvilis
baltec1 wrote:
TharOkha wrote:


Then i wonder why nullsec renting programs are so popular. Why all those hisec carebears are willing to pay billions per shaitty systems and willing to move to null instead of staying in hisec.

Why nullsec renting programs generating hundreds of billions isk to large coalitions?

This pure facts simply negate your biased claims that nullsec sucks.


They are out here for more reasons than isk and some do think that you earn more in null.

Tell me, if null earns people more why do 80% of bots live in high sec?


Presumably because botting is easier to do in hi-sec, which has nothing what so ever to do with the vast majority of hi-sec players.

Botting is cheating where ever it is done.

This is not a signature.
Dave stark
#428 - 2014-01-12 11:58:23 UTC
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
TharOkha wrote:


Then i wonder why nullsec renting programs are so popular. Why all those hisec carebears are willing to pay billions per shaitty systems and willing to move to null instead of staying in hisec.

Why nullsec renting programs generating hundreds of billions isk to large coalitions?

This pure facts simply negate your biased claims that nullsec sucks.


They are out here for more reasons than isk and some do think that you earn more in null.

Tell me, if null earns people more why do 80% of bots live in high sec?


Presumably because botting is easier to do in hi-sec, which has nothing what so ever to do with the vast majority of hi-sec players.

Botting is cheating where ever it is done.


but bots are still having to play the game; it's just a bot doing it for you.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#429 - 2014-01-12 12:01:34 UTC
TharOkha wrote:



I bet that you are socialist and leftist in RL, because they lacks basic principles of industry and economy too. And instead of adaptability, they prefer to nerf the successful ones.



So we should keep the current situation where people who enjoy industry are limited to just 1/5 of total space in EVE?
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#430 - 2014-01-12 12:03:21 UTC
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:


Presumably because botting is easier to do in hi-sec, which has nothing what so ever to do with the vast majority of hi-sec players.

Botting is cheating where ever it is done.


Harder actually. In high sec you have to get the bot to do each mission, in null they only need to shoot the red crosses and dock/cloak when a neut enters local.
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#431 - 2014-01-12 12:04:33 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
but bots are still having to play the game; it's just a bot doing it for you.


I may be misreading this but "having" to play the game? Like this recreational activity is actually a chore?. An obligation? A job?

I have to agree on the whole bot thing - why would you play a game just so you don't "have" to play it? WTF kind of sense does that make?

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!
Dave stark
#432 - 2014-01-12 12:06:07 UTC
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
but bots are still having to play the game; it's just a bot doing it for you.


I may be misreading this but "having" to play the game? Like this recreational activity is actually a chore?. An obligation? A job?

I have to agree on the whole bot thing - why would you play a game just so you don't "have" to play it? WTF kind of sense does that make?


yeah, either stop trolling or work on your english. don't really care which.
Josef Djugashvilis
#433 - 2014-01-12 12:10:04 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:


Presumably because botting is easier to do in hi-sec, which has nothing what so ever to do with the vast majority of hi-sec players.

Botting is cheating where ever it is done.


Harder actually. In high sec you have to get the bot to do each mission, in null they only need to shoot the red crosses and dock/cloak when a neut enters local.


Then I guess botters are really dumb.

Why use bots in hi-sec, when as you say, botting is easier in null-sec?

This is not a signature.
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#434 - 2014-01-12 12:10:51 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
but bots are still having to play the game; it's just a bot doing it for you.


I may be misreading this but "having" to play the game? Like this recreational activity is actually a chore?. An obligation? A job?

I have to agree on the whole bot thing - why would you play a game just so you don't "have" to play it? WTF kind of sense does that make?


yeah, either stop trolling or work on your english. don't really care which.


I can assure you that I am not trolling and my English is just fine, thanks.

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!
Dave stark
#435 - 2014-01-12 12:11:48 UTC
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
but bots are still having to play the game; it's just a bot doing it for you.


I may be misreading this but "having" to play the game? Like this recreational activity is actually a chore?. An obligation? A job?

I have to agree on the whole bot thing - why would you play a game just so you don't "have" to play it? WTF kind of sense does that make?


yeah, either stop trolling or work on your english. don't really care which.


I can assure you that I am not trolling and my English is just fine, thanks.


your reply heavily implies otherwise.
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#436 - 2014-01-12 12:15:12 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
but bots are still having to play the game; it's just a bot doing it for you.


I may be misreading this but "having" to play the game? Like this recreational activity is actually a chore?. An obligation? A job?

I have to agree on the whole bot thing - why would you play a game just so you don't "have" to play it? WTF kind of sense does that make?


yeah, either stop trolling or work on your english. don't really care which.


I can assure you that I am not trolling and my English is just fine, thanks.


your reply heavily implies otherwise.


I disagree. The post quoted implies that people "have" to play the game. They do not. The notion that the game is something you have to do is ludicrous. But as my response also noted I may be misreading the quote. If that is the case would you be so kind as to clarify what you meant to say rather than accuse me of either trolling or being sub-par in my native language?

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!
Dave stark
#437 - 2014-01-12 12:16:19 UTC
Kimmi Chan wrote:
I disagree. The post quoted implies that people "have" to play the game. They do not. The notion that the game is something you have to do is ludicrous. But as my response also noted I may be misreading the quote. If that is the case would you be so kind as to clarify what you meant to say rather than accuse me of either trolling or being sub-par in my native language?


it didn't imply that at all. go and read it.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#438 - 2014-01-12 12:20:40 UTC
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:


Then I guess botters are really dumb.

Why use bots in hi-sec, when as you say, botting is easier in null-sec?


They earn more in high sec.
Josef Djugashvilis
#439 - 2014-01-12 12:28:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Josef Djugashvilis
Dear Baltec 1, forgive me for going off topic for a moment, but you might want to read this article.

http://themittani.com/features/not-dead-yet-subcaps-are-fine-htfu

Oh, and all credit to The Ego.com for posting it.

This is not a signature.
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#440 - 2014-01-12 12:31:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Kimmi Chan
Dave Stark wrote:
Kimmi Chan wrote:
I disagree. The post quoted implies that people "have" to play the game. They do not. The notion that the game is something you have to do is ludicrous. But as my response also noted I may be misreading the quote. If that is the case would you be so kind as to clarify what you meant to say rather than accuse me of either trolling or being sub-par in my native language?


it didn't imply that at all. go and read it.


I did read it Dave. I quoted it. I reread it. It still says what it said the first time I read it. That bots "have" to play the game. They do not "have" to play the game.

I think what is happening here is that you misunderstand my statement:

Kimmi Chan wrote:
I may be misreading this but "having" to play the game? Like this recreational activity is actually a chore?. An obligation? A job?


as a challenge. It really isn't. It is more an agreement between us that bots are ******* stupid. In the second paragraph of my reply, in fact, I say as much. Admittedly, with much more subtle language.

Literally no one "has to" or is required to play this game. The fact that they do but while playing the game they don't play the game and instead have the bots play their game for them is just madness.

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!