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[Rubicon 1.1] Mobile Micro Jump Unit and Mobile Scan Inhibitor

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Author
Speedkermit Damo
Invicta.
Muffins of Mayhem
#481 - 2014-01-08 11:33:52 UTC
Priestess Lin wrote:
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
22 pages and the response thus far has been clearly lackluster or outright negative. Standard CCP dev policy will thus be to leave this for another week without comment, make a minor (read: token) adjustment - all the while indicating that testing and feedback indicate the new mobile structures will perform as intended (and that we can't see the "full" picture). Meanwhile, preparations to essentialy roll these out for Rubicon 1.1 in their present state proceed uninterrupted...



It is just a vocal minority spamming the thread with one-sided nonsense. They are absolutely livid and afraid over the thought that EVE might get a little harder for them and that they might actually have to use their brain to get kills. The MSI is an excellent tool that will force aggressors to take risks for a change while simultaneously providing a much needed layer of protection for PVE ops. Adapt or die.


Worthless NPC alt opinion.

Protect me from knowing what I don't need to know. Protect me from even knowing that there are things to know that I don't know. Protect me from knowing that I decided not to know about the things that I decided not to know about. Amen.

Speedkermit Damo
Invicta.
Muffins of Mayhem
#482 - 2014-01-08 11:44:11 UTC
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Erasmus Phoenix wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
There is no positive aspect to the MSI as far as PVP is concerned.

It is certainly not going to encourage more PVP.



Well... I suppose that depends if you count suiciding "Alts in shuttles" as PvP...

I can't decide if "Alts in Shuttles Online" is better than "OGB Alts Online".


Now we have both - Great job CCP!

Protect me from knowing what I don't need to know. Protect me from even knowing that there are things to know that I don't know. Protect me from knowing that I decided not to know about the things that I decided not to know about. Amen.

ITTigerClawIK
Galactic Rangers
Already Replaced.
#483 - 2014-01-08 12:00:40 UTC
i for one am looking foward to the new modules, they are both counter-able just by taking them out the scan inhib is apparently incredibly easy to scan down, and you will still know how many reds are in system, wormholes are pretty much unchanged apart from the fact if you see a inhib on D-scan you know enemies are in system pretty much just like you did before just not an exact number and most folks run at the sight of one person in system and the inhib is easy to go and check out.
Speedkermit Damo
Invicta.
Muffins of Mayhem
#484 - 2014-01-08 12:11:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Speedkermit Damo
Priestess Lin wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
There's a big difference between having extra protection and having every advantage there is.


Bullshit. Thats what you bear-rats have had for years. How do you think you are entitled to blow up another player that doesn't make any mistakes?

Why should aggressors have all the advantages? If anything, defenders should have the advantage. God forbid pirates should have to take any real risks, right?Roll
Sorry kids, 100% intel days are over. Time to HTFU.


Do you have any idea at all how hard it actually is to catch a ratter on a roam? It's extremely hard. First problem is that most of null-sec is an unpopulated wasteland. Second problem is local. The second I enter local, any ratters or miners who aren't stupid are already spamming the warp button. That's before I even decloak or start spamming D-scan, or I can just warp straight away to a random anomaly although the chances of actually warping into an anomaly with someone in it are astronomical. Even if I do, I then need to be lucky enough to warp in close enough that they don't warp off before I am able to get close enough to tackle.

And if after all these obstacles I do actually manage to catch something, I then have to actually win a fight, all the while wondering when the blob is going to arrive.

I lived in Providence for a year as a member of CVA. you probably know nothing of providence because you are an entitled high-sec bear. But Providence is the most polulous null-sec region, and generally swarming with roamers looking for ratters to gank. In all that time I lost just one ratting ship! Which should tell you just how difficult it already is to catch ratters when they have access to instant 100% intel.

Outside of faction war, solo and small-gang pvp is already dying on it's arse. These modules that no-one actually asked for is going to kill it altogether.

Ratters already have the odds stacked in their favour.

Protect me from knowing what I don't need to know. Protect me from even knowing that there are things to know that I don't know. Protect me from knowing that I decided not to know about the things that I decided not to know about. Amen.

Theon Severasse
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#485 - 2014-01-08 12:23:41 UTC
ITTigerClawIK wrote:
i for one am looking foward to the new modules, they are both counter-able just by taking them out the scan inhib is apparently incredibly easy to scan down, and you will still know how many reds are in system, wormholes are pretty much unchanged apart from the fact if you see a inhib on D-scan you know enemies are in system pretty much just like you did before just not an exact number and most folks run at the sight of one person in system and the inhib is easy to go and check out.



Someones already said that they are actually very difficult to probe down.

How is something that requries a nullified ship easy to check out?

Who are these "most folks" that run at the sight of one person? Do you mean ratters? The very people that would be using these to hide themselves from the occasional one person who turns up in local? Or do you mean people who are camping a bubble and are actively looking for people travelling through their systems alone?
Auduin Samson
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#486 - 2014-01-08 12:39:17 UTC
Drop scan inhibitor, position a fleet 29km from the center on all sides, put a drag bubble at the very middle. Anyone that warps in gets sucked to the center of a killzone.
Adoris Nolen
Sama Guild
#487 - 2014-01-08 12:39:17 UTC
What I'm really interested in is: Can MSI's be deployed on different grids but with in 30km of each other?
Blastcaps Madullier
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#488 - 2014-01-08 12:39:30 UTC
I can see a chain of these being abused in systems, factor in a mjd as well and well that's going to get interesting
Moonaura
The Dead Rabbit Society
#489 - 2014-01-08 12:41:59 UTC
What will be the price of these things?

Frankly a cyno jammer is no use to me at the current prices and reserved for the 0.0 alliances.

And what does this really do for CCP's long term goal of getting rid of Local for intel gain?

"The game is mostly played by men - 97%. But 40% of them play as women... so thats fine."  - CCP t0rfifrans 

Jason Ozran
0mega.
#490 - 2014-01-08 12:42:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Jason Ozran
I have a really simple question: why adding so many new items to simply protect missionners?

It is becoming really boring. Plexers (red district, ...) in low sec are virtually untouchable because we already have to use probes to locate them, and now you want us to have to probe the item that protect them before even locate them. What's next? A message that pops up on their screen saying that someone that might be a threat is coming for them and just warped to their plex?! You invented D-scan, that's not for monkeys...

And don't tell me people will hide supers fleet. That concerns 0.1% of the people in this game at most, be serious.

And in the meantime you still authorize people to enter plex with all the lows filled with warp core stab in FW, or anybody to use more than one Ancillary Shield Booster (that doesn't require any capa) when AAR is limited to 1 and use a shitload of cap. Seriously, some days, this game is turning into a baby sitting joke :)
Dring Dingle
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#491 - 2014-01-08 12:44:06 UTC
Damn....

cant be deployed to cover a starbase.... / pos..... it would have opened up some interesting tactics for wormhole invading! and well any system invading. CLOAK THE TOWER..... (close enough anyway)
nerdman234
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#492 - 2014-01-08 12:58:19 UTC
Carolina Gold wrote:
http://imgur.com/FcEf4iG

What about the other items in our overview??


Good find, Sir. In time I suppose.
Leafar Nightfall
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#493 - 2014-01-08 13:07:21 UTC
MSI will be very easy to abuse of if they don't have a more severe drawback, like showing in overview. Pushing D-scan every 3 seconds already is a pain in the ass enough just to know if there is anything around in a 14au radius. And it is also pretty obvious that they will only be scanned by combat probes, which just a minority of ships can use. And there is also the problem of spamming several of them...

About the MMJD, let's just say I'd rather see MJD modules of all sizes instead of something like that.
Nalha Saldana
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#494 - 2014-01-08 13:11:13 UTC
Can a pod use the jump drive and if so could I jump into enemy POSs and steal unpiloted ships?
Random Woman
Very Professional Corporation
#495 - 2014-01-08 13:17:19 UTC
I guess the jump thing has it's uses, even though shooting freighters into Large Collideble Objects is the only thing i can come up with.

As for the scan thing I think it's a bit one sided right now there should be a drawback to sitting within, like disabling Lolcal.
Logan Joriksa
Shockwave Unlimited
United States Space Command
#496 - 2014-01-08 13:27:19 UTC
Scenario 1:

If I activate a warp jammer on a MJU will it prevent it from functioning?

Scenario 2:

I'm 105 km off from a mobile cyno inhibitor, I light a cyno and then activate the MJU facing the direction of the cyno inhibitor will I therefore be catapulted (with my cyno still active) into the cyno inhibitor bubble, thus neutralizing their purpose completely?

Scenario 3: I'm ratting with a shiny faction battleship and as a noob, I'm not watching local and/or d-scan. Hostiles warp in 50km off my position. Luckily I have an MJU already deployed and in range to catapult me to safety! Now they are are 150km me and little threat! Hmm whats that interceptor doing near my MJU? He's activated it too? Oh noes! now he's within range to scram, web, and/or act as warp in for his fleet mates to kill me anyway.... Cry

Questions regarding the MJU. Laughs regarding the Scan Inhibitor.

Need more details!
Altrue
Exploration Frontier inc
Tactical-Retreat
#497 - 2014-01-08 13:28:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Altrue
Vatek wrote:
Just what we need, more things that make nullsec ratters even safer! Warp disruptors are now obsolete, better fit scrams on everything because even a ratting ship that doesn't fit an MJD can still MJD away!

Scrap both of these, they're ****.



These two structures seems quite good in my opinion, but I have to agree with this one. This needs tweaking.

Let me offer a few :

1- After the use of a MJU, you cannot initiate warp for the next 10 seconds. This way a good interceptor is able to see where you'll land, follow you, and catch you. In its current iteration, even a very clever and reactive interceptor pilot couldn't do anything if you insta warp after the MJU jump.

2- Also something fun : The MJU could send people by "waves", meaning that if you activate it to follow your target that activated it 4 seconds later, you both get teleported 12 seconds after the first ship initiated the jump. Maybe not fesible code-wise, but would be cool. 1 would certainly resove most of the current issues that I see with the MJU though.

3- Increase anchor time to 60 seconds ?... Meh, not fun in my opinion. It takes away some strategic, "on the fly" uses. This might resolve some issues (and not even all of them) at the cost of a lot of situations.

Edit - Mobile Scan Inhibitor part :
Dring Dingle wrote:
Damn....

cant be deployed to cover a starbase.... / pos..... it would have opened up some interesting tactics for wormhole invading! and well any system invading. CLOAK THE TOWER..... (close enough anyway)


Why not allowing people to cloak towers ? It's not like if towers weren't on specified locations anyway. And this structure only stays for two hours, nothing OP here, you cannot perma-cloak a tower without putting a tangible amount of effort in it. And warping to it at 100 would still be possible, at opposed to the combo MSI + Bubble. So that's way less OP. (I'm not against this combo btw, but imo the mobile warp disruptor should still be visible on the Dscan even if you cannot warp to it.)

Also this deployable lacks a penalty for the people sitting in it. There is litteraly no risk involved since they can still see who is coming their way. At least if you needed to be outside the field to use the D-scan, this would require the help of a cloaked player or something.

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Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#498 - 2014-01-08 13:36:10 UTC
Easiest way to balance these things is increase their deployment time to 1 minute. So they are less likely to be used as get out of jail card and more as a tactical tool in preparation to a battle that is surely forth comming in a location that you are defending.

20 seconds basically means that PVP on smaller scale is relegated to balsters range ONLY. Good that I trained all blaster specs to 5 for some years already.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"

Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#499 - 2014-01-08 13:37:05 UTC
Altrue wrote:


Why not allowing people to cloak towers ? It's not like if towers weren't on specified locations anyway. And this structure only stays for two hours, nothing OP here, you cannot perma-cloak a tower without putting a tangible amount of effort in it. And warping to it at 100 would still be possible, at opposed to the combo MSI + Bubble. So that's way less OP. (I'm not against this combo btw, but imo the mobile warp disruptor should still be visible on the Dscan even if you cannot warp to it.)



Because woudl be hard to see in probign map if the unit is in a grid near the moon or in the moon. And if it in the moon you might warp into a death star.

Its a too powerful trap.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"

Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#500 - 2014-01-08 13:38:23 UTC
Logan Joriksa wrote:
Scenario 1:

If I activate a warp jammer on a MJU will it prevent it from functioning?

Scenario 2:

I'm 105 km off from a mobile cyno inhibitor, I light a cyno and then activate the MJU facing the direction of the cyno inhibitor will I therefore be catapulted (with my cyno still active) into the cyno inhibitor bubble, thus neutralizing their purpose completely?

Scenario 3: I'm ratting with a shiny faction battleship and as a noob, I'm not watching local and/or d-scan. Hostiles warp in 50km off my position. Luckily I have an MJU already deployed and in range to catapult me to safety! Now they are are 150km me and little threat! Hmm whats that interceptor doing near my MJU? He's activated it too? Oh noes! now he's within range to scram, web, and/or act as warp in for his fleet mates to kill me anyway.... Cry

Questions regarding the MJU. Laughs regarding the Scan Inhibitor.

Need more details!



In the 12 secodns of spool up of the interceptors you can EASILY warp away.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"