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Returning from a long break,,,,, question about griefers
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#101 - 2014-01-06 18:41:06 UTC
Riot Girl wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
I was claiming that players grief corps by joining them and awoxing them.

If the corp is being griefed by an awoxer, can they petition it? How many guys does the awoxer have to kill before it's properly petionable griefing, like a whole mining op?

If your corp moves to another region and you follow them and then awox them, then it's griefing.

So my test spy can't awox them since they've moved from null to lowsec to null to Vale...?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#102 - 2014-01-06 18:42:33 UTC
Nerf Burger wrote:
How do you have the audacity to imply that OTHER people are pathetic?
What on earth are you on about? Or did you just quote the wrong post? Ugh
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#103 - 2014-01-06 18:43:27 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Always has been, always will be, even though I'm a carebear it's one of the major reasons I play.


Me too. I'm flying a Stratios around null sec doing sites and dodging people trying to kill me, it makes the loot even sweeter lol.

It's conflict that makes things (like games and stories) better. Who ever read a book that said "once upon a time, people got along swimmingly and no one was ever mad at each other, the end" lol.

The crazy thing (to me) is that they are so many other games (like Star Trek Online for instance, which I play) that actively shield players from the unwanted interference and gameplay of others, where ALL interactions are consensual. And you couldn't PAY an EVE carebear to go play a game like that, yet they choose to play this game while all the while complaining about things that are natural parts of the game like ganking, scamming, piracy and whatever.

It doesn't make a lick of sense to me why they do that.
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#104 - 2014-01-06 18:44:54 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Riot Girl wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
I was claiming that players grief corps by joining them and awoxing them.

If the corp is being griefed by an awoxer, can they petition it? How many guys does the awoxer have to kill before it's properly petionable griefing, like a whole mining op?

If your corp moves to another region and you follow them and then awox them, then it's griefing.

So my test spy can't awox them since they've moved from null to lowsec to null to Vale...?

Only if you're not following them because that's harassment.

Oh god.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#105 - 2014-01-06 19:32:10 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
I was claiming that players grief corps by joining them and awoxing them.

If the corp is being griefed by an awoxer, can they petition it? How many guys does the awoxer have to kill before it's properly petionable griefing, like a whole mining op?
What?
When did I say anything about petitioning them?

I'll say it as simply as I can. If people want other people to not say in NPC corps forever, they need to make player owned corps more appealing than NPC corps. As it currently stands, unless you are missioning there is no reason to join a layer corp, since all you will get is the opportunity to be shot by greens in high sec.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#106 - 2014-01-06 19:37:41 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
I think you missed the rest of my post. I wasn't claiming the new order guys grief them (though I wouldn't claim they don't either). I was claiming that players grief corps by joining them and awoxing them.
…and I'm removing an incorrect usage of the word “grief”. Griefing, as you know, is something you get banned for doing in this game.

Quote:
And safety in numbers? How do you make yourself safe when those numbers could easily be the threat?
The same way the scammers, gankers, and extortionists do: gather around a common goal.
Well no, you get banned for an excessive level of griefing. When you purposely roll and alt to get into a corp to kill someone for no gain, that's also griefing, it's just not bannable. You are doing it to cause grief.

And no matter what goal you pick it doesn't change the fact that anyone that joins can attack anyone else. honestly, I don't care, since I'm in null on my mains and a few single man corps on my alts. But all of this "waah, NPC corps" whining is put down to the simple fact that there is nothing gained but much lost by being in a player corp.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#107 - 2014-01-06 19:40:39 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
[Actually, I think the reason so many people remain in NPC corps is that it's impossible to protect yourself joining a player owned one.


Can you be more specific when you say that "it's impossible to protect yourself"?

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

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Lady Areola Fappington
#108 - 2014-01-06 19:54:38 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Always has been, always will be, even though I'm a carebear it's one of the major reasons I play.


Me too. I'm flying a Stratios around null sec doing sites and dodging people trying to kill me, it makes the loot even sweeter lol.

It's conflict that makes things (like games and stories) better. Who ever read a book that said "once upon a time, people got along swimmingly and no one was ever mad at each other, the end" lol.

The crazy thing (to me) is that they are so many other games (like Star Trek Online for instance, which I play) that actively shield players from the unwanted interference and gameplay of others, where ALL interactions are consensual. And you couldn't PAY an EVE carebear to go play a game like that, yet they choose to play this game while all the while complaining about things that are natural parts of the game like ganking, scamming, piracy and whatever.

It doesn't make a lick of sense to me why they do that.


Hey Jenn, how's that Stratios fly? I mean, say I have the resources and skills to fit one out reasonably, and I want to try out serious exploration, is it worth grabbing now or waiting on more of a price drop?

James says if we don't gather up more ISK for him he's going to gank our gankers.

7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. --Eve New Player Guide
Nerf Burger
Doomheim
#109 - 2014-01-06 20:00:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Nerf Burger
Tippia wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Honestly, how can you expect people to move on if null sec players scam them, low sec players shoot them, and high sec players grief extort them?
By doing what the scammers, gankers, and extortionists do: find safety in numbers.


yes, because what is supposed to be a sandbox game should force you to seek safety in numbers to do anything.Roll

or devs could do something that actually benefits the game and keep douche bag activity in low and null where it belongs. carebears are the lifeblood of EVE and the cancer is the tards who somehow think grief monkeys should have what are essentially risk free activities.

The low costs and risks associated with being a high sec "pirate" are the lamest and most imbalanced thing about this game by far. It just sucks that so many total losers who gravitate to this kind of activity get off so easy. That is the kind of bullshit that makes people want to quit this game. Not that its harsh (that is the idiots arguing), but that sociopaths are so easily rewarded and never pay any meaningful costs. It is a disgusting imbalance.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#110 - 2014-01-06 20:12:41 UTC
Kimmi Chan wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
[Actually, I think the reason so many people remain in NPC corps is that it's impossible to protect yourself joining a player owned one.


Can you be more specific when you say that "it's impossible to protect yourself"?
Sure. In a player run corp, you can be merrily playing away, then someone in your corp comes and blows you up either for fun or profit. Anyone that isn't doing missions has no need to leave an NPC corp, since all they are doing is opening themselves up to that.

Sure, you could say they could protect themselves by being cautious of greens, but why would they need to do that? They could simply stay in an NPC corp and avoid both that and wars, or they could create a 1 man corp if they want to get rid of tax.

Corp aggression being always on is just a really dumb mechanic that puts up too much of an issue. A high sec group running mining for example is better running out of NPC corps as their boosters and freighters then can't get awoxed or held to ransom.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#111 - 2014-01-06 20:16:51 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Well no, you get banned for an excessive level of griefing.
Fair enough. You only get a warning and then a suspension for lesser levels.

Quote:
When you purposely roll and alt to get into a corp to kill someone for no gain, that's also griefing, it's just not bannable.
If it's griefing, it's bannable. And getting into a corp to kill someone is pretty much always done for gain — its just not always for ISK gain, specifically.

Nerf Burger wrote:
yes, because what is supposed to be a sandbox game should force you to seek safety in numbers to do anything.Roll
As luck would have it, you're not forced to do anything. You have tons of tools at your disposal; numbers is one of them, and probably the most readily available one.

Quote:
or devs could do something that actually benefits the game and keep douche bag activity in low and null where it belongs.
It doesn't belong there any more or less than it does in highsec. And again, griefing is not allowed in this game — “grief monkeys” get banned because they're breaking the rules. As for risk, the only reason for any activity be risk-free is because the players who are supposed to provide that risk fail in their duty to do so… That's not something the devs can fix.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#112 - 2014-01-06 20:19:43 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Quote:
When you purposely roll and alt to get into a corp to kill someone for no gain, that's also griefing, it's just not bannable.
If it's griefing, it's bannable. And getting into a corp to kill someone is pretty much always done for gain — its just not always for ISK gain, specifically.
It's not though is it. Some people do it specifically for the tears, which is fine, that's part of the game.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#113 - 2014-01-06 20:20:46 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
It's not though is it.
Sure it is. It's just that griefing is far more narrowly and specifically defined in this game than in most.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#114 - 2014-01-06 20:21:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Nerf Burger wrote:
yes, because what is supposed to be a sandbox game should force you to seek safety in numbers to do anything.Roll

or devs could do something that actually benefits the game and keep douche bag activity in low and null where it belongs. carebears are the lifeblood of EVE and the cancer is the tards who somehow think grief monkeys should have what are essentially risk and punishment free activities.
So....
You're saying that ganking is an essentially risk and punishment free activity, which incidentally is as risky or costly as the efforts of other players make it for them, or lack thereof. While promoting the removal of activities you deem undesirable, such as "risk and punishment free" ganking, to low and nullsec to make doing pretty much anything in highsec a risk free activity.

How can you not see the hypocrisy in this?

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

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Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#115 - 2014-01-06 20:23:28 UTC
Nerf Burger wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Honestly, how can you expect people to move on if null sec players scam them, low sec players shoot them, and high sec players grief extort them?
By doing what the scammers, gankers, and extortionists do: find safety in numbers.


yes, because what is supposed to be a sandbox game should force you to seek safety in numbers to do anything.Roll

or devs could do something that actually benefits the game and keep douche bag activity in low and null where it belongs. carebears are the lifeblood of EVE and the cancer is the tards who somehow think grief monkeys should have what are essentially risk free activities.

The low costs and risks associated with being a high sec "pirate" are the lamest and most imbalanced thing about this game by far. It just sucks that so many total losers who gravitate to this kind of activity get off so easy. That is the kind of bullshit that makes people want to quit this game. Not that its harsh (that is the idiots arguing), but that sociopaths are so easily rewarded and never pay any meaningful costs.


And you're still going on about that dude who took your COSMOS item?

Look, you got outplayed. it's ok, it happens to all of us (like that time when i was a young mission runner and got tricked into CONCORDING myself). But damn guy, get over it. No wonder ccp told you to stop petitioning.

You know every time., you know that "princess" character is someone's alt and they read the forums. You know they get a good laugh everytime you allude to how they beat you out of your COSMOS item right?
Ptraci
3 R Corporation
#116 - 2014-01-06 20:24:35 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:

So my test spy can't awox them since they've moved from null to lowsec to null to Vale...?



Heh I doubt very much the "omgz griefing!" people in this thread are right. I'm sure you can get away with following someone and ganking them - for a LITTLE while. But of course if a GM looks at the logs and it becomes pretty evident that you're making a point to go out of your way to make the other guy miserable time and time again, then it's a EULA violation. But doing it once or twice is probably no biggie. After all, this IS New Eden, full of nice people.
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#117 - 2014-01-06 20:25:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenn aSide
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Nerf Burger wrote:
yes, because what is supposed to be a sandbox game should force you to seek safety in numbers to do anything.Roll

or devs could do something that actually benefits the game and keep douche bag activity in low and null where it belongs. carebears are the lifeblood of EVE and the cancer is the tards who somehow think grief monkeys should have what are essentially risk and punishment free activities.
So....
You're saying that ganking is an essentially risk and punishment free activity, which is as risky or costly as other players make it for them. While promoting the removal of activities you deem undesirable, such as "risk and punishment free" ganking, to low and nullsec to make doing pretty much anything in highsec a risk free activity.

How can you not see the hypocrisy in this?


No he can't, and he couldn't when he made TWO general discussion threads about the same one COSMOS mission incident (this is after ccp told him to stop petitioning about the same incident, we only know this because he told us lol). The dude is seriously cracked lol. Nerf Burgers? He shoulda Nerfed crying Twisted
Nerf Burger
Doomheim
#118 - 2014-01-06 20:26:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Nerf Burger
Jenn aSide wrote:
Nerf Burger wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Honestly, how can you expect people to move on if null sec players scam them, low sec players shoot them, and high sec players grief extort them?
By doing what the scammers, gankers, and extortionists do: find safety in numbers.


yes, because what is supposed to be a sandbox game should force you to seek safety in numbers to do anything.Roll

or devs could do something that actually benefits the game and keep douche bag activity in low and null where it belongs. carebears are the lifeblood of EVE and the cancer is the tards who somehow think grief monkeys should have what are essentially risk free activities.

The low costs and risks associated with being a high sec "pirate" are the lamest and most imbalanced thing about this game by far. It just sucks that so many total losers who gravitate to this kind of activity get off so easy. That is the kind of bullshit that makes people want to quit this game. Not that its harsh (that is the idiots arguing), but that sociopaths are so easily rewarded and never pay any meaningful costs.


And you're still going on about that dude who took your COSMOS item?

Look, you got outplayed. it's ok, it happens to all of us (like that time when i was a young mission runner and got tricked into CONCORDING myself). But damn guy, get over it. No wonder ccp told you to stop petitioning.

You know every time., you know that "princess" character is someone's alt and they read the forums. You know they get a good laugh everytime you allude to how they beat you out of your COSMOS item right?


still mad about looking like an idiot in another thread I see Lol

try to contain your rage and discuss the topic kiddo, or we will have to ask you to go back to your basement.P
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#119 - 2014-01-06 20:29:03 UTC
Nerf Burger wrote:
It just sucks that so many total losers who gravitate to this kind of activity get off so easy. That is the kind of bullshit that makes people want to quit this game. Not that its harsh (that is the idiots arguing), but that sociopaths are so easily rewarded and never pay any meaningful costs. It is a disgusting imbalance.

How does sociopathy in any way factor into all of this? And how is it being rewarded?
How is it not harsh that you have to be aware of your surroundings or you'll get hit with some kind of loss?

What's this imbalance you're talking about? How is it an imbalance that proactive stance yields more than an inactive one?
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#120 - 2014-01-06 20:31:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Jenn aSide wrote:
No he can't, and he couldn't when he made TWO general discussion threads about the same one COSMOS mission incident (this is after ccp told him to stop petitioning about the same incident, we only know this because he told us lol). The dude is seriously cracked lol. Nerf Burgers? He shoulda Nerfed crying Twisted
He should join up with Dinsdale, any proposals they come up with between them will make the hopefully tongue in cheek "nerf highsec" proposals look sane.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

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