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COUNTER PROPOSAL to mining change ideas
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Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2013-12-30 00:48:40 UTC
So, due to exploration being made a billion times more tedious with loot spew, and because the same kind of people who never did it who wanted exploration to be more "exciting" who still didnt explore after their wanted changes. many of them now want MINING to have loot spew, countering the entire demographic mining is aimed at.


so my counter proposal, you guys can have your mining loot spew, so long as killing ships also causes their loot to spew out of the ship on death and disappear 15 seconds later, that PI automatically launches canisters of your material into orbit to disappear after 15 minutes, and that when you buy a low priced item on the market it appears at a random station within 15 jumps.

these are my terms, you want mining to be more "exciting", then your other profesions need to be more "exciting" too.
Malseir Dabian
Shadow Consortium Holding's
#2 - 2013-12-30 00:51:38 UTC
Nariya Kentaya wrote:
So, due to exploration being made a billion times more tedious with loot spew, and because the same kind of people who never did it who wanted exploration to be more "exciting" who still didnt explore after their wanted changes. many of them now want MINING to have loot spew, countering the entire demographic mining is aimed at.


so my counter proposal, you guys can have your mining loot spew, so long as killing ships also causes their loot to spew out of the ship on death and disappear 15 seconds later, that PI automatically launches canisters of your material into orbit to disappear after 15 minutes, and that when you buy a low priced item on the market it appears at a random station within 15 jumps.

these are my terms, you want mining to be more "exciting", then your other profesions need to be more "exciting" too.



I second this. And give it my stamp of approval.
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2013-12-30 00:52:34 UTC
Um, what caused this little rant? Got a link or source information?

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2013-12-30 01:04:17 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Um, what caused this little rant? Got a link or source information?

meh, mostly some CCp devs in threads saying "yeah mining is kinda boring" and with the number of people who dotn and never will mine spamming the forums lately with suggestions on how to "improve" mining, i figured, like with exploration, a stupid change is likely on the horizon.

so no specific links, mostly venting about a ridiculous series of proposals with an equally ridiculous but totally fair counter proposal.
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2013-12-30 01:07:14 UTC
Well mining is boring, and it should be more profitable to have a fleet of players mining than a fleet of IsBoxer.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2013-12-30 01:26:18 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Well mining is boring, and it should be more profitable to have a fleet of players mining than a fleet of IsBoxer.

it is, since a fleet of players can react quicker to what each one needs to do individually.

its not as profitable PER PLAYER though because its one guying getting ALL the isk in one instance, and in the other its isk getting split amongst a group, so even though one makes more isk, each person gets less than the alternative does.
Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2013-12-30 09:51:15 UTC
Lol nice sarcasm.

~ Professional Forum Alt  ~
Gimme more Cynos
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#8 - 2013-12-30 10:23:11 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Well mining is boring, and it should be more profitable to have a fleet of players mining than a fleet of IsBoxer.


Sry, but I have to disagree.

Mining isn't boring - it's relaxing. You can do other stuff while doing it (watching a move, conversations on (voice-) coms etc.). Mining is only boring if you're forced to do it, and if you're forced to do it, you have other problems than mining.

For me, roaming as an example is boring - does that mean it must be changed? I would say : no.
Hauling is also boring - does it need a change? I would say: no.
Producing is also boring to me - does it need a change? I would say: no (the UI could need updates though)

Seriously, most of the players claiming that "Mining is oh so boring" just don't have interests in doing mining at all. Those will likely never touch mining, no matter how "interesting" it might be.
Lion Ahishatsu
State War Academy
Caldari State
#9 - 2013-12-30 11:13:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Lion Ahishatsu
i agree mining dosnt need a change

and multiboxers well

every acc cost near 600 mio isk a month it dosnt matter how much accs he has in empire he needs about 40-50h of mining per month only for the plex

and i dont know a single eve player with less than two accs

after i reached the peak of mining with imps etc i longed for a way to improve my Yield in the end i startet to dualbox
after some time i mined with 4 accs 1 acc per ore in empire no crossing lasers

now in 0.0 space 1 Rorqual + Dominix

and now i Multibox 6 mining accs without multiboxing software whats wrong with that i play all my accs without Software and now say whats wrong with miners who want to improve the only way to improve is with more accs miners dont have the freedome to chose what ship to fly or buy faction lasers

and now all no miners are saying its need to be more aktive it is boring and multiboxer fleets are so unfair and need a nerf
for that way of playing eve i have more risk than one player if i ever go afk in 0.0 space my fleet is dust i need more time to escape from neuts cloakys INTERCEPTORS and now i should make less isk than a fleet of players only because i do the same amount of work alone bullshit
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2013-12-30 11:32:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Barrogh Habalu
Well, loot spew wasn't ever intended to make explo more "exciting", supposedly it was added as incentive to bring a friend with you, so that both can be rewarded without having to halve their income from a site because they shared it. Because at this point sites usually contain 1 valuable item and loads of trash, that didn't quite work. So don't worry, I doubt something silly like ore spew will be added.

Also I should mention that when I was trying mining, the most interesting part was to organize mining, gathering cans (that was way before barge buff), create insta-warpoff bookmarks and the like. My point is, meaningful actions that serve clear and specific purpose, intermediate link of the chain of production/activity is what's fun, not twitch minigames that are there for the sake of it. Please, CCP, keep that in mind when designing stuff these days.

Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
#11 - 2013-12-30 12:04:56 UTC
Nariya Kentaya wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Um, what caused this little rant? Got a link or source information?

meh, mostly some CCp devs in threads saying "yeah mining is kinda boring" and with the number of people who dotn and never will mine spamming the forums lately with suggestions on how to "improve" mining, i figured, like with exploration, a stupid change is likely on the horizon.

so no specific links, mostly venting about a ridiculous series of proposals with an equally ridiculous but totally fair counter proposal.



So... now would be a good time to buy minerals?


Loot spew for minerals to make it more exciting? Do we get to play chutes and ladders with astroids now? Will we have to "click de button" to get the ore we just mined?

If mining becomes more exciting outside of people's gank attempts, all I foresee is mineral prices going up.

A lot of people mine (individuals as opposed to ISBoxing fleets or actual bots) because they can earn passive income. They mine because it IS boring and you can do something else while the laser cycles. But heck, if CCP expects me to break out a pick axe to get Tritanium now then I think I'll focus mining in Minecraft.

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.
Jaz Antollare
UrAnus Probing Squad
#12 - 2013-12-30 12:09:45 UTC
Have an Idea how to buff active miners and not bots or afk-miners. How about a mini game, where the goal is to some how "manually focus" the mining lasers that can increase the yield.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#13 - 2013-12-30 12:24:23 UTC
Jaz Antollare wrote:
Have an Idea how to buff active miners and not bots or afk-miners. How about a mini game, where the goal is to some how "manually focus" the mining lasers that can increase the yield.

Now keep the mini-game interesting rather than tedious for the hundreds of hours of mining that miners do to make their isk.
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
#14 - 2013-12-30 12:29:01 UTC
Lion Ahishatsu wrote:

and now all no miners are saying its need to be more aktive it is boring and multiboxer fleets are so unfair and need a nerf
for that way of playing eve i have more risk than one player if i ever go afk in 0.0 space my fleet is dust i need more time to escape from neuts cloakys INTERCEPTORS and now i should make less isk than a fleet of players only because i do the same amount of work alone bullshit


I have no issues with ISBoxer. In fact, if I mined more actively with multiple accounts I would invest in using it.

Ironically, the place where a ton of people are seeing the impact of multiboxing is post-ice changes. A multiboxing fleet can eat through an ice field like a hot knife through cheese and since the roids pop, the non-multiboxers, who normally mine cause they can do it while doing something else, see their volume drop (the 4 hour spawn time simply adds to this conundrum). Sure, they could go to low sec or even null, but now you have to not just tank for gankers, you have to constantly watch local to avoid losing your ship. Non-blues loitering in system

Maybe CCP should stop trying to pigeon hole players in this supposed "sand-box" universe.

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
#15 - 2013-12-30 12:36:22 UTC
Jaz Antollare wrote:
Have an Idea how to buff active miners and not bots or afk-miners. How about a mini game, where the goal is to some how "manually focus" the mining lasers that can increase the yield.


Oh cool... "click de button",

...please no. Miners don't mine for a mini-game. We don't need a mini-game. We are already playing a game... it is called EVE Online. If miners want more excitement, they can PvP or PvE. I know I do.

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.
Gimme more Cynos
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#16 - 2013-12-30 13:04:27 UTC
Petrified wrote:
Lion Ahishatsu wrote:

and now all no miners are saying its need to be more aktive it is boring and multiboxer fleets are so unfair and need a nerf
for that way of playing eve i have more risk than one player if i ever go afk in 0.0 space my fleet is dust i need more time to escape from neuts cloakys INTERCEPTORS and now i should make less isk than a fleet of players only because i do the same amount of work alone bullshit


I have no issues with ISBoxer. In fact, if I mined more actively with multiple accounts I would invest in using it.

Ironically, the place where a ton of people are seeing the impact of multiboxing is post-ice changes. A multiboxing fleet can eat through an ice field like a hot knife through cheese and since the roids pop, the non-multiboxers, who normally mine cause they can do it while doing something else, see their volume drop (the 4 hour spawn time simply adds to this conundrum). Sure, they could go to low sec or even null, but now you have to not just tank for gankers, you have to constantly watch local to avoid losing your ship. Non-blues loitering in system

Maybe CCP should stop trying to pigeon hole players in this supposed "sand-box" universe.


Yeah ofcourse, whiny little miners only see the downside. The actually upside (which is the increase in ice-prices which gave a significant return over the old ice-harvesting system) went through completely unnoted.

I know that we had DG prices of roughly 400 ISK per block, and it went up by allmost 75%. That is quite a lot. What these babies tend to ingore is that they get more ISK per block, which atually makes up for a lot of the limited supply.

Yes, it isn't hilariously convenient anymore (start lasers and watch movies all day long) as the supply is limited, but on the other hand, moving to a different belt is way to much to ask for too *sigh*. Those peeps really need to get off their lazy butts.
Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#17 - 2013-12-30 13:36:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Sentamon
Jaz Antollare wrote:
Have an Idea how to buff active miners and not bots or afk-miners. How about a mini game, where the goal is to some how "manually focus" the mining lasers that can increase the yield.


... so only the bots and completely new miners will do this. Roll

Petrified wrote:
[quote=Lion Ahishatsu]
Ironically, the place where a ton of people are seeing the impact of multiboxing is post-ice changes. .


You're 100% wrong, pre ice changes had ice prices nearly 1/2 of what they are right now. The change was specifically aimed at multiboxers and afkers.

~ Professional Forum Alt  ~
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#18 - 2013-12-30 16:04:11 UTC
Nariya Kentaya wrote:
So, due to exploration being made a billion times more tedious with loot spew


Actually, not being required to use a combat ship or kill rats, as well as cargo scan the cans has resulted in far less tediousness for THIS explorer.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.
Xe'Cara'eos
A Big Enough Lever
#19 - 2013-12-30 16:40:50 UTC
if I want to play a minigame whist mining - I've got minesweeper, if I want to watch a movie or chat in local/corp, I can do that too, please don't force me

For posting an idea into F&I: come up with idea, try and think how people could abuse this, try to fix your idea - loop the process until you can't see how it could be abused, then post to the forums to let us figure out how to abuse it..... If your idea can be abused, it [u]WILL[/u] be.
Lion Ahishatsu
State War Academy
Caldari State
#20 - 2013-12-30 17:39:09 UTC
and again hold the minigames out of EvE miners mine for many Hours and every single game would be a hassel

+ If you can play a minigame in 0.0 while watching the local Intel and d scan respect

i dont know if you read my post above right now i have 6 accs for mining i have investet many isk and time into them and now they are useless or i make less yield
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