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Drones Online

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Prince Kobol
#141 - 2013-12-24 17:18:29 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Grath Telkin wrote:

Zulu Death Mask wrote:
Are you saying that the thousands of drones don't affect the node crash?


Yes, thats exactly what I'm saying, we've been using slowcats in huge numbers for a long time now, the node crashes are new, and obviously came in either 1.1 or Rubicons release since the fights in June and July were just fine



You have never used them in the numbers we see now. The first full slowcat fleet also saw the first node death and every deployment that has seen action since has seen the node die.


You can cry drones as much as you like but even CCP have stated that the node crashes was nothing to do with drones.

Now we have 2 choices.

Either believe CCP that the issues surrounding the node crashes were not drone related or the goons who are convinced it is because they have yet to find an effective counter.

Difficult one Big smile
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#142 - 2013-12-24 17:20:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Grath Telkin
Haha this thread just gets better and better, now a black legion guy knows how much CPU a carrier uses as compared to the other ships in EVE

EDIT: And running off this guys numbers, each domi can launch half a carriers drone bandwidth so that would mean 600 domis take up the same CPU as 1800 players. Same with Ishtars, damn those dirty ishtars.

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.
Prince Kobol
#143 - 2013-12-24 17:20:48 UTC
SFM Hobb3s wrote:
Grath Telkin wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
[quote=Pinky Hops]

The nodes are going down with only 600 vs 600 man fights. These numbers are nothing at all special and fairly run of the mill for the last 5 years. The only thing different is the drone doctrines being used by both sides.


Sorry CCP already said in another thread that the drones have nothing to do with it, you'll need a new drum to bang on about why its not fair that you can shove 1k megas in a system and thats fair but us shoving 300 carriers in a system is somehow the evilest of evils



Um, no they didn't absolve drones at all. What CCP Veritas said was that it wasn't 'high load' causing the node to crash. It was conditions experienced during said 'high load'. Guess what causes high load? Drones.

Of course it no longer takes several thousand people to crash the node. 300 Sentry drone carriers take up the same CPU load as 1800 players before you account for any abandoned drones.


News at 10...

CFC pets come out to defend the "It the Drones" party line
Ssoraszh Tzarszh
Mellivora Nulla Irrumabo
#144 - 2013-12-24 17:21:39 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Pinky Hops wrote:


But several hundred people don't crash a node.

It takes several thousand people to crash a node. And nobody bothers, in general, until there's a reason (like, for example...an important structure like a station coming out of reinforcement....)


Again, this is due to the number of drones and tactics being used in this war. We have had much bigger fights on unreinforced nodes for years with TIDI.



Don't just walk in so casually and blaim those poor orphans you! also i like how an ancient grid loading lag discussion is used to point a finger at node crashes.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#145 - 2013-12-24 17:22:11 UTC
Pinky Hops wrote:


Much more likely it is different issues each time.



Yep, it cannot possibly be the mass deployment of thousands to tens of thousands of drones. It much be lots of other problems, problems that don't happen with larger sub capital fights, problems that didn't start happening before the deployment of full fleets of slowcats.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#146 - 2013-12-24 17:24:56 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:
Haha this thread just gets better and better, now a black legion guy knows how much CPU a carrier uses as compared to the other ships in EVE

EDIT: And running off this guys numbers, each domi can launch half a carriers drone bandwidth so that would mean 600 domis take up the same CPU as 1800 players. Same with Ishtars, damn those dirty ishtars.


Both of those ships dont carry over 300 flights of sentries.
Pinky Hops
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#147 - 2013-12-24 17:26:42 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Pinky Hops wrote:


Much more likely it is different issues each time.



Yep, it cannot possibly be the mass deployment of thousands to tens of thousands of drones. It much be lots of other problems, problems that don't happen with larger sub capital fights, problems that didn't start happening before the deployment of full fleets of slowcats.



have you ever programmed a thing in your life?

ccp specifically said it had to do with what they called "programming errors."

people who know wtf they are talking about don't just generalize something as broadly as "too many drones."

there was clearly a very technical, specific reason why the node crashed, and probably had something to do with some particular piece of code not scaling too well and being inefficient and causing extreme load etc etc.

when you fix a problem like this, and run it through again, sometimes a different part of the code breaks.

if it was a singular thing that they couldn't fix, eg "our nodes jut can't handle this many drones -- ever, and never will be able to" - CCP would just come out and say that.

they have been incredibly candid and honest about the limitations of the nodes before and how, when, and why they crash. why do you think, in this particular instance, they are lying?
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#148 - 2013-12-24 17:27:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Grath Telkin
baltec1 wrote:
Grath Telkin wrote:
Haha this thread just gets better and better, now a black legion guy knows how much CPU a carrier uses as compared to the other ships in EVE

EDIT: And running off this guys numbers, each domi can launch half a carriers drone bandwidth so that would mean 600 domis take up the same CPU as 1800 players. Same with Ishtars, damn those dirty ishtars.


Both of those ships dont carry over 300 flights of sentries.


Whats that got to do with anything? You can carry 10's of 1000's of rounds of ammo in your cargo hold, does that cause massive lag as well?

Come on baltec1, lets hear your definitive actual evidence you have that its the drones that were used all through the fountain fighting (that had no node deaths) are the responsible party and not the ever shifting nature of EVE's decade old code base?

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.
Zulu Death Mask
Yaxchilan
#149 - 2013-12-24 17:27:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Zulu Death Mask
I don't agree with you but I'm tired of saying the same things.
I doubt you would ever admit slowcats are slightly unbalanced.


Grath Telkin wrote:

And try not to cry about what we have and you don't, there was peace in the south, everybody was getting their share, you started a war and now you're unhappy with how its going, sounds like you picked on the wrong guy to me.


Where exactly do you see crying?
And in typical PL narcissist mentality you assume everyone wants to have what you have?
Why would I want what you have? I want less of what you have in the game.

It's all to do with the health of EvE... and how **** two blue donuts dickwaving is.
But yeah I take it you think the ~16 regions your coalition holds should never change hands.. right?
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#150 - 2013-12-24 17:30:36 UTC
Pinky Hops wrote:


have you ever programmed a thing in your life?
Have you?

Pinky Hops wrote:
ccp specifically said it had to do with what they called "programming errors."


They haven't said anything on what those errors are and they haven't said that drones are not having a big impact with the node deaths.


The simple fact is that the nodes are only going down when the slowcats are being deployed. The only thing new is the huge number of drones being used.
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#151 - 2013-12-24 17:32:37 UTC
Zulu Death Mask wrote:

But yeah I take it you think the ~16 regions your coalition holds should never change hands.. right?


No, but incidentally did you know that Fountain/Tribute/Tenal/Branch were the only regions to change hands in recent memory that we didn't assist in?

Evidently our milkshake brings all the boys to the yard

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.
Pinky Hops
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#152 - 2013-12-24 17:33:08 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
The only thing new is the huge number of drones being used.


1) That's nothing new - as me and several other people have already pointed out to you.

2) Even if it were "new" - you are still forgetting that an expansion just came out. I think it's safe to say that is "new." I still have minor display bugs that are new to Rubicon - never had them before.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#153 - 2013-12-24 17:33:26 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:


Whats that got to do with anything?


You can bomb those drones away and kill the ships deploying them. Slowcats never run out of dones and cannot be removed from the fight like subcaps are.
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#154 - 2013-12-24 17:33:36 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
The only thing new is the huge number of drones being used.


Yea if you ignore all that new code that came with Odyssey 1.1 and Rubicon...Roll

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#155 - 2013-12-24 17:35:31 UTC
Pinky Hops wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
The only thing new is the huge number of drones being used.


1) That's nothing new - as me and several other people have already pointed out to you.

2) Even if it were "new" - you are still forgetting that an expansion just came out. I think it's safe to say that is "new." I still have minor display bugs that are new to Rubicon - never had them before.


1. yes, it is new. Fleets have never relied upon drones and they have never launched as many as they are now.

2. Fights between bigger subcap fleets have taken place after the last expansion and they are not causing node deaths
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#156 - 2013-12-24 17:36:22 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
The only thing new is the huge number of drones being used.


Yea if you ignore all that new code that came with Odyssey 1.1 and Rubicon...Roll


So why are subcap fleets not causing these issues? Why is it only when the slowcats are deployed?
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#157 - 2013-12-24 17:37:47 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Grath Telkin wrote:


Whats that got to do with anything?


You can bomb those drones away and kill the ships deploying them. Slowcats never run out of dones and cannot be removed from the fight like subcaps are.


No no, don't try and morph one thing into another like some freakish Republican Senator.

You said drones caused lag, some other guy said that 300 slowcats used as much CPU as 1800 people, i said 'come on now thats made up because that would mean 600 domis use as much CPU as 1800 people"

at that point you said "yea but theres all those drones in the drone bay" and I asked you directly, what unlaunched drones have to do with anything becuase that would imply that unfired stored ammunition should have the same problem, and I waited for your answer.

It turns out your answer appears to be a whine about how you can't just use 120 bombers to rid yourself of the problem so lets get back to the original question:

How are unlaunched drones causing issues that unfired ammunition isn't?

What actual code proof do you have to back up you claims or are you just talking out of your ass?

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.
SFM Hobb3s
Perkone
Caldari State
#158 - 2013-12-24 17:38:13 UTC
It doesn't take much to actually think about what the server has to account for, per tick, for each ship vs each drone. They all share remarkably similar requirements. The ship will have a few more modules that the cpu would have to account for...but then again, some of those modules also affect the players drones as well. So yeah, if a carrier can launches 5 drones at a time, that's very likely taking almost the same cpu requirement as 6 ships in space.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#159 - 2013-12-24 17:40:25 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:


What actual code proof do you have to back up you claims or are you just talking out of your ass?


What code proof do you have that they are not?

Its an odd coincidence that the node deaths are only happening when slowcats are being deployed against domi fleets.
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#160 - 2013-12-24 17:42:37 UTC
baltec1 wrote:


2. Fights between bigger subcap fleets have taken place after the last expansion and they are not causing node deaths


baltec1 wrote:
Grath Telkin wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
The only thing new is the huge number of drones being used.


Yea if you ignore all that new code that came with Odyssey 1.1 and Rubicon...Roll


So why are subcap fleets not causing these issues? Why is it only when the slowcats are deployed?


I'll address both of these lies at once since thats what they are:

There have been no fights at all bigger than fountain saw, period end of story, there has been nothing comparable to that at all, not even close. In fact this is the largest clash since the summer expansions hit, nothing has gone on in EVE of any size for two full expansions.

You have zero evidence to back up any claim you are making right now, while you sit posting ignoring the actual facts of the past 6 months of EVE game play. You have zero idea if the game can support a 3k man fight because there hasn't been one eve close to it, you are fabricating a problem that you have zero back up or technical knowledge to support, literally, you are talking out of your ass.

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.