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Meta 4 Better than T2 , a mods list.

Author
Decaneos
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#81 - 2014-05-01 21:31:47 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Ah, a dev's alt posts a request to get the community to do his job, to create a list of T2 items to nerf (edit, nerf the meta 4's).
This dovetails nicely with fozzie's comments today.



WHOOT! im a dev! oh wait...no im not....back to my crappy evening job.....cry....thanks man......
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#82 - 2014-05-01 22:28:04 UTC
Good work Decaneos. It's people like you in our EVE community who make CCP's job so much easier, and that trickles down into every day gameplay. That's why EVE is great. It's a place where the average joe like Dinsdale Piranha don't have to understand how things work, for there are other people keeping a good look out and always trying to make EVE better for everyone.

Your efforts are not going unnoticed. =)

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."

Arronicus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#83 - 2014-05-03 00:47:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Arronicus
Niclas Solo wrote:
Jon Joringer wrote:
Niclas Solo wrote:
Small and medium cap boosters, large also if you don't use navy 800.
Web and short point.

There's a difference of being able to fit one more navy 400 charge in the tech II medium cap booster as opposed to the meta 4. Quite handy if you are battling against neuts and so don't want to use 800s.


Of course, thats a huge different if you have room for one more. But if you use navy 400 in small or navy 800 in medium or standard 800 in large then there is no reason to use T2.

Also one medium meta 4 with one navy 800 give more cap/sec then a medium T2 with 3 navy 400.


This also completely ignores the point of the whole thread; that the t2 (meta 5) version has at least 1 stat better than the meta 4, which is capacity. Thus, this doesn't qualify.

Also, great work, this is very useful to see, however, price shouldn't have any bearing on the lists. Price is a player set initiative balancing between supply, demand, and usefulness. If a ship costs 100 million or 10 billion, that doesn't inherently make the ship any better or worse, it simply changes the affordability of that ship, and subsequently, devalues this thread.

For sake of clarity, Tech 2 is Meta 5, so there is absolutely no reason that meta 5 items should not have at least one superior physical attribute, affecting the performance, or fitting capabilities of the ship compared to meta 4, of which price is not one.
Considering this has been a real sore in the game for so long, I'm surprised that the devs didnt just make quick tweaks to all the t2 items to resolve this, similar to when they added more capacity to tech 2 cap boosters, more armor to tech 2 plates, or changes similar to when they attempted to alleviate some of the penalties on tech 2 ammo.
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#84 - 2014-05-16 16:31:30 UTC
I would argue that tech II capacitor boosters do go into a fringe case because while they are better when you use Navy cap booster charges, only the large is better if you aren't. Navy cap booster charges get expensive quickly. I've personally never used one and probably won't be any time soon, especially if I'm flying a small and cheap ship.

It seems to me that Navy cap booster charges are only cost-effective for tech 2 cruisers in high-risk PVP; all other times either the Navy charges aren't enough of a bonus or they cost too much, or both. People who aren't worried about the cost will use them, but penny-pinchers will not.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."

Antonio Steele
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#85 - 2014-05-23 20:10:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Antonio Steele
nevermind, read something wrong.
Hakaari Inkuran
State War Academy
Caldari State
#86 - 2014-07-03 17:03:15 UTC
Price shouldn't be a stipulation for being on this list because average prices vary and fluctuate from one month to the next and because the price of non-faction modules is near negligible in most cases.
Nyancat Audeles
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#87 - 2014-07-23 00:18:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Nyancat Audeles
Price shouldn't really be an issue here. Prices can change easily, especially if attributes or demand changes. For example, a Meta 4 might be more expensive because it is better, and therefore, have a higher price.
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#88 - 2014-07-24 23:14:05 UTC
Nyancat Audeles wrote:
Price shouldn't really be an issue here. Prices can change easily, especially if attributes or demand changes. For example, a Meta 4 might be more expensive because it is better, and therefore, have a higher price.
Price is more just a tiebreaker when something is an edge case, or perhaps more fuel to throw on the fire to present a case as to why a particular tech 2 module is worthless in comparison to the meta 4. It is most notably a factor when the clearly more popular module is also much less expensive. The T2 MWD, for instance, can be shown to be underpowered somewhat by price, though that's really just a bit more dirt to throw at it.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."

Arronicus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#89 - 2014-10-22 16:14:13 UTC
The tears are going to be so unbelievably glorious when the module tiericide hits mining laser upgrades.
Soldarius
Brand Newbros
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#90 - 2014-11-03 21:33:42 UTC
Two words: Module Tiericide.

/thread

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY

Decaneos
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#91 - 2014-12-15 13:58:02 UTC
Soldarius wrote:
Two words: Module Tiericide.

/thread


Yep, need to update this thread soon i think. busy at the moment tho....bloody christmas ;)
Sizeof Void
Ninja Suicide Squadron
#92 - 2014-12-22 04:07:42 UTC
While you are at it, why don't you also compile a list of T1 modules which are worse in every way, as compared to metas, including price?

It should be an easy list to compile, since nearly every T1 module should be on the list. :)
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#93 - 2014-12-28 21:11:53 UTC
Sizeof Void wrote:
While you are at it, why don't you also compile a list of T1 modules which are worse in every way, as compared to metas, including price?

It should be an easy list to compile, since nearly every T1 module should be on the list. :)

I think meta drop rates on some modules should be reduced to keep meta 1 more expensive than meta 0.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."

realstar
Siberian Squad
Siberian Squads
#94 - 2015-01-30 13:24:52 UTC
Why CCP didn't reply?

It's very sad to spend time learning skills and don't have the advantage from using T2 modules. I didn't know about that thing that ECM meta 4 modules have the same strength, but need less capacitor for activation and less cpu for fitting. I was sure that t2 is always better, but today my opinion about game dramatticaly decreased.

I don't care how much does it costs, or how hard to get it from NPC, T2 should be better and meta 4 should be as alternative for pilots who have not enough skills or need to decrease cpu usage of ships, thats it!
Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#95 - 2015-02-15 11:13:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Tiddle Jr
Meta4 has not or let's say must not be better than T2. Or maby let's put it this way, as higher meta is than higher efficiency must be.
It's should be strictly devided
* T1 mods (meta level 1)
* T2 mods (meta level 5)
* Storyline mods (meta level 6)
* Complex mods (meta level 7-10 c,b,a,x)
* Officer mods (meta level 11-14)

Another question is fitting requirements: cpu, pg., those are core things where all meta gaps are come onto the light.

This should be deeply re-worked by CCP. Otherwise we keep having what we already had most of the passed years.

"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP

Caldari 5
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. S.A.S
Affirmative.
#96 - 2015-04-22 06:09:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Caldari 5
In light of the changes put through with https://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/rebalancing-modules-round-two/

Inertia Stabilizers II should be removed from the list, because they now have an Inertia Modifier that is better than the Meta variant.

Capacitor Power Relay II should be removed from the list, because they now have a Capacitor Recharge Rate Bonus that is better than the Meta variant.