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Macintosh

 
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I suppose we can add Twitch to the list of things we don't deserve
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Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#1 - 2013-12-09 23:50:08 UTC
Old list, topic locked so we can just use that for a reference and add

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=68805#post68805

Twitch TV integration
Manssell
OmiHyperMultiNationalDrunksConglomerate
#2 - 2013-12-10 17:06:45 UTC
You know, I really don't even care about streaming but I'm more concerned that this seems to be the official end to that promise of parity between the mac and pc clients when it comes to in game features.

If they are willing to release this for PC only and can live with the "disappointment" it isn't available for mac users, then the question really becomes how much "disappointment" is CCP willing to live with when it comes to the Mac client and feature parity? Would CCP release a ship one day and just be "disappointed" Mac users can't fly it? Would CCP live with the "disappointment" if they release a new kind of space that mac users can't go to?


What other features do you guys have planned for release that won't be available for your mac customers CCP?
(And yes, I understand why this is technically happening… but that's kinda the problem.)
Dersen Lowery
The Scope
#3 - 2013-12-11 21:31:33 UTC
I think it will become clear as CCP expands the game further into third-party SDKs like Twitch and into advanced DirectX 11, that Cider is just not very good at keeping up. It's better than nothing, but significantly worse than a native version or even a proper port.

The alternatives--either paying someone for an honest-to-goodness port or adding OpenGL support--require a significant enough investment of time that they'd be a leap of faith on CCP's part: they'd have to hope that the relatively diminutive Mac client share is due to the Mac client not being terribly good, and that if they released a much better version enough Mac users would come out of the woodwork to justify the investment.

Unfortunately for that, Windows runs the graphics driver in kernel space; OS X runs it in user space. That makes OS X more stable and a smidge more secure in that particular case, but it exacts a cost in performance. All else being equal, games will always run slower on OS X. Maybe not much slower, but noticeably. So there's a distinct possibility that Mac using game enthusiasts will continue either to run Boot Camp, or to keep a dedicated gaming PC on the side.

The other possibility is that CCP devotes much more attention to Cider than they currently do. I'm not sure that would be better for either them or for us, though Cider would likely benefit...

Proud founder and member of the Belligerent Desirables.

I voted in CSM X!
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#4 - 2013-12-12 00:41:04 UTC
Hogwash


I run Starcrat at 2560x1600 at 185fps with no lag and no problems

Diablo 3 runs awesome as well

both run OpenGL

WoW has built in FRAPS that is a NATIVE FUNCTION of OpenGL, plus iTunes control


CCP can do whatever they please, but it is becoming more and more clear that we are falling further and further behind and a decision will have to be made sooner rather than later.

Mac share might be low, but I think their demographic is prolly some of the highest percentage of Mac users out there. (College age kids and Millennial's)
William Darkk
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2013-12-12 16:46:03 UTC  |  Edited by: William Darkk
I remember that there was a test of OpenGL rendering speed on some game that had native mac, linux, and windows versions (quake 3?). Somebody tested it using an Intel Mac Mini and found that the Mac OS version had the lowest framerate.

Anyway yeah it'd be nice if they let us know what's going on occasionally.

BTW, if the ratio for steam users holds up there may be almost as many mac eve people online as all of Dust.
Dersen Lowery
The Scope
#6 - 2013-12-12 20:35:20 UTC
Kenneth Feld wrote:
Hogwash


I didn't say it was bad, just that it was worse than Windows running on the same hardware by a more-or-less fixed percentage. And it's because of a trade-off which I'll take any day of the week, personally. Stability > a few % extra performance.

That said, native OpenGL is hella faster than non-native DirectX via reverse-engineered middleware.

Kenneth Feld wrote:
Mac share might be low, but I think their demographic is prolly some of the highest percentage of Mac users out there. (College age kids and Millennial's)


True. But Mac users who are also heavy gamers generally have either Parallels or dual-boot into Windows, or have a dedicated gaming PC on the side. The Mac client would have to be good enough to convince even some Mac users to run it on OS X. I'm running EVE on my Mac, on OS X, because I'm not a heavy gamer, and I can't possibly justify the expense of investing in any of those alternatives for the sake of one game. For that money, there are a lot of other things that I would much rather have.

Proud founder and member of the Belligerent Desirables.

I voted in CSM X!