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Drone files for divorce from husband !
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Agiri Falken
Akagi Initiative
#61 - 2013-12-14 00:34:59 UTC
*snicker* Oh wow... Cupcake thinks she got somewhere with me. Roll
Pontianak Sythaeryn
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#62 - 2013-12-14 01:17:19 UTC
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
A cheap shot, I know - although in my defence, Rook and Pawn could simply have been two of the staggering variety of cheeses that originate in the Federation.


And as a cheese fan, I am GLAD we have so many to choose from let me tell you...

Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
If you think that all that advertising and product placement (both overt and subliminal) doesn't affect your purchasing and lifestyle choices then you're blinder than I thought. In addition there is a healthy difference between self-scrutinising and self-obsession!


For whatever it is worth, I use one of the multitude of advertisement blocking injector enhancement links that keep me mostly advertisement free. Ads are so annoying...

As for self obsession, perhaps you should look in the mirror and ask yourself who really is self obsessed Mr. I-Think--We-Should-Be-Pegged-In-Our-Jobs.

Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
I understand that actual information about the Caldari way of life is drowned out by disinformation and propaganda in the Federation. Are you aware that most Caldari citizens are actually stockholders in their home corporations? It is literally impossible to enrich the Corporation without enriching the shareholders. We own our fate in the most basic and undeniable of ways.


So... you don't have bloody gladitorial battles that are wildly popular and used for betting to see who will make the other person a bloody mess on the floor first? Because there was a broadcast just the other day I think...

Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
You readily submit to experts in the field of engineering, research, finance, medicine, law and education - amongst countless other fields. Why the stubborn denial of the value of an expert in this field too? I do agree with you regarding the importance of training, by the way, but training is at it's most effective at a young age. My vocational training began at age five.


Experts agree and disagree on things to, there isn't a hard consensus on which is the best capsuleer. Both ways work, that we know, just one requires training, something that you value. What's the problem?
Pontianak Sythaeryn
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#63 - 2013-12-14 01:25:35 UTC
Veikitamo Gesakaarin wrote:
Pontianak Sythaeryn wrote:

This is the difference between the Gallente and the Caldari. With the Caldari, you do as your told like a good little worker bee. Keep in line! Do your job! Enrich your Corporate masters!

The Gallente are different, we have the freedom to make our own choices, forge our own way in life. We all make choices, but in the end, our choices make us. At least we have that freedom to make those choices, you're life was already set. Sad.


I see.

Well if you take someone like Diana Kim as indicative of what all Caldari are like, just because it might confirm your prejudices then I suppose I'll take Gerne Broteau as indicative of what all Gallente are like shall I?

Tell me then, why are all Gallenteans intolerant nationalists who engage in massacre and mass murder during events promoting peace?


(OOC: Your profile is hilarious btw, Power Word: Orgasm! ahahaha)

I actually don't take Diana as indicative of all Caldari, what I've said is just as I understand it is what most Caldari live like. (OOC: And is also on the Evelopedia description of the Caldari race mind you)

As for Gerne Broteau... you know full well that the Gallente consider him a criminal and even handed him over to the Minmatar Republic for whatever punishment they decreed before handing over our own justice. If you're argument means you have to knowingly make a false accusation to make your point, then your entire point is thrown into question.
Saya Ishikari
Ishukone-Raata Technological Research Institute
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#64 - 2013-12-14 02:10:40 UTC
Aaaaaand right back to the same old sthick once again...

"At the end of it all, we have only what we've left in our wake to be remembered by." -Kyoko Ishikari, YC 95 - YC 117
Caviar Liberta
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#65 - 2013-12-14 02:37:24 UTC
Pontianak Sythaeryn wrote:
Diana Kim wrote:
I would be honored to share a cup of finest Caldari tea with you and talk about philosophical problems, like with polite and respectable human, who might been hiding all the time behind this ugly disrespectful and stupid jaijii mask. Otherwise, unfortunately, you will have to speak with my fist instead.

And IF you continue talking this way, you will have to speak with my jackboot.


I am trying to figure out why anybody that is educated, polite, and respectable would want to have such an intimate chat over tea (regardless of the quality or origin of said tea) with somebody that name calls and directs threats of physical violence on others they disagree with.


Perhaps ms. Kim was offering an invitation to partake in the Caldari tea ceremony? The end result usually isn't very favorable for one of the participants.
Arkady Vachon
The Gold Angels
Sixth Empire
#66 - 2013-12-14 05:33:38 UTC
Caviar Liberta wrote:
Pontianak Sythaeryn wrote:
Diana Kim wrote:
I would be honored to share a cup of finest Caldari tea with you and talk about philosophical problems, like with polite and respectable human, who might been hiding all the time behind this ugly disrespectful and stupid jaijii mask. Otherwise, unfortunately, you will have to speak with my fist instead.

And IF you continue talking this way, you will have to speak with my jackboot.


I am trying to figure out why anybody that is educated, polite, and respectable would want to have such an intimate chat over tea (regardless of the quality or origin of said tea) with somebody that name calls and directs threats of physical violence on others they disagree with.


Perhaps ms. Kim was offering an invitation to partake in the Caldari tea ceremony? The end result usually isn't very favorable for one of the participants.



No, they tend to end up with an unpleasant case of death.

Besides, I drink coffee.

*grins*

Nothing Personal - Just Business...

Chaos Creates Content
Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Doomheim
#67 - 2013-12-15 03:27:26 UTC
Pontianak Sythaeryn wrote:

As for Gerne Broteau... you know full well that the Gallente consider him a criminal and even handed him over to the Minmatar Republic for whatever punishment they decreed before handing over our own justice. If you're argument means you have to knowingly make a false accusation to make your point, then your entire point is thrown into question.


There was no argument, simply a disingenuous jab intended to show through the power of irony how foolish it is to attempt to take one person or one aspect of a society and seek to imply they are indicative of all people within a nation in order to claim some sort of moral high ground. None of our hands are clean in the end.

As for your misconceptions of Caldari society, they are just as common as ignorance itself, and now when ignorance is beneath my contempt, and contempt is beneath my dignity then I have little incentive to disabuse the trite notions of common ignorance.

Kurilaivonen|Concern
Pontianak Sythaeryn
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#68 - 2013-12-16 17:33:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Pontianak Sythaeryn
Veikitamo Gesakaarin wrote:
As for your misconceptions of Caldari society, they are just as common as ignorance itself, and now when ignorance is beneath my contempt, and contempt is beneath my dignity then I have little incentive to disabuse the trite notions of common ignorance.


*hands you a flyer by the Lai Dai Corp advertising a gladiatorial event being held in a weeks galactic standard time, showcasing various sharp objects to be used*

So.... you are either ignorant of your own society, or a liar. Which is it?

(OOC: Also per the Caldari overview listed here: https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Caldari#Overview "To curb their aggressive tendencies, the Caldari actively pursue and sponsor a range of sporting activities. Many of these are bloody, gladiatorial-like competitions")
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#69 - 2013-12-16 19:39:06 UTC
I suppose it depends how you define 'bloody gladatorial conflicts'.

Boxing and other martial arts exhibitions?

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Agiri Falken
Akagi Initiative
#70 - 2013-12-17 01:01:19 UTC
Pontianak Sythaeryn wrote:
Veikitamo Gesakaarin wrote:
As for your misconceptions of Caldari society, they are just as common as ignorance itself, and now when ignorance is beneath my contempt, and contempt is beneath my dignity then I have little incentive to disabuse the trite notions of common ignorance.


*hands you a flyer by the Lai Dai Corp advertising a gladiatorial event being held in a weeks galactic standard time, showcasing various sharp objects to be used*

So.... you are either ignorant of your own society, or a liar. Which is it?

(OOC: Also per the Caldari overview listed here: https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Caldari#Overview "To curb their aggressive tendencies, the Caldari actively pursue and sponsor a range of sporting activities. Many of these are bloody, gladiatorial-like competitions")


Honey, I hate to break it to you... But back when I did my share of that showcase crap, there were Gallenteans in the audience cheering and hollering right along with the rest. Best get that nose back down to eye level before you strain your neck. Combat sports are not at all uncommon across New Eden, including in the Federation, with only the degree of realism varying.

Personally, I've never once seen live rounds used, or a complete lack of safety precautions. Martial arts, boxing and close quarters firearms and melee combat are all common, but people getting killed, or even seriously injured, is the exception, not the norm. Sure, we all leave with welts, bruises and the occasional fracture, which can happen on a sparring mat, but I think you're just skimming the surface here and assuming that the depths hold nothing more.

In a closing word... I've spent some time in your Federation, having had no other choice at one point, and now I base my view of it on what I've seen and learned... I suggest you do the same when it comes to outsiders. Walk in the others shoes before spouting off at the mouth... Or keep spouting off, it's not like we don't expect it, and I'm sure that Inhonores character would love some company.
Pontianak Sythaeryn
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#71 - 2013-12-17 15:58:04 UTC
Agiri Falken wrote:
In a closing word... I've spent some time in your Federation, having had no other choice at one point, and now I base my view of it on what I've seen and learned... I suggest you do the same when it comes to outsiders. Walk in the others shoes before spouting off at the mouth... Or keep spouting off, it's not like we don't expect it, and I'm sure that Inhonores character would love some company.


You seem to think that I'm not aware of my own society... without realizing why our society is the way it is. We have a greater cultural diversity than anybody else as we take in all the people of New Eden, and that means it comes with all the good, and the bad. I'm fully aware of our own Gladiator rings, but as I'm sure you noticed, it's enjoyed by a smaller population. Freedom means we are all free to explore cultures that we wish. That's a freedom we have... do you?
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#72 - 2013-12-17 17:49:48 UTC
Pontianak Sythaeryn wrote:
Agiri Falken wrote:
In a closing word... I've spent some time in your Federation, having had no other choice at one point, and now I base my view of it on what I've seen and learned... I suggest you do the same when it comes to outsiders. Walk in the others shoes before spouting off at the mouth... Or keep spouting off, it's not like we don't expect it, and I'm sure that Inhonores character would love some company.


You seem to think that I'm not aware of my own society... without realizing why our society is the way it is. We have a greater cultural diversity than anybody else as we take in all the people of New Eden, and that means it comes with all the good, and the bad. I'm fully aware of our own Gladiator rings, but as I'm sure you noticed, it's enjoyed by a smaller population. Freedom means we are all free to explore cultures that we wish. That's a freedom we have... do you?


You should be aware that the State seldom works through legalistic banning of jaijii cultures. Instead we leave it to the people themselves to show their lack of appreciation of those that attempt to import foreign cultural values through the use of peer norming.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Pontianak Sythaeryn
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#73 - 2013-12-17 18:24:39 UTC
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
You should be aware that the State seldom works through legalistic banning of jaijii cultures. Instead we leave it to the people themselves to show their lack of appreciation of those that attempt to import foreign cultural values through the use of peer norming.


Oppression by the State vs Oppression by it's citizens by showing intolerance towards other cultures. Oppression is oppression. I suppose this comes to our biggest difference.

"All For the Good of Many." Sound familiar? It should to you... we celebrate individual freedom. You all... don't.

((I"m actually reminded of reading the Jovian Wetgrave. https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/The_Jovian_Wetgrave Poor Pirkotan, sacrificed for the State, never knowing that he was going to be willingly sacrificed without being allowed to object. Like the cog in the great State machine))
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#74 - 2013-12-17 18:36:19 UTC
We prefer the term "Collectivist Focus" and you're right, we celebrate those who sacrifice of themselves for the good of all of us, not those who sacrifice us for their own good.

It's, culturally, a very divergent viewpoint and it probably explains why we couldn't co-exist in the same political body.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Korsavius
Revenent Defence Corperation
#75 - 2013-12-17 18:44:32 UTC
Interesting how a topic of a drone filing for divorce leads to banter going back and forth between two parties. As for the topic at hand, I am not at all surprised something like this would happen in the Federation.

Cold Wind's Blade || Follow the I-RED Newsfeed & visit the I-RED GalNet site!
Pontianak Sythaeryn
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#76 - 2013-12-17 18:46:48 UTC
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
We prefer the term "Collectivist Focus" and you're right, we celebrate those who sacrifice of themselves for the good of all of us, not those who sacrifice us for their own good.

It's, culturally, a very divergent viewpoint and it probably explains why we couldn't co-exist in the same political body.


Both our cultures celebrate those that sacrifice themselves for the greater good.

I just get the feeling... you all don't always give people the choice whether they are to the be the sacrifice or not. Call it a hunch if you want. Call me a liar as well if you wish. I'm just a old timer miner looking at getting into ship production rather than military fighting. I create, I try not to destroy unless defending myself and my opinion is my own. This is just the feeling I get from dealing with Caldari over the years.
Anslo
Scope Works
#77 - 2013-12-17 18:47:41 UTC
Korsavius wrote:
Interesting how a topic of a drone filing for divorce leads to banter going back and forth between two parties. As for the topic at hand, I am not at all surprised something like this would happen in the Federation.

OK be honest...are you really that surprised it turned into Gallente vs. Caldari debate #748398?

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#78 - 2013-12-17 18:52:08 UTC
There are sacrifices and sacrifices.

I wouldn't call you a liar, but the truth is that most of what you know about our culture comes from comparing it negatively with your own. Add in the taciturnity of most Caldari when it comes to discussing how our culture works - after all we don't seek to convert others to our way of life - and also our portrayal in the ever hostile Federation media, and it's easy to see how misunderstandings arise.

Collectivism isn't an optional character quirk in the State. It's expected. If you don't display Heiian then you're a disgrace to your corporation, your kirjuun and your ancestors. You're a failure. As much as we're famous for focusing on competence and efficiency, most Caldari would rather share air with an incompetent than someone who has no heiian in their heart.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Korsavius
Revenent Defence Corperation
#79 - 2013-12-17 21:35:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Korsavius
Anslo wrote:
Korsavius wrote:
Interesting how a topic of a drone filing for divorce leads to banter going back and forth between two parties. As for the topic at hand, I am not at all surprised something like this would happen in the Federation.

OK be honest...are you really that surprised it turned into Gallente vs. Caldari debate #748398?

I don't think I mentioned anything about being surprised. I was merely pointing out my fascination with how certain interactions develop between people of different backgrounds. However, if the past few exchanges in communication between the parties in question reveal anything, I would say this debate has ended on a rather positive note. Carry on.

Cold Wind's Blade || Follow the I-RED Newsfeed & visit the I-RED GalNet site!
Erys Charantes
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#80 - 2013-12-18 00:59:31 UTC
I would like to take this opportunity to state that not all of us hailing from the Federation feel we have some inalienable right to sit in judgement over those around us. Especially when doing so involves the hypocrisy of believing we know more about a culture than the people living in it. The tenants of the Federation; freedom, tolerance, and understanding, are more than books to be thumped when it suits ones cause to do so.

As madame Falken said, walk a mile in the other man's shoes before you sit and judge.