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Suicide Ganking: coming to an end?

First post
Author
Russell Casey
Doomheim
#221 - 2011-11-06 13:43:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Russell Casey
Roosterton wrote:


No consequences? So -10 security status isn't a consequence now?



Faction navies can be dodged. Alts or friends with +status can be used to scout or haul gank-ships. The only major consequence really is being perma-flagged so other players can shoot you. Personally, I think CCP should just let outlaws into highsec so we get more carnage from them suicide ganking stuff and fighting with vigilantes. Having a second, watered down NPC police force never made much sense .
Roosterton
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#222 - 2011-11-06 13:45:47 UTC
Russell Casey wrote:
Roosterton wrote:


No consequences? So -10 security status isn't a consequence now?



Faction navies can be dodged. Alts or friends with +status can be used to scout or haul gank-ships. The only major consequence really is being perma-flagged so other players can shoot you.


Faction navies can be dodged while suicide ganking, sure, but what if you need to go to highsec to make isk? To pick up a shiny faction BS for your corp?

Or what if you're in lowsec, and now everybody can Peeveepee you without getting shot by sentries? (Although this may be a good thing, depending on your stance. P)
Ryllic Sin
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#223 - 2011-11-06 13:48:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Ryllic Sin
whoops...
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#224 - 2011-11-06 14:00:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Ryllic Sin wrote:
Surely the real soluton would be to extend your solution and make Eve more of real sandbox, less of the faux sandbox that it currently is.

An explanation - currently crafting in Eve is no different than most other MMOs, it is just a more complex version than most. In real sandbox games players have far more freedom when it comes to building stuff, they really can invent new stuff, in some even create the graphics.
…you know, I've always wondered what shoggoth-like insanity would be spawned by having something like Alpha Centauri's unit creation mechanism in an MMO — especially one with an industry and economy of the complexity of EVE. Shocked
Russell Casey wrote:
Faction navies can be dodged. Alts or friends with +status can be used to scout or haul gank-ships. The only major consequence really is being perma-flagged so other players can shoot you.
…and that is where we find the reason people why don't see any consequences of ganking: because they choose not to exercise this option and instead let the criminals off, scot-free.

Want to increase the actual consequences for gankers? Two words: tradeable killrights. Twisted
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
#225 - 2011-11-06 14:05:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Brooks Puuntai
About damn time. Make people actually choose their targets more carefully and take the full risk involved without having insurance to fall back on. Things have gotten out of hand, to where you can suicide just about anything just for ***** and giggles and still lose next to nothing.

CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE / Dynamic New Eden

MatrixSkye Mk2
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#226 - 2011-11-06 14:10:14 UTC
Roosterton wrote:
No consequences? So -10 security status isn't a consequence now?

Oh? Then why don't you explain to me how a -10 player suicide ganking in hi sec suffers from a lower sec status?

In other words how exactly is it hurting going from a -10 to a -10?

Quote:
Miners have plenty of options available to them:

Don't mine with super shiny shield boosters.
I wasn't aware that lul-ganking was due to "shiny shield boosters". I seriously doubt that not having shield boosters is going to stop suicide ganking.
Quote:

Don't mine in paper-thin mackinaws, and don't use paper-thin hulks either.

Fixed.

Quote:
D-scan at 500k, warp off if you see a fleet of thrashers on scan.

The problem isn't just thrashers. It's gangs of ships. And in hi sec, where there can be hundreds of players congrgated at any time it becomes extremely difficult sorting through gangs out looking for lul-ganks and players going about their business.

Quote:
But no, on top of that, and on top of the fact that suicide ganking for-the-lols means a rapid descent into the bowels of being outlawed from highsec, and despite the fact that insurance was already nerfed to a certain extent in Tyrannis...

Except it doesn't. -10's can and do enter hi sec with impunity thanks to alts providing them with any ship they wish upon arrival.

Successfully doinitwrong™ since 2006.

Tuggboat
Oneida Inc.
#227 - 2011-11-06 14:10:14 UTC
Great, Now that this is fixed it makes no sense for me to have to travel 20,30,40 jumps through gates. Now we need high sec cynos with limitless range and no fuel costs. You know its a bonus for from our High sec taxes. Rewards are lower cuase we got more benefits. Paid for by npc corp taxes or something like that. I see no use wasting valuable game time running 40 jumps to my lush incursion site. We need instant fleet formups to, fleet invite accept, cyno up. Will work nice for low sec too, no gate camps to hinder play. I never did understand travel, now it makes even less sense.

Or at least autopilot to zero
MatrixSkye Mk2
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#228 - 2011-11-06 14:10:28 UTC  |  Edited by: MatrixSkye Mk2
Roosterton wrote:
CCP are still trying to make it harder. It's like miners are supposed to sit there, activate lasers, and not have to do anything, and be in 100% complete safety.

Oh stop it with the melodrama. This change isn't going to stop suicide ganking. It will slightly curb it at best. They won't be 100% safe, so you can stop crying now.

Roosterton wrote:
Tippia actually raises a good, philosophical point when he does it? You're just failing at trying to use Tippia-arguments, which only Tippia is pro enough to use.

Ok then. Let me get all "philosophical" on you and ask the question... How so?

Successfully doinitwrong™ since 2006.

Roosterton
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#229 - 2011-11-06 14:12:46 UTC
MatrixSkye Mk2 wrote:

Oh stop it with the melodrama. This change isn't going to stop suicide ganking. It will slightly curb it at best. They won't be 100% safe, so you can stop crying now.


I know they're not going to be 100% safe. I'm saying that it's as if CCP wants them to be.

Quote:

Ok then. Let me be "philosophical" and ask the question... How so?


How so what? You said removing suicide ganking insurance was a good thing. Tippia then said "how so?" You can't answer a "how so" with another "how so," as that's just bad English.
MatrixSkye Mk2
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#230 - 2011-11-06 14:15:49 UTC  |  Edited by: MatrixSkye Mk2
Roosterton wrote:
How so what? You said removing suicide ganking insurance was a good thing. Tippia then said "how so?" You can't answer a "how so" with another "how so," as that's just bad English.

You said Tippia asks philosophical questions, so I'm asking you a Tippian philosophical question... How so? :)

And I've already explained why. I suggest you read my previous post.

Successfully doinitwrong™ since 2006.

Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
#231 - 2011-11-06 14:16:34 UTC
Roosterton wrote:


How so what? You said removing suicide ganking insurance was a good thing. Tippia then said "how so?" You can't answer a "how so" with another "how so," as that's just bad English.


Why not? Blink

CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE / Dynamic New Eden

Russell Casey
Doomheim
#232 - 2011-11-06 14:20:54 UTC
Roosterton wrote:
Russell Casey wrote:
Roosterton wrote:


No consequences? So -10 security status isn't a consequence now?



Faction navies can be dodged. Alts or friends with +status can be used to scout or haul gank-ships. The only major consequence really is being perma-flagged so other players can shoot you.


Faction navies can be dodged while suicide ganking, sure, but what if you need to go to highsec to make isk? To pick up a shiny faction BS for your corp?

Or what if you're in lowsec, and now everybody can Peeveepee you without getting shot by sentries? (Although this may be a good thing, depending on your stance. P)


Most -10s are alts or use alts to make isk. Which is ironic when they whine about NPC corps and AFK-isk farming in highsec. And even without alts to haul stuff, a lot of pirate alliances still have +people moving stuff for them. See, spending all your time in an NPC corp grinding away may protect you from war dec's and corp pirates, but it limits your imagination and abiltiy to work with others.
Jack All'Trade
Doomheim
#233 - 2011-11-06 14:23:31 UTC
Roosterton wrote:
MatrixSkye Mk2 wrote:

Oh stop it with the melodrama. This change isn't going to stop suicide ganking. It will slightly curb it at best. They won't be 100% safe, so you can stop crying now.


I know they're not going to be 100% safe. I'm saying that it's as if CCP wants them to be.

Quote:

Ok then. Let me be "philosophical" and ask the question... How so?


How so what? You said removing suicide ganking insurance was a good thing. Tippia then said "how so?" You can't answer a "how so" with another "how so," as that's just bad English.


You mean asking "how so" doesn't make you seem clever? Huh i did not know that.
Roosterton
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#234 - 2011-11-06 14:25:54 UTC
MatrixSkye Mk2 wrote:
Roosterton wrote:
How so what? You said removing suicide ganking insurance was a good thing. Tippia then said "how so?" You can't answer a "how so" with another "how so," as that's just bad English.

You said Tippia asks philosophical questions, so I'm asking you a Tippian philosophical question... How so? :)

And I've already explained why. I suggest you read my previous post.


And I already explained why not, so you should revise your argument to something better before retorting with another "how so."
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#235 - 2011-11-06 14:25:59 UTC
I think that during a suicide gank the insurance payout funds for the victim's ship should come from whoever fires the killing blow. Don't have sufficient funds in you account? You cannot shoot a player in high sec.

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Roosterton
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#236 - 2011-11-06 14:29:53 UTC
Vincent Athena wrote:
I think that during a suicide gank the insurance payout funds for the victim's ship should come from whoever fires the killing blow. Don't have sufficient funds in you account? You cannot shoot a player in high sec.


Roll
Rico Minali
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#237 - 2011-11-06 14:34:03 UTC
Good. I am a fan of the ability to suicide gank, have done it and will do more. However whatthis will do is stop peopel randomly suiciding freighters on the off chance itll have some nice loot, knowing that you arnt losing hundreds of millions in BSs.

Suicide ganking will, and should, still go on, itll be more of a risk to do so now, as it should be. If you fail now, you actually lose somethign of value.
And yes, dessies can still pop miners, thats fine.

Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.

Sader Rykane
Midnight Sentinels
#238 - 2011-11-06 14:37:49 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Large Collidable Object wrote:
from a gameplay perspective it makes sense - which insurance would pay if you go on an amok-drive and the police wrecks your car?
From a gameplay perspective, it would also make sense to remove CONCORD and leave that stuff to the faction police forces. Which police force teleports to the scene of the crime, automatically knows who did it, and then instantly kills almost everyone involved?


Concord is there to watch pod pilots. There are relatively FEW pod pilots in space compared with people in space.
Not to mention concord operate with stuff like...this.

We are way to powerful to not have our every move watched constantly. So yes, I totally think its plausible that CONCORD not only watches us 24/7, but probably knows what we intend to do before we do it and has ships on standby.
Saint Lazarus
Spiorad ag fanaiocht
#239 - 2011-11-06 14:41:34 UTC
to summarize my feelings

This is bullcrap

But I dont care enough to whine any more than that
Kyneska
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#240 - 2011-11-06 14:44:55 UTC
I think tippias ideas to remove concorde are stupid, its like she isnt aware that a giant blob force resides in 0.0 and the only thing holding them out of empire is concord.