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Are the days of Local really numbered?

First post First post
Author
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#101 - 2013-12-07 08:47:55 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Grath Telkin wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
fun fact maybe you're not aware of this but cynojammers aren't exactly cheap to keep online and they wouldn't do a goddamn thing anyway because everyone's doing blackops drops


http://i.imgur.com/YXg8TQQ.png

Yea man I can tell from that image that you are beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men...it truly must be a rough and tumble world out there for you guys.

That had what to do with what he said?


Well you'd think if everyone was doing blops drops (like he said) that those numbers would be slightly lower, but I guess he's just talking out of his ass and Goon space (which I roam) is an order of magnitude safer than Empire, or in my words, is fortified like the gates of Mordor, which he said i was lying about.

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.

James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#102 - 2013-12-07 08:52:16 UTC
Well last time I was in our ratting systems I don't recall 50 bubbles on a gate or cynojammers. But sure, I'll just take your word for it...

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#103 - 2013-12-07 09:07:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Grath Telkin
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Well last time I was in our ratting systems I don't recall 50 bubbles on a gate or cynojammers. But sure, I'll just take your word for it...


On a side not i just watched that video in your sig, i find it amazing that we made that jump and never were told about that Nyx in danger at all, we were just told 'we've been dropped', that level of non communication is staggering.


EDIT: Tips as well, you weren't being pirmaried, no reason to run your armor hardeners, its not much but its cap when what you were hurting for most was cap at times, 2nd fire your cap booster one charge at a time, right around the 20-15% mark so it keeps you at peak recharge. Third you should clear your targets other than vital targets, you could have been neuting Hurley much sooner but your target que was full so often with crap you weren't doing anything with.

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.

Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#104 - 2013-12-07 09:11:59 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
One thing that would help is making PvE with a PvP fit a reality. Then if someone is caught, at least they have a chance to fight off the attackers. Right now everyone is forced or opts for a 100% PvE fit to gain the best ISK. And because PvP with a PvE fit is suicide, the very moment a hostile comes in system, the smartest thing to do is to get safe.

Yeah this is something I've liked since a dev mentioned it somewhere. A fix and a conflict driver, ho ho
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#105 - 2013-12-07 09:19:48 UTC  |  Edited by: James Amril-Kesh
Grath Telkin wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Well last time I was in our ratting systems I don't recall 50 bubbles on a gate or cynojammers. But sure, I'll just take your word for it...

EDIT: Tips as well, you weren't being pirmaried, no reason to run your armor hardeners, its not much but its cap when what you were hurting for most was cap at times, 2nd fire your cap booster one charge at a time, right around the 20-15% mark so it keeps you at peak recharge. Third you should clear your targets other than vital targets, you could have been neuting Hurley much sooner but your target que was full so often with crap you weren't doing anything with.

I appreciate the advice, but as far as the hardeners go, in a fight like that I prefer to keep them running because I can't always be sure that my next command is going to be processed at all. I kind of forgot I even had the cap booster running.
As far as the target queue goes, I try to do that but it can be rather difficult with the kind of lag I was experiencing. I play EVE on a five year old laptop and I don't have the money for a better computer, so this is what I'm stuck with for now.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#106 - 2013-12-07 09:24:52 UTC
So if local is going to be removed in some way, what about all the data that is on the map and on dotlan, such as people in system, rats killed etc., should that still be there, if you want to get rid of instant intel so that space is big and people really have to hunt that has to go to, otherwise what James Amril-Kesh said will happen and the only people ratting in 0.0 will be Garth Telkin and those that can escalate to the end game. I can live with no local as long as people don't get intel that I am ratting in a rubbish system that no one ever goes to and zero in on me with no effort what so ever.

I will expect the worst, but wait to see what CCP do, but if all that intel is still there on the maps and on Dotlan then I will hammer away at CCP on the forums and with petitions to get them to remove it and anyone who wants a game that is difficult for all types of people should do so, who wants to play a game called drive by ganking!!!!

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#107 - 2013-12-07 09:32:41 UTC
Oh you're 100% right, the feeds that give all that intel on rats and jumps and crap like that would have to get shut off, its just too much of a boon to the hunter, if everybody is blinded then everybody has to be blinded.

HOWEVER

You're not going to get blinded, they're aware of how insane it would make the life of people if suddenly local was just gone, and thats not at all whats being suggested by anybody. CCP plainly states that they'll replace it with SOMETHING, but it will just be something slightly less efficient or more effort intensive than 'watch window get info'.

TL;DR you wont be totally blind like some people in this thread are making out, but it likely wont be the easy mode it is now.

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.

flakeys
Doomheim
#108 - 2013-12-07 09:36:05 UTC
Xavier Higdon wrote:
I hope they remove it from all non-Empire systems. It just doesn't make sense that you can see everybody in a system like that. Sure, it makes my travels in Null safer, but it also stops tactics such as ambushes, surprise attacks and counter attacks from being possible outside of blob warfare, and I'm a big fan of tactical planning.




Why only nullsec?

Screw that if this goes through - and i would like local to be removed btw - it should be in EVERY system in eve.



You think the nullsec carebears will cry a lot , just wait till you see how both wardec-targets AND those who regularly dec in empire are relying on local chat information.Try agressing on the 4-4 undock now without a care when there's a potential 50 man warfleet waiting next door to screw you over , not to mention the fun of probing a target out in a systeLol .

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.

James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#109 - 2013-12-07 09:38:57 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:
You're not going to get blinded, they're aware of how insane it would make the life of people if suddenly local was just gone, and thats not at all whats being suggested by anybody. CCP plainly states that they'll replace it with SOMETHING, but it will just be something slightly less efficient or more effort intensive than 'watch window get info'.

TL;DR you wont be totally blind like some people in this thread are making out, but it likely wont be the easy mode it is now.

So in other words, we don't actually disagree.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Johnny Uma
State War Academy
Caldari State
#110 - 2013-12-07 09:43:43 UTC
Couldn't they replace it with an improved D-Scan? Or some kind of regional chat as someone suggested. Maybe even something really cool I haven't even thought about.

James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#111 - 2013-12-07 09:46:18 UTC
Regional/constellation intel is probably not a good idea, because in some respects that actually gives even more information than local already does.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

flakeys
Doomheim
#112 - 2013-12-07 09:50:40 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
One thing that would help is making PvE with a PvP fit a reality. Then if someone is caught, at least they have a chance to fight off the attackers. Right now everyone is forced or opts for a 100% PvE fit to gain the best ISK. And because PvP with a PvE fit is suicide, the very moment a hostile comes in system, the smartest thing to do is to get safe.



I can see your point , however enlighten me how the underlined is not the same as the empire miner telling us he had fit no tank against ganks because it would make his minerals mined per hour suffer badly?

You know the guys we like to point and laugh at ?

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.

flakeys
Doomheim
#113 - 2013-12-07 09:52:25 UTC
Johnny Uma wrote:
Couldn't they replace it with an improved D-Scan? Or some kind of regional chat as someone suggested. Maybe even something really cool I haven't even thought about.




My guess would be that whatever they come up with , the guy who has a spare alt and can run a scanbot in the system next door will be the happiest ratter in the region Blink .

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.

Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#114 - 2013-12-07 09:57:32 UTC
Local is fine, stop worrying about it! Big smile

Good to know that CCP has come to same conclusions that I arrived at all those years ago when local complaints started up. It cannot and must not be yanked until a suitable alternative exists. High-sec would be flooded by null refugees, while null itself would have nothing but POS refuelers and roaming gank squads searching for non-existent prey.

Random brainfarts to facilitate the local nerf wanted by leet PvPers who ran out of blues (trololol that!):

Mobile anchorable listening posts
- Anchor and anything within 2AU of the listening post shows in local.
- Hover over name in local list to see which listening post is actually detecting it (can be multiple).
- Fairly weak structures that can be (almost) summarily destroyed by a couple of gank BCs.
- Comes as a standard option on supercapitals but they lose the ability to jump if enabled and for 20 minutes after deactivation.
** There's a non-PvE thing to use the SoE ships for, hunter-killers to take out detection capabilities prior to main force arrival. Probe down, destroy, cloak, repeat.

Automatic pings from on-board scanner. Extend range when field is narrowed, up to 3-4x at 15 degrees.

Module to boost on-board scanner range, or to be tricky let it provide you with infinite range with results showing up like the various scannable plexes do now upon entering a system .. so you get the (oft abused in horror genre) scare effect of the light from your torch illuminating a snarling face only to find it gone when you swing it back (ie. will need to actually probe stuff down).
As for subsequent probing: Getting a warpable result on a ship automatically adds it a local list until such time it is destroyed or leaves system.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#115 - 2013-12-07 10:11:23 UTC
I think given Malcanis' little tease (the bastard) there's almost no point to talking about this anymore until CCP reveals just what they have in store. But it seems pretty clear the answer to OP's question is yes.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#116 - 2013-12-07 10:22:19 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:
Oh you're 100% right, the feeds that give all that intel on rats and jumps and crap like that would have to get shut off, its just too much of a boon to the hunter, if everybody is blinded then everybody has to be blinded.

HOWEVER

You're not going to get blinded, they're aware of how insane it would make the life of people if suddenly local was just gone, and thats not at all whats being suggested by anybody. CCP plainly states that they'll replace it with SOMETHING, but it will just be something slightly less efficient or more effort intensive than 'watch window get info'.

TL;DR you wont be totally blind like some people in this thread are making out, but it likely wont be the easy mode it is now.


So I will wait and see then, however its the more effort intensive that worries me, will I need to have 5 accounts to be able to rat in a single system for example, it has to be carefully thought out otherwise the small guy will have no chance and mindlessly trashing the D-scan button has no appeal to me either having done that for six months in a contested system in Stain and I was doing that when I had people in local, not all the time.

The changes to interceptors has reduced the efficiency of local anyway to a certain degree, the window of opportunity got wider in terms of the initial entry into a anomaly for example, however once aligned you were out when someone entered local, I have played the wait until people come in on you a fair few times, but largely in cheap ships, that can be fun, oh well as I said, I will wait and see.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#117 - 2013-12-07 10:24:22 UTC
flakeys wrote:
I can see your point , however enlighten me how the underlined is not the same as the empire miner telling us he had fit no tank against ganks because it would make his minerals mined per hour suffer badly?

You know the guys we like to point and laugh at ?


The thing is that "PvE fit" means shooting into the rats' weakest resistances, because ratting with, say, lasers in Guristas/Serpentis space is just ridiculous. It also means tanking for the rats' damage, which excludes EANMs and invulns.

If you want to log in and rat for an hour or two to keep your wallet afloat, you really don't want to spend time looking for somebody to fly a scimitar alongside you which would mean that you'd have to spend twice the amount of time shooting red crosses than you otherwise would, because 0.0 anomalies don't reward group play at all.

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration

Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#118 - 2013-12-07 11:10:05 UTC
Beekeeper Bob wrote:
Why do people keep bringing this up? Are you completely incompetent when it comes to tackling?
And you can have this right now, just jump into a wormhole....

Call me crazy and insane, but maybe because its an article that was published 2 days ago???

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)

Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#119 - 2013-12-07 11:17:20 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:
Oh you're 100% right, the feeds that give all that intel on rats and jumps and crap like that would have to get shut off, its just too much of a boon to the hunter, if everybody is blinded then everybody has to be blinded.

HOWEVER

You're not going to get blinded, they're aware of how insane it would make the life of people if suddenly local was just gone, and thats not at all whats being suggested by anybody. CCP plainly states that they'll replace it with SOMETHING, but it will just be something slightly less efficient or more effort intensive than 'watch window get info'.

TL;DR you wont be totally blind like some people in this thread are making out, but it likely wont be the easy mode it is now.


I don't mind having to spam my d-scan to get an escalation done in RA or zima territory (zima even assigned a scout to watch me which meant I had to finish by continuous watching for probes), but I'm not going to do it every 2 seconds of every ****ing anomoly.

I wouldn't care if I had to sweep my system to know if cloakers were present, and I had to put something at gates to flag me if they are being used, but honestly if I have to warp to friendlies or passing traffic just to do FOF identification then I'd probably unsub.
Spankerz
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#120 - 2013-12-07 11:50:09 UTC
If the Local days are numbered, so are sub for my 7 alts..

/Waiting for Biomass command.