EVE General Discussion

Saying that it is the area for newbie-level content is not very different from saying that it's a starter area. After all, that's where the newbie-level content belongs.

The concept you seem to have a hard time getting your head around is that, just because the basic design was abandoned fairly quickly, the content that was meant to fit into this deprecated design was kept around. That's why the skill requirements for both locating and completing this content are so low, and why you're not even allowed into some if you complicate matters too much. If it were a matter of risk, the dynamic would have looked very different (since the risk envelope and nature back then was vastly different to what it is now).

They're a relic, and while you might not like what that relic represents, the basic idea is there and is obvious. And risk is not it.

…and that doesn't change the fact that it was designed as starter area content: to use with starter-level skills in starter-level ships.

So yes, yes it is. You're probably putting too much normative and far too generalised a meaning into this deprecated design of a single content type.

…which no-one has said.

The former is entirely accurate in describing why the exploration sites have the distribution they have; the latter has nothing to do with the topic at hand so I don't even know why you bring it up.

I'll do that nasty evil thing I do and cut you off right there. You see what you said there? “Is”? That's the problem: you're using the wrong tense. Highsec exploration is starter-level content because that's how the game was laid out. It didn't take long for this initial design to fail to pan out.

Now people are pointing to this antique design as the explanation for why sites have a certain distribution, and their explanation is pretty spot on. You are contesting this based on how the game has developed since, skipping over the fact that the distribution hasn't really developed along with it, which was the point all along. Denying this truth because it's inconvenient or because you aren't able to separate present from past doesn't change the truth. It just makes you seem belligerent and prone to go chasing windmills.

Now if you want to update the design and want to make it more a matter of risk vs. reward, then we can start talking about how we should nerf highsec exploration in its current form, but that's a slightly different topic.

It's your own shame making you feel ashamed. By all means stay in the shallow end of the pool if that's what you want. Some people like the deep end better, and lots of people love to swim in the ocean.

The idea that hisec must be restricted to being a "newbie area" is bad and wrong and should be put in a bag and drowned like a litter of unwanted inbred puppies.

Weird

Yes, it's quite weird that you quote that section since it does not mention anything about starter systems being found in highsec.

Or, well, it's weird presuming that you were trying to provide some kind of counter to what I said since it doesn't really do that. If you were trying to do something else, it's… actually, still weird since then it's just some random quote with no connection or explanation for why it's being brought up.

This is fairly pointless. You have a tendency of denying your initial assertions or convoluting them with irrelevant responses to the point where you're no longer even defending your original assertion, but rather moving the goal posts around at will :\.

I'm outta here.

This is what you said:

Of course, you'll twist this around and claim how north is really south and history is now and the future is past and how what you said isn't really what you said because of shabba.

It's extremley fruistrating seeing this thread going into the old "high sec vs otherSec" areas.

I opened this topic with one thought in mind and it was explortion rewards in high sec vs other high sec activities.

instead lots of people here just brag about how cool they are and how big their e-peen is because they are not roaming inside highsec... know what? off topic... it's not the issue being discussed here so focus and if you don't have something usefull to say on the topin at hand then just Don't.

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I'll try to tl;dr this for people which can't bother themselves to read the previous post or even my first post.

COMPARING other activities in highsec I've found exploration rewards very very very dull.

Let's see,
1. mining - jump to the belt and mine, sometimes you get rats.. sometimes you are in fleet.
2. Agent missions - go to station.. pick the mission etc... not very difficult and on top of loot and such you get LP and standings.
3. trading, can be done anywhere but using mission hubs and mining hubs you can abuse the "buy low sell high" method.

4. exploration.
First I'll say that I LOVE exploration. right now I got navy cruiser to compensate my low skills in that field but I plan to upgrade to T2 and in the future to T3 and explore in low \ null \ wh as well but I won't go there before I got some skills and I've practiced enough so I won't do something stupid while I'm there.

At any rate exploration.... you need a ship fitted with scanning capbilities then find a nice quiet system.
next we need to scan using probes and find a site, which then we need extra mini game of hacking or fight in combat which most of the time will be full room aggro of 2 million ships at same time.

BUT, after hours upon hours of doing exploration (which again I love as an activity and I fund my toys with mining\refining\selling minerals) the rewards in highsec were extremly LOW compared to other high sec activities... most site netted me lower then 10k isk, very few broke the few 6 figures worth of loot.

one would think that activity such as exploration which require scanning skills, piloting skills, tanking skills, combat skills and more and require to actually travel across the galaxy locating sites for long time and pinpointing them would at least net same isk level as other high sec activities, but alas it's way way way to low compared to other activities.

Hell, train some pi skills for 3 days then you make tens of millions a week doing nothing but click festing ones a day.

I don't care about rewards I don't ask to change anything I just want to know WHY exploration rewards are so low COMPARED to other HIGH SEC activities.

please don't start with low\null\wh owns and telling me how I should go there. I know that's the place but I got plan in mind and for now I practice in high sec. please focus on the question at hand and I think I made myself clear this time so no one will get confused again.

o7

On this, at least, we agree.

One of the things I've noticed in this thread is there's a lot of 'wrongbadfun' going on here. Eve is a sandbox that is meant to include many play styles.

There's been a lot of punishing playstyles other than PvP over the history of eve, and frankly if we want to keep growing, we need to include rather than exclude.

I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together.