Player Features and Ideas Discussion

I know these threads have got gigantic, which is a good thing as it shows people are really interested and want this ship to mean something, but explainations get lost in this.

I would like to explain again why a covert cloak is not just desirable, but essential for this ship to operate in wormhole space, and why it is fatally flawed without one.

Firstly, a battleship without a bonus to remove the targeting delay after decloaking is actually the least powerful implementation of the covert ops cloak, It can suprise nothing, it takes so long to lock, anything can simply warp away.

Regarding the argument it can arrive and assign drones, any drone ship can do this, the cloak adds nothing. And if it is assigning drones to other ships THEY are your problem! And you certainly know they are there.

Now the reason why it is essential.
The nearest analogy of cloaked ships in a wormhole is a second world war German Wolfpack. It travelled out of sight and attacked it's prey or crept unseen past defenders to reach it's hunting area.

They COULD NOT travel with a logistics boat trailing them on the surface as it betrayed the fleet leading to the destruction of the fleet.

The same applies to wormholes, there is no point a fleet of 5 cloaked tengus travelling across 4 WH systems to get to good sleeper sites or to prepare to attack a POS or mining fleet, if they are accompanied with an uncloaked, Great White Whale screaming on D Scan as it crawls across the system, HERE WE ARE KILL US!!!

So limited to home or +1 system only. What use is that!
So fatally flawed will never find a home in WH space if incapable of warping cloaked.

The problem is those who do not live in wormholes do not understand the mechanics and understand that it simply is ridiculous to use it at all, without a covert ops cloak, and also do not realise that a battleship with a covert ops cloak is the LEAST powerful implementation of the technology, Far far more effective in combat terms when used on cruiser class or smaller,
Now a covert ops cloak on a HIC is another matter, then they should be really afraid.

I'd pay a billion for THAT!

One thing I don't get with the Nestor: It is the slowest (velocity) battleship with the worst inertia, yet it has the lightest mass and the fastest warp speed at 2.5 AU/s. These seem at odds with each other...

I think that it might have been previously designed by someone else, and brought back to life, unfortunately the stats seem to have been amended by someone who is overly concerned with the power of large ships, and applied restrictions to "dial it back".

Of course the opposite might also be true, and they are trying to blow life into a more conservative design .

Personally, i feel they are still being too cautious, while I imagine the meta of how the dominix was used has concerned them, that can always happen, there really is no way to predict, how things will be used and abused, there's just too many possibilities. Over cautious ship balance before launch just leads to dull, uninspired, and undesirable ships.

I agree it really does feel like manoeuvring a large white whale, you would expect it to feel more like a large battlecruiser,and the lightest mass, which would make it useful in wormholes, is unfortunately, like wheels on a fish, because without being able to warp cloaked it will never live there.
So the idea, of wherever it was designed for, has apparently been lost in time, I like the astero and Stratios, even though the stratios is a little confused, and i think it has lost some of it's original purity of concept it is still a good ship, but the Nestor is just plain lost.

So where to go from here?

I suggest, just for the moment CCP forget the word battleship, and look at what this ship would need to thrive and be desired in a wormhole environment.

It is lovely to have the option of other ships other than T3s.

So keep the low mass and make speed and inertia match.
Give logistics bonuses to shield cap and armor range and quantity with bonuses that take account of the ships it will be supporting.
The reason for both shield and armor bonuses is that different wormholes have different environments, it may support a shield fleet in one and an armor fleet in the next, where that is the only sensible choice due to conditions.

The ability to warp cloaked is as important to this ship as a hatch is to a submarine. Provide it as a base stat. And thereby avoid all the covert ops preconceptions.


Improve sensor strength.

Sleepers are a drones worst nightmare, either move the balance of damage to a fewer number of lasers with damage boosts, to allow logistics and damage, or massively boost the survive-ability of the mobile drones,
sentries are not ideal here. A Possible good idea would be for it to be designed to field "sisters" medium drones that have the best assets of all sizes, heavy's damage and strength , with light's speed, tracking and sig and shield recharge. Only can be flown by sisters ships, or build the bonuses into the ship.

Allow me to introduce you to my friend, the stratios...

I tried to fit a laser build at one point but gave up on it after a few tries, just like my attempt at making a hacking/analyzing fit. Since the Nestor doesn't have any speed or manuverability, it has almost no way to dictate distance and take advantage of the optimal range bonus. You could use a MJD but you're limited by the long cooldown, it's barely worth the effort. I've brought up this weakness before, but the ship has bigger issues elsewhere.

You have other options anyways, during my test builds I've been using hybrid drone/logistics builds. They offer more dynamic options in combat, and don't strain the cap you could be using to RR with.

This pirate Faction Battleship is an extremely expensive ship that is not very easy to acquire even through LPs.

That makes this ship something that should be special, however I do feel it does lack a great purpose for it to be used.

I would like to propose something special for this and possible future pirate faction Battleships by giving them something more.


Introduce: Integrated Ship Module


What does the ISM mean ?

For Instance when it concerns the SOE Nestor, that battleship is meant for exploration, and through eve lore, should have a high end sensor package that should out scan non pirate faction battleships.

This is already somewhat shown in the ships bonuses:
50% bonus to Core and Combat Scanner Probe strength
10+ bonus to Relic and Data Analyzer virus strength

HOWEVER, I would like to see an ISM for the Nestor to be a Cargo Scanner and / or Ship Scanner that does not cost a module slot !

This ISM is a Utility module only that even under normal fitting requirements would have used very low CPU or Powergrid and Cap.

Yes, yes it is...

I do see your point, however the only significant feature of the nestor is low mass. The only place where low mass is advantageous is in wormhole space, Low mass however is meaningless if the nestor is condemned to never go through wormholes to other systems, And doomed to stay at home. I have explained why if the ship cannot warp cloaked, is has no place in wormhole space. No need to restate all the reasons, in the threads there are thousands of words of explanation as to why.

You are right, uncloaked battleships are fine in your home system when you control the holes, and then you use logis too.
But you don't take them away from home any distance. If You take them away from home, you will compromise and whelp your fleet by sailing in clear on dscan past your enemies/hunters. So no sale.

So in short as it stands, even though CCP rise has specifically said that the nestor will be popular in wormholes, he is, in this case totally and completely wrong, sorry you can't get it right, every time, first time. I have faith that he is listening though, so there is still hope.
Without being able to warp cloaked, There is no role for the nestor in wormhole space, that's fine, we don't expect anything special, or special treatment.


But unfortunately there doesn't seem to be any other place for it, if you can suggest one there would be a lot of people who would be interested, particularly those who bought or built them and can't sell them.

That pretty much sums it up.