EVE General Discussion

No worries.. I can't find get out of CQ. Trapped.

Recent changes don't point to a nerf of highsec. It's more like CCP wants to use enticement and new features beforehand so that a nerf of highsec would go with little notice. I think we'll see the scope of highsec decrease to being mainly a noob starter zone someday. It's just not going to be a "highsec one day low the next gleeful gankfest" that all too many KB addicts have wet dreams over.

Will there always be highsec ISK snatcher types min-maxing every day with one eye on the wallet? Yes. Just like there will always be campers waiting all day for killing anything with one eye on the KB too. I blame Ritalin. But these playstyles are on the way out. The true "end game" of Eve is not to have enough ISK and SP to "go to null". It's not caring about ISK and SP and going anywhere you want.

Still waiting for your fellow goon to answer my inquiry: If nullsec is so wrecked or nerfed, why do people pay ISK to be there (rent)?

While you are asking that question, why not ask some others:

-How many renters/renter corps are there, what percentage of EVE players are they?

-Why aren't more (many more) people either renting or otherwise trying to invade SOV null sec?

-Why, in a game where numbers count, are their so many people hiding in high sec when they could simply bum-rush null sec and take the rewards since they are so good.


For me, the answer to the question of "why do you still go to null sec instead of doing incursions and such in high sec all day" is simple, boredom.

Missions are tedious and incursions get old fast for me (it's rinse and repeat all night long). Null exploration is less boring and while anom farming is also rinse and repeat, at least there is the chance for something unexpected to happen like an escalation or faction spawn (unexpected because it's based on chance. There is good isk and good fun in null sec.

But other than boredom, there is no reason to leave "empire", which is why I'm in the minority of EVE players (i'm weird that I actually like null PVE). You can make the same or close to the same average per day isk in high sec doing incursions or sisters or thukker agents or cosmos farming/item collecting, and you can make more, way way more in low sec if you know what you are doing (and outside of faction warfare, if you are willing to lay down serious isk for lvl 5 carrier blitzing).

The whole point of the discussion is that there should be more actual reasons to live in null than just boredom. Some of us would love to emancipate our High Sec alts from the delicious isky slavery of Empire space and put them in null where they belong...

well, I tried to keep up with all the comments on this forum posting but way to many.

I do wish they would fix Sovereignty warfare, mainly because I find HP grinding very very boring and in fact is why I left the game for a while.

So, My Sovereignty wish list:

1 - Sovereignty should be based on people controlling the system, not who can through up TCUs and everything. Maybe something to do with who is killing the most in system or something along those lines. I have no real idea how to make this work but anything where I don't have to form up and shot at stuff for hours just waiting for a fight from defenders that are hardly ever there ( Maybe this has changed about the attack defense thing but I doubt it )

2 - No POS mails for people placing a POS in your system, I feel it is the defenders responsibility to check their system out from time to time to make sure someone isn't building a safe/ forward base of operations.

3 - Truly upgrade-able Sovereignty, without it showing on the maps of what their sovereignty level is. (again, I think this should be the work of your Stealth network, be that your spies or your covert ops pilots or however else you can work for the information ) All systems should be able to be upgraded to support different things.

4 - at some sort of sovereignty level, people should be able to put a limited about of gate and station guns around the gates. Not as as good as NPC guns in high and low, but something. They own the system, witch means they should own who comes in without getting shot at. Items like status webbing or warp Jamming shouldn't be allowed to be anchored around gates and stations (Pilots should be able to still use bubbles and such as they wish )

5 - capture-able/destroy-able stations. If you want to capture a station you should have to force a landing (somehow, let the devs come up with how ) and clear the station of any active pilots in their through either shooting, accepting surrender, so on. Fighters can come back until the breaching party reaches the cloning facility of the station and shut it down, perhaps if Dust gets really going this can happen. ( I do not care one way of the other about WIS, but if it was possible for pilots to run around with a hand gun like in one trailer for EVE and clear rooms next to dust players (who, hopefully will come to PC and be better at some point, of course, I'm dreaming but that would be more fun than keeping your guns cycling while reading a book )

A quicker solution would have the attackers have to deploy something around the station to stop if from being blown up if you want to capture.

6 - Station upgrades, if I was designing the game from the start I would have wanted stations to start off as just a shell with rooms for pilots to store and sleep in relative safety. having people having to bring in more stuff to build up industry and everything else. The more you place in a station the better it is, until it is as good or even better than high sec stations. All depending on how much work and isk people want to sink into all of it.

7 - force projection is to large, I know everyone wants the fights (preferably without TIDI or any lag, with all the stuff on so you can see what is going on instead of having everything off for processing power ) So a nerf to capitals, something of a five/ten minute (Not sure what is now but I've seen people able to speed run across the whole New Eden in twenty minutes before ) So, just some time between jumps should solve it, or at least start to solve it. I think someone said get rid of jump freighters, but if you do that new guys trying to get into null to mix it up won't be able to (not that they can now but it would another barrier for them ) So to have a huge force projection and good timing Cap fleets might have to be a little smaller.

8 - each region needs something unique for it. A reason for people to want to go to that region and fight. No idea of any good ideas, perhaps stealing some of the Wormhole traits and giving them to defending sovereignty might be an idea? Perhaps tied in with the SOV upgrading, something like a Defensive upgrade? That would make Wormholes less unique though.... hmm...

9 - I haven't been in a huge battle since TiDi came around (again my Null was rat, go on roaming fleets when they where up and usually end up folded into a strat-op to shoot a POS or Station or something with lots of HP for no reason) but perhaps there is ways to optimize it? I really want to be able to fly around seeing every sort of light pass my ships as our own is going out to kill others. without having to spend five grand on my computer to even try.

10 - EVE needs more AOE things, maybe bigger versions of the stealth bomber? Something that can do a lot of damage to a clustered fleet (the massive anchor on someone fire is boring too btw and SB's can do some damage but unless is a horde of them most battle-cruisers and battleships shrug off the bombs )

11 - Caps and super caps should be able to be built in any SOV system, regardless up upgraded or not.




So, that is my list of what I would like, will happen probably not. I miss the days before all the I-hub shoots, but back then I thought the Mym was the coolest thing ever in my rookie days (and it took me three months for my alliance at the time to let me out into null.

Keep fighting out there o7

Yes, exactly. The only way people are going to the risk of moving minerals and products in 0.0 is to give them no alternative. People in Eve seem to fail at understanding the fundamental thing that made Eve work. In Eve you have to undock to make things happen, spend time doing a task, and take risk of being out in space!

The vast majority of the day to day problems in Eve have been created by CCP introducing risk free ways to accomplish the same task. The entire reason there is no industry in 0.0 is because it is safer to transport minerals back to empire, move them around there, build things there and then ship the finished products back to 0.0. It is not "easier" it is "safer".

The same is true of high sec incursions. They are functionally the highest paying thing to do in Eve. Yes, you can do sites in a C6 wormhole and make 400 million ISK per hour for two hours and then the sites are complete. Then you have nothing to do but roll holes for the other 22 hours of the day looking for someone to kill. Occassionally you will lose some capitals, but hey, it is worth the ISK right? I have seen people end a day of running high sec incursions with 1.5 billion ISK and loyalty points.

Where are all the people NPCing in low-sec or mining in a the low sec belts? Low-sec is a ghost town these days. There is virtually nothing that is uniqe in Eve located in low-sec (except for the security tags). Why doesn't CCP shift several minerals so they can only be found in small amounts in high-sec or 0.0. Give low-sec something unqiue that must be found there to fuel Eve's endless production needs.

Fix Eve is 100% about forcing people to get back out in space and take the risk.

Renting is plenty lucrative to an individual who uses it to reserve themselves content. That is why I currently rent. Everyone in null that lives there understands that what I do is plenty lucrative, and gives me plenty of choice in things to do when I logon.

The largest single category of nullsec systems, lowbands - 0.0 to -0.2, however can only support 1 person doing that a day +2 people at a time running hubs, and those hubs are worth 60m/hr to a 920 dps ishtar and they are short so unresponsive to faction battleships, carriers or other risky strategies due to regular warps and lock time issues.

TL;DR there won't be a patchwork of small corps growing in the renter fields, because the corp objectives (become a nullsec power), don't align well with individual objectives (do fun content). The content dries up as player count rises and life becomes one class of anomoly.

I want see advanced Incursions by NPCs have a chance at establishing NPC sovereignty if an appropriate response is not made. Include opportunistic reinforcement and escalation of Incursion NPC incursions. Attack stationary local assets (NPC POS attacks!!!)

Really stir things up. Make static sovereignty difficult to maintain even if you are the 600 kilogram canary (largest alliance or coalition). In fact NPCs should in some ways make things more difficult the larger the territory you hold.

Of course there might be some rewards for outstanding defense (dropped BPOs, pirate faction ships ejected from ship maintenance bays etc)...but certainly not CONCORD bounties. If anything drop raw materials in place of ISK bounties.

Miners in nullsec before were in grav signatures which required skilled 2 handed probing to find, bubbled on all warp in directions and hunted by ships with a fixed warp speed and local to check. Even in this incarnation 0.0 industry was well known to be shyte.

Now they are in public ore sites which require no probing at all, with interceptors that can breeze through the bubbles and land in 8 seconds, AND apparently local is getting changed now too.

All made that way by CCP.

If this is what happens when nullsec "dominates" the CSM I wouldn't like to see what happens when hisec starts voting....

What have the recent Rubicon changes done to Null Sec, very little really, Darwin weeded out the unobservant quickly, the much raged about interceptor changes had very little effect other than that surprisingly, why, again simply put CCP made it almost impossible for miners and ratters to go about life in Null Sec and make a profit in comparison to the risks involved a long time back unless they were prepared to work in large numbers over multiple systems, PI seems to be the in thing right now in systems were once there were maybe 20 or thirty hard core ratters, one or two remain grinding out a few hubs a day while spending most of there time docked up because someone reported an interceptor in the region, way to go CCP.

Were have all these players gone, Dunno to be honest, I still see a few regular faces travelling through systems but the majority have just vanished, probably like myself turned to PI, log in every few days to clear the product and then log right out again, sad place to see really, system after system utterly devoid of players for long periods of time except for the ever hopeful interceptor pilot roaming around aimlessly looking for something to blow up, must be soul destroying for them really, again way to go CCP.

Now these same people that killed roid mining, ice mining, scanning, jump bridges and ratting are proposing to nerf local in there ever more desperate attempts to force players to 'interact' still failing to see that this will never work, the Gung Ho kill em all types require the placid industrious types for there very reason to exist at all, CCP took away any real reason to be an industrious type in Null Sec so they left in large numbers and the former mentioned now have very little if anything to hunt at all, those that remain have turtled up easily covered by a few scouts and are long gone before the Gung Ho's even enter system, must be really devastating to have flown so many gates only to find a bunch of AFK miners lodged in a PoS, probably off walking the dog until boredom obliges the interceptor pilot to leave, or quit the game.

This is the type of thing that happens when only one aspect of play holds sway, they utterly believe they are right in doing what they are doing to EVE, a game once balanced in it's many styles has now become blinkered and ignorant of this aspect, FPS syndrome you might say, were they hold only one view, that every player just really REALLY wants to blow **** up and nothing else matters other than that, a build nothing kill everything mentality.

I guess it never occurred to them that some players really do only want to log in and mine rock or ice for hours at a time, alone or as a group, they find it attractive to play that way, maybe they will go off and join a fleet on occasions but maybe they won't, bottom line, that is why they sub EVE at all, just to enjoy that style of play, force them to do something that detracts from that and for a while they will adjust but eventually the appeal of EVE dies and they leave, why has no one noticed this happening, bit difficult for them to be heard really, they are not hard core PvP players, they are the little guy, solo mining for hours on end because they just enjoy doing that.

sorry out of topic , but you sir haz a amazing avatar head.


meh wrong qoute lol , @ Stahlregen