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Lowsec and nullsec are dark and scary

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Dalloway Jones
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2011-11-05 10:09:00 UTC
You guys sure weren't kidding. Actually it isn't just low and null it is also some systems that are in between nebulae like Genesis which is where I mostly hang out.

The problem is unless I am flying toward the sun and it isn't blocked by something I pretty much can't see my ship. Just a few blinking lights and maybe the outline of my ship flashing if I have on Armor hardeners or other modules that light things up.

Is this just a result of me being on a crappy Macbook Pro with a bad graphics card or is anyone else experiencing this? I can't seem to figure out a way in game to modify brightness levels.
Sirinda
Ekchuah's Shrine Comporium
#2 - 2011-11-05 10:43:53 UTC
Y'know....I was under the impression that this was some sort of whiny comment from the topic name.

Was just going to throw a "BOOOOOOO!" in for the lulz (goddamn Eve forums getting to me, it seems), but you do seem to make a valid point.

Could you post some pics because I'm kind of stuck in highsec ATM. I'd like to see if it's really as bad as you say.
Dalloway Jones
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2011-11-05 11:16:02 UTC
Nope! Not whining. When I read that comment on the dev blog I thought it sounded kind of cool so it stuck out.

Anyway this screen cap isn't the best example but it is a Brutix flying in Genesis without the sun directly on it. There are actually worse cases where you can't even really see the outline of the ship.

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6117/6314244817_62892cdd75_b.jpg

It is entirely possible that it is just a matter of my computer being sort of crap. So just wondering if anyone else is dealing with this. I mean realism and shadows are cool and all but just imagine if the Millennium Falcon had disappeared from view every time it flew against a dark starry background. I'd rather have science fantasy than reality as far as ship lighting is concerned.
Sirinda
Ekchuah's Shrine Comporium
#4 - 2011-11-05 11:24:33 UTC
Mh. I think it may be your computer. The way I see it, it doesn't render the ship skins to be reflective, like mine does. Hence they seem to be darker than tehy actually are. The same applies to that Brutix' engines. Mine are brighter on Tranquility and I didn't see any difference in brightness comparing my current ship's SiSi engine effects to the ones up on the main server.

Is that your normal gaming PC, BTW? Because if not, I'd ask you to compare the graphics playing on another computer.

Also, did you play around with brightness and gamma settings to fix this for you?
Daedalus Arcova
The Scope
#5 - 2011-11-05 12:07:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Daedalus Arcova
Do you mean that ships are no longer illuminated by the star when they're on the dark-side of a planet? Does the same apply for stations and stargates and such?

If so, this is doubleplusgood.
Shanlara
Weatherlight Industry
#6 - 2011-11-05 15:50:53 UTC
To be honest this is space, and being in space doesn't mean you have a spotlight on you constantly, space is dark and cold, so I don't see anything wrong.
Raven Ether
Doomheim
#7 - 2011-11-05 16:36:42 UTC
Shanlara wrote:
To be honest this is space, and being in space doesn't mean you have a spotlight on you constantly, space is dark and cold, so I don't see anything wrong.



To also be honest, this is a video game and artistical aesthetics should have priority over realism.


Some ships end up looking pitch black, please address that CCP, I'd like to at least see my "avatar" while playing, that's something expected by default..
Hungry Eyes
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#8 - 2011-11-05 16:47:50 UTC
Shanlara wrote:
To be honest this is space, and being in space doesn't mean you have a spotlight on you constantly, space is dark and cold, so I don't see anything wrong.


i actually agree with this. there shouldnt be a spotlight on your ship all the time. breaks immersion.
Courdorecqe en Faan
Doomheim
#9 - 2011-11-05 17:02:38 UTC
Shanlara wrote:
To be honest this is space, and being in space doesn't mean you have a spotlight on you constantly, space is dark and cold, so I don't see anything wrong.


This! If that's intentional then for the love of god keep it that way!

We who follow the Way aim to live a life of moderation, not succumbing to the extremes of self-indulgence or self-denial. Ida is a way of living, we do not have any beliefs in heaven or hell, and do not take any writings or sayings as "truth". Ida is a path, but Intaki are expected to walk it themselves.
CCP Gangleri
C C P
C C P Alliance
#10 - 2011-11-05 17:09:07 UTC
See last paragraph of the devblog on nebula update:

CCP t0rfifrans wrote:

Your ship is affected

With the background nebulae becoming quite different to what they are now, with some of them darker and sparser, your visual experience will change. Most ships in EVE reflect the nebula of the area of space they are in. That reflection is often perceived as part of the ship and its color. Since the nebulae are different, the reflections will be different, meaning the ships will look different in different areas of New Eden. We are aware of this, and this is a matter of both excitement and concern within the EVE team. We will of course do our best to make sure your ship still looks beautiful, nice and badass, but since this is such a radical change, we will be releasing the new nebulae to our test server Singularity, so that you can fly your ship in your home system and tell us what you think on our fine forii. Praise the new celestial wonders or emo rage about these stellar abominations. We will incorporate that feedback into our final polish and tweaks to the nebulae and lighting. Tell us what you think.

Check out my EVE Gate broadcast log for semi-regular updates on various EVE development: https://gate.eveonline.com/Profile/CCP%20Gangleri/StatusUpdates
Bentakhar
ANKOU INITIATIVE
#11 - 2011-11-05 18:52:35 UTC
The new nebulae are absolutely magnificent. As skeptical as i was, i have to admit , they do tell a lot about you're position and give a lot of charm to traveling long distances! Brilliant work CCP!

Also I have nothing against ships getting really dark in the darker parts of space it DOES improve immersion a lot.

Something that is a bit worrying is that the nebulae reflections sometimes seem not to appear on certain ships or just very slightly (i tried with gallente TI and TII ships)
Also they sometimes influence the ships strangely: take the shiny grey ishtar, it will turn almost blue when a red minmatar nebula is around.
ITs not as obvious as, for example, the way a shiny gold amarr ship fires up red under a minmatar nebula or almsot silver under bluish skyes.
Phantom Slave
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2011-11-05 19:16:54 UTC
Shanlara wrote:
To be honest this is space, and being in space doesn't mean you have a spotlight on you constantly, space is dark and cold, so I don't see anything wrong.


I also bet that in that very dark system, a fleet fight would look absolutely amazing.

Mmm, I love the smell of pod goo in the morning.
Dalloway Jones
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2011-11-05 19:21:27 UTC
Well the last sentence in that devblog post is "tell us what you think" and what I think is that it sucks. If the nebula are too far away to reflect on our ships and we are facing away from the systems sun we basically can't see our ships? What is the point of having all this great ship artwork if the ship is only visible in some high sec systems or in the station docking bay.

Our ships supposedly have camera drones ("lore" to explain how we can see all around our ship and change the angle of our view) Camera Drones

I think some of those camera drones should come with better lighting.
C DeLeon
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2011-11-05 20:31:03 UTC  |  Edited by: C DeLeon
Personally I like how the ships are dark in darker systems. It's more realistic (no diffused light) and with the windows, flashlights and engine effects it looks really badass and threatening.
Knoppaz
distress signals
#15 - 2011-11-06 00:29:56 UTC
Dalloway Jones wrote:
Well the last sentence in that devblog post is "tell us what you think" and what I think is that it sucks. If the nebula are too far away to reflect on our ships and we are facing away from the systems sun we basically can't see our ships? What is the point of having all this great ship artwork if the ship is only visible in some high sec systems or in the station docking bay.

Our ships supposedly have camera drones ("lore" to explain how we can see all around our ship and change the angle of our view) Camera Drones

I think some of those camera drones should come with better lighting.



The ship and all it's details should be fully visible, no matter if highsec, lowsec or nullsec, but only on the side facing the systems sun. Looking at the other side of the ship it should appear pitch black since no light from the sun is reaching those parts..

Knoppaz / distressSIGNALS http://distresssignals.tumblr.com

a capsuleer's way to insanity
non judgement
Without Fear
Flying Burning Ships Alliance
#16 - 2011-11-06 01:29:31 UTC
You should visit Jan in a caldari ship and visit the stations there. So damn bright !!
Dalloway Jones
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2011-11-06 02:28:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Dalloway Jones
Took some screen caps of Amarr and Caldari ships coming out of station in a Gallente system that is actually reasonably bright but not in the center of the nebula. The sun is to the left of the shot and I tried to take the pictures at more or less the same angle. Might not have been perfect on that but only because the Caldari ships were so freaking hard to see.

It is mostly cruisers and a few battle cruisers. This character can't fly Gallente above frigates and industrials but I may bring my Gallente pilot to this system later to try a few of those for comparison.

Augoror
Ferox
Osprey
good luck trying to find this one
Moa
Caracal
Abaddon
I don't even know what this is!
Drake
Iteron Mark III
Sunny side of a Blackbird
Maller

As you can see the Caldari fleet is a graphite gray now instead of a pale gray. It looks pretty cool but the ships all but disappear in shadows.

The old models of the Amarr fleet are much more visible and IMO much cooler looking as a result. Even the new Maller model which is pretty much what the new reskin for the Amarr fleet is going to look like is darker but at least it is still visible in this light (in darker systems the Maller pretty much disappears as well).

It is all well and good to say that ships in shadows should be darker but I would at least like to see what I am flying around in. Darker is one thing. Pitch black is a whole different story.
C DeLeon
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#18 - 2011-11-06 03:59:15 UTC
Dalloway Jones wrote:
Took some screen caps of Amarr and Caldari ships coming out of station in a Gallente system that is actually reasonably bright but not in the center of the nebula. The sun is to the left of the shot and I tried to take the pictures at more or less the same angle. Might not have been perfect on that but only because the Caldari ships were so freaking hard to see.

It is mostly cruisers and a few battle cruisers. This character can't fly Gallente above frigates and industrials but I may bring my Gallente pilot to this system later to try a few of those for comparison.

Augoror
Ferox
Osprey
good luck trying to find this one
Moa
Caracal
Abaddon
I don't even know what this is!
Drake
Iteron Mark III
Sunny side of a Blackbird
Maller

As you can see the Caldari fleet is a graphite gray now instead of a pale gray. It looks pretty cool but the ships all but disappear in shadows.

The old models of the Amarr fleet are much more visible and IMO much cooler looking as a result. Even the new Maller model which is pretty much what the new reskin for the Amarr fleet is going to look like is darker but at least it is still visible in this light (in darker systems the Maller pretty much disappears as well).

It is all well and good to say that ships in shadows should be darker but I would at least like to see what I am flying around in. Darker is one thing. Pitch black is a whole different story.


I don't know maybe you are playing with too low graphic settings, and the ships aren't detailed enough.
For me the lights on the ships makes them really cool in the dark and a pitch black side just makes it even better.
non judgement
Without Fear
Flying Burning Ships Alliance
#19 - 2011-11-06 04:27:05 UTC  |  Edited by: non judgement
That's only when you're in a dark system. When you find a bright system they're very easy to see. You just have to find the right places.

I think they just have to adjust the contrast. The bright systems are a bit too bright and the dark ones are just a bit too dark.
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
#20 - 2011-11-06 04:37:44 UTC
non judgement wrote:
That's only when you're in a dark system. When you find a bright system they're very easy to see. You just have to find the right places.

I think they just have to adjust the contrast. The bright systems are a bit too bright and the dark ones are just a bit too dark.


The flip side is that very few players have ever bothered to tune their display settings to have a correct gamma / brightness / contrast response. (And older LCD screens with CFLs are much darker then modern LED-backed screens and much harder to adjust correctly. CFLs get weaker with age and a 2-3 year old LCD screen does not have the dynamic range of a newer one.)

http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/gamma_calibration.php

Before criticizing how dark things are - please make sure that your monitor is at least somewhat calibrated.
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