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RLML price collapse
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Abla Tive
#1 - 2013-11-30 03:17:25 UTC
I note that the market for meta Rapid Light Missile Launchers has collapsed.

I assume that this is because of the Rubicon changes.

Does anyone think that people will find new uses for them, or is the price depressed until at least the next major update?
Havoc Zealot
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2013-11-30 07:15:36 UTC
They are terrible...that's why.
Aliventi
Rattini Tribe
Minmatar Fleet Alliance
#3 - 2013-11-30 07:20:32 UTC
RLMLs used to be easy to use. Now you actually have to think about how to use them. Unfortunately the average scrub doesn't understand or doesn't have the skill to use them properly. When scrubs can't use something without rubbing 2 brain cells together it doesn't get bought.
Jori McKie
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2013-11-30 10:25:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Jori McKie
Aliventi wrote:
RLMLs used to be easy to use. Now you actually have to think about how to use them. Unfortunately the average scrub doesn't understand or doesn't have the skill to use them properly. When scrubs can't use something without rubbing 2 brain cells together it doesn't get bought.


Utterly wrong, there are only a very few very special situations you want the new RLML on a Caracal, Sycthe Issue, Cerb etc. and fight with it (kill 2-3x T1 Frigs or 2x Assault Frigs and run). Just compare the new RLML Caracal to a Railgun (200mm = more tank or 250mm = more Range, DPS) Thorax, the Thorax is better in any circumstance.

RLML for solo is 99% dead
RLML for smallscale (<10) is 99% dead
RLML for PvE is 100% dead

RLML might work with +50peeps depending on how much cheap Alpha you want to gank some ships, it might even work with 250 peeps as a cheap gank/suicide fleet but other than that the RLML is dead dead dead.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." - Abrazzar
Silvetica Dian
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2013-11-30 13:42:16 UTC
Jori McKie wrote:
Aliventi wrote:
RLMLs used to be easy to use. Now you actually have to think about how to use them. Unfortunately the average scrub doesn't understand or doesn't have the skill to use them properly. When scrubs can't use something without rubbing 2 brain cells together it doesn't get bought.


Utterly wrong, there are only a very few very special situations you want the new RLML on a Caracal, Sycthe Issue, Cerb etc. and fight with it (kill 2-3x T1 Frigs or 2x Assault Frigs and run). Just compare the new RLML Caracal to a Railgun (200mm = more tank or 250mm = more Range, DPS) Thorax, the Thorax is better in any circumstance.

RLML for solo is 99% dead
RLML for smallscale (<10) is 99% dead
RLML for PvE is 100% dead

RLML might work with +50peeps depending on how much cheap Alpha you want to gank some ships, it might even work with 250 peeps as a cheap gank/suicide fleet but other than that the RLML is dead dead dead.


You present this as fact when it is not.
RLML for solo is likely dead as there is not enough damage before reload to kill a wide enough array of targets.
For large fleets you will lose too much of the frontloaded damage to missiles in flight to make this worthwhile.
For small gangs the large increase in well applied dps (before reload) is a good plan for tipping the fight in your favour at the start and this missile system is one of the few counters to the plague to inties and EAF's roaming New Eden.
For small gangs this module has been buffed hugely but mostly people fail to understand this.
I know 95% of the small brawls i have been involved in have been at least functionally over long before i needed to reload. The period before 1st reload these modules have a huge dps increase over the old functionality. to the level where u get cruiser DPS using a frig sized weapon and a BC sized tank. it is borderline OP.
I have already seen a rise in caracal gangs operating in null.

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Jori McKie
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2013-11-30 15:37:36 UTC
Uhmm, no idea what sort of smallscale fights you have but it sounds a lot like gank one ship with 10 in this case you don't need to reload for sure. In any "usual" smallscale fight something like 8vs15 i had more than once to reload the old Caracal.
Anyway as i said RLMLs are cheap Alpha to gank some sort of ships and time will tell who is correct about the usage. My prediction is RLMLs are dead and i would use any comparative of dead if there is one.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." - Abrazzar
Grandma Squirel
#7 - 2013-11-30 16:29:34 UTC
You can definitely theorycraft up scenarios where the front loaded RLML damage wins a fight for you. The problem is that if the matchup you actually get doesn't fit into one of the specific scenarios where RLML wins it for you, your much worse off for having brought RLML. As most gangs don't know what they are facing when they choose a weapons loadout, RLML are more likely to get your gang killed then save it. We may see them shine in tourney play, but that wont prop up the market for meta modules.
Abla Tive
#8 - 2013-12-01 02:34:07 UTC
I agree with Grandma.

RLML usefulness is too narrow to sustain worthwhile margins in the meta market.

Speculators could keep prices up in the hopes of an de-nerf but I don't see it as probable.
Rainbow Dash
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2013-12-01 03:49:47 UTC
If the stars align, the new RLML can win you a fight.

Which basically mean's it's super situational to the point of absolute trash 99% of the time.
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#10 - 2013-12-03 00:13:11 UTC
Grandma Squirel wrote:
You can definitely theorycraft up scenarios where the front loaded RLML damage wins a fight for you. The problem is that if the matchup you actually get doesn't fit into one of the specific scenarios where RLML wins it for you, your much worse off for having brought RLML. As most gangs don't know what they are facing when they choose a weapons loadout, RLML are more likely to get your gang killed then save it. We may see them shine in tourney play, but that wont prop up the market for meta modules.


I think this is accurate.

In this way, it's like a passive single armor resist plating. If I knew in advance that I'd be against a Bhaalgorn, I'd fit a ship with a deadspace EM plating and a deadspace Thermal plating, and it would massively outperform a dual EANM2 setup or any active resist module tank.

But if I do that and go up against a Vindicator or even a Myrmidron, they'll be laughing at my lossmail for weeks.

RLMLs are now similar. 10% of the time they are awesome, 90% of the time they are mediocre or bad.

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Mike Adoulin
Happys Happy Hamster Hunting Club
#11 - 2013-12-05 08:52:49 UTC
I find them very good in ambushing frigs (using the now-infamous RLML Caracal), but tbh, other ships can do the same job.

However.

They can be very, very useful in small, sharp hit-and-run engagements, specifically in the case of low-SP pilots that have missile-specced.

And hey, they are very cheap..:)

Personally I think they need to tweaked just a little bit more, but we'll see.


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