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Mobile Depot - Game Breaking Feature

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James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#401 - 2013-11-28 07:49:59 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Yeah, clearly without timers smaller alliances will be able to defend their space m-
I can't. I just can't. This level of bullshit is just too much.

LMAO, like you Goons care about 'the small guy'. So many bleeding hearts come out to play when your timer monopoly is criticized.

We care about game balance and the fact that winning isn't very fun when it's too easy.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#402 - 2013-11-28 07:55:48 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
You know, I think I realize what your obsession with timers and structures is.

It's mostly tied in with your first attempts to hunt ratters in your shield tanked Proteus, trying to kill the "nullbears". Well, you didn't make any difference. No one cared.

So you tried to take out a poco or something. You even posted in C&P looking for mercs to do it. That also, you failed.

And then you started your little crusade about timers. But it's tied into your failure to make any kind of difference out in nullsec by yourself. And that's just it.

You think you get to hurt "them." You think you're entitled to actually inflict some harm that they will feel by yourself. And that's what drives all your little rants and all your nonsense on the forums.

Basically, you are a less illiterate Harry Forever.

Stop over anal lysing it. I just want to shoot **** and see it blow up. Nothing more.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#403 - 2013-11-28 08:00:12 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Yeah, clearly without timers smaller alliances will be able to defend their space m-
I can't. I just can't. This level of bullshit is just too much.

LMAO, like you Goons care about 'the small guy'. So many bleeding hearts come out to play when your timer monopoly is criticized.

We care about game balance and the fact that winning isn't very fun when it's too easy.

Lies are not good for you. Stop before you get hairy palms.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
lollerwaffle
Perkone
Caldari State
#404 - 2013-11-28 08:12:15 UTC
E-2C Hawkeye wrote:
Katran Luftschreck wrote:
Ah, I see how it works. Carebares complain about PvPers ruining their game and the whole forum goes into turbojerk mode and pounces on them, but when a PvPer complains that they got outwitted by a carebare then everyone sends them flowers of condolence?

Lol this is very true. When a ganker exploits game mechanics and kills a carebear its working as intended. When a CareBear uses a game feature to avoid being killed they have broken EvE.

Can you read? Or does the thread pretty much look like gibberish to you?

Nerf Burger wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Just noticed that op is complaining about tackling a Raven who then put down a mobile depot, refitted off it, and escaped.

How bad can you get? Seriously, just destroy the mobile depot. You have a full minute to chew through 17.5k EHP - about as much as a Harbinger with no tank mods or skills.


this is just another example of how ******** most EVE "PVPers" really are. They are too used to fighting against targets that have no recourse and have come to expect the easy-mode kills that EVE formerly provided.

And of course, we musn't forget the example of someone who has no reading comprehension skills. Do you feel better when you brainfart all over the forums?
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#405 - 2013-11-28 08:18:57 UTC  |  Edited by: RubyPorto
Infinity Ziona wrote:
So the Germans didn't bypass the Maginot line and defeat an entrenched and superior force


1. Blitzkrieg tactics are neither Guerrilla in nature nor "Hit and Run."
2. They never assaulted the Maginot line from the front. They took Neutral, undefended Belgium and went around it.
3. In no way were the French a "Superior Force" to the Germans in 1940.

Quote:
Hannibal never used a small army to destroy a numerically superior army


1. Hannibal's armies were not small. They were actually the numerically superior force at Trasimene.
2. All three of his major Italian victories were in pitched battles.
3. Hannibal's armies were veterans. The Roman armies that opposed him were poorly led* conscripts (the veteran legions having been sent to Spain to fight Hannibal... whoops).

Oh... and Hannibal lost the war.

*Some of the Roman rules on what happens when both Consuls are in one place with an army are hilarious.

Quote:
You are entirely and totally wrong, throughout history this has occurred over and over again, using stealth, intelligence, the achilles heel (wonder where that term came from?), the cover of darkness, doing things which others thought were impossible and didn't defend against...

None of this is possible in EVE because of the lame timer system that discourages anything but blob warfare


If you're going to make claims based on it, spend some time to actually learn history. Not just the Cliff Notes version.


And if you want to take or destroy someone's city or fortress, expect to have to actually fight their army. If you don't want to fight their army, either draw it off or find a less defensible target.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#406 - 2013-11-28 08:26:28 UTC
RubyPorto wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
So the Germans didn't bypass the Maginot line and defeat an entrenched and superior force


1. Blitzkrieg tactics are neither Guerrilla in nature nor "Hit and Run."
2. They never assaulted the Maginot line from the front. They took Neutral, undefended Belgium and went around it.
3. In no way were the French a "Superior Force" to the Germans in 1940.

Quote:
Hannibal never used a small army to destroy a numerically superior army


1. Hannibal's armies were not small. They were actually the numerically superior force at Trasimene.
2. All three of his major Italian victories were in pitched battles.
3. Hannibal's armies were veterans. The Roman armies that opposed him were poorly led* conscripts (the veteran legions having been sent to Spain to fight Hannibal... whoops).

Oh... and Hannibal lost the war.

*Some of the Roman rules on what happens when both Consuls are in one place with an army are hilarious.

Quote:
You are entirely and totally wrong, throughout history this has occurred over and over again, using stealth, intelligence, the achilles heel (wonder where that term came from?), the cover of darkness, doing things which others thought were impossible and didn't defend against...

None of this is possible in EVE because of the lame timer system that discourages anything but blob warfare


If you're going to make claims based on it, spend some time to actually learn history. Not just the Cliff Notes version.


And if you want to take or destroy someone's city or fortress, expect to have to actually fight their army. If you don't want to fight their army, either draw it off or find a less defensible target.

I'm certainly not wrong. You seem to have skimmed some bad history there :)

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#407 - 2013-11-28 08:28:15 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Yeah, clearly without timers smaller alliances will be able to defend their space m-
I can't. I just can't. This level of bullshit is just too much.

LMAO, like you Goons care about 'the small guy'. So many bleeding hearts come out to play when your timer monopoly is criticized.

We care about game balance and the fact that winning isn't very fun when it's too easy.

Lies are not good for you. Stop before you get hairy palms.

My palms have a tendency to get awfully sweaty, but that would be a really bizarre place to grow hair.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#408 - 2013-11-28 08:30:02 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
RubyPorto wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
So the Germans didn't bypass the Maginot line and defeat an entrenched and superior force


1. Blitzkrieg tactics are neither Guerrilla in nature nor "Hit and Run."
2. They never assaulted the Maginot line from the front. They took Neutral, undefended Belgium and went around it.
3. In no way were the French a "Superior Force" to the Germans in 1940.

Quote:
Hannibal never used a small army to destroy a numerically superior army


1. Hannibal's armies were not small. They were actually the numerically superior force at Trasimene.
2. All three of his major Italian victories were in pitched battles.
3. Hannibal's armies were veterans. The Roman armies that opposed him were poorly led* conscripts (the veteran legions having been sent to Spain to fight Hannibal... whoops).

Oh... and Hannibal lost the war.

*Some of the Roman rules on what happens when both Consuls are in one place with an army are hilarious.

Quote:
You are entirely and totally wrong, throughout history this has occurred over and over again, using stealth, intelligence, the achilles heel (wonder where that term came from?), the cover of darkness, doing things which others thought were impossible and didn't defend against...

None of this is possible in EVE because of the lame timer system that discourages anything but blob warfare


If you're going to make claims based on it, spend some time to actually learn history. Not just the Cliff Notes version.


And if you want to take or destroy someone's city or fortress, expect to have to actually fight their army. If you don't want to fight their army, either draw it off or find a less defensible target.

I'm certainly not wrong. You seem to have skimmed some bad history there :)


Well, if that's true, you certainly will be able to actually refute all of his (factually correct) statements in detail, right?

I mean, you certainly aren't the kind of person to not back up what you say.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#409 - 2013-11-28 08:36:29 UTC  |  Edited by: RubyPorto
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
I'm certainly not wrong. You seem to have skimmed some bad history there :)


Well, if that's true, you certainly will be able to actually refute all of his (factually correct) statements in detail, right?

I mean, you certainly aren't the kind of person to not back up what you say.


I'm always interested in learning, so I'm sure he'll provide sources along with his detailed refutation.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#410 - 2013-11-28 08:55:18 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:

Implementing a completely shite system like timers is worse than the ping pong. It creates stagnation without any way for players to work around timers. With the ping pong you could at least have recruited a balanced global playerbase instead of just US or just Euro or just Russian. That was the reason for ping pong, poor recruiting, they deserved it for not being more organized.


The point to an MMO is to play together. If you recruit a corp of 100 people with 24 hour coverage, you have an expectation of 5 people online at any one time. It is entirely unnatural, and entirely undesirable for CCP to develop gameplay to pander to that.
Serdar Tyrnx
#411 - 2013-11-28 08:59:59 UTC
All of this is related to a pirate crying about depo's.... how?
Aralieus
Shadowbane Syndicate
#412 - 2013-11-28 09:03:06 UTC
Why didn't you just bump him? Problem solved.

Oderint Dum Metuant
Frozen Chief
Doomheim
#413 - 2013-11-28 09:11:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Frozen Chief
Oh man, all the tough guys on page 1 ganging up like that. So many childish personalities on this forum, quite sad really.

The OP has a fair point if you guys would pull the head out of the butt. Amarr BS have 7-8 low slots; when I escape you, your buddy, or your two buddies every single time, you'll understand why "L2P" or "get some friends" is code for "I can't think critically about any criticism so I'll say the dumbest thing that comes to my mind".

We're not even discussing ECM now. Like as if ECM wasn't already overpowered; good luck dealing with my 5 x Falcon multibox fleet when I can refit my ECM modules to exactly what I see on grid.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#414 - 2013-11-28 09:15:07 UTC
Frozen Chief wrote:
Oh man, all the tough guys on page 1 ganging up like that. So many childish personalities on this forum, quite sad really.

The OP has a fair point if you guys would pull the head out of the butt. Amarr BS have 7-8 low slots; when I escape you, your buddy, or your two buddies every single time, you'll understand why "L2P" or "get some friends" is code for "I can't think critically about any criticism so I'll say the dumbest thing that comes to my mind".

We're not even discussing ECM now. Like as if ECM wasn't already overpowered; good luck dealing with my 5 x Falcon multibox fleet when I can refit my ECM modules to exactly what I see on grid.


You're kidding about the Falcon thing, right?

Have you actually used the mobile depot? It takes 60 seconds to deploy. If you uncloak your Falcons, drop those things, and still have 60 seconds to refit... yeah.

What a ludicrous statement.

Secondly, the guy literally above you suggested bumping. Doesn't matter at all how many warp stabs you have if you are not aligned. And considering you seem to have taken the 60 seconds required to drop a depot and refit when you saw a local spike...

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#415 - 2013-11-28 09:23:15 UTC
Frozen Chief wrote:
Oh man, all the tough guys on page 1 ganging up like that. So many childish personalities on this forum, quite sad really.

The OP has a fair point if you guys would pull the head out of the butt. Amarr BS have 7-8 low slots; when I escape you, your buddy, or your two buddies every single time, you'll understand why "L2P" or "get some friends" is code for "I can't think critically about any criticism so I'll say the dumbest thing that comes to my mind".

We're not even discussing ECM now. Like as if ECM wasn't already overpowered; good luck dealing with my 5 x Falcon multibox fleet when I can refit my ECM modules to exactly what I see on grid.


How the hell would a battleship successfully align with a pair of 800 dps vexors bumping it, and the pilot busily removing the EHP, module by module.
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#416 - 2013-11-28 09:25:43 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Frozen Chief wrote:
Oh man, all the tough guys on page 1 ganging up like that. So many childish personalities on this forum, quite sad really.

The OP has a fair point if you guys would pull the head out of the butt. Amarr BS have 7-8 low slots; when I escape you, your buddy, or your two buddies every single time, you'll understand why "L2P" or "get some friends" is code for "I can't think critically about any criticism so I'll say the dumbest thing that comes to my mind".

We're not even discussing ECM now. Like as if ECM wasn't already overpowered; good luck dealing with my 5 x Falcon multibox fleet when I can refit my ECM modules to exactly what I see on grid.


You're kidding about the Falcon thing, right?

Have you actually used the mobile depot? It takes 60 seconds to deploy. If you uncloak your Falcons, drop those things, and still have 60 seconds to refit... yeah.

What a ludicrous statement.

Secondly, the guy literally above you suggested bumping. Doesn't matter at all how many warp stabs you have if you are not aligned. And considering you seem to have taken the 60 seconds required to drop a depot and refit when you saw a local spike...


I would drop the depot at 50km from the anom, and sit there with my depot and my sentries. ie I'd expect this battle depot to be fully operational when your friends arrive, muahahahahaha. power of the darkside and all that. I just do not think I'd be able to align against competent pilots if I let them force me to stab up.
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#417 - 2013-11-28 09:50:24 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Yeah, clearly without timers smaller alliances will be able to defend their space m-
I can't. I just can't. This level of bullshit is just too much.

LMAO, like you Goons care about 'the small guy'. So many bleeding hearts come out to play when your timer monopoly is criticized.

We care about game balance and the fact that winning isn't very fun when it's too easy.


So uhm, why are you hiding behind a wall of 35000 blues then?
The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#418 - 2013-11-28 09:59:36 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Frozen Chief wrote:
Oh man, all the tough guys on page 1 ganging up like that. So many childish personalities on this forum, quite sad really.

The OP has a fair point if you guys would pull the head out of the butt. Amarr BS have 7-8 low slots; when I escape you, your buddy, or your two buddies every single time, you'll understand why "L2P" or "get some friends" is code for "I can't think critically about any criticism so I'll say the dumbest thing that comes to my mind".

We're not even discussing ECM now. Like as if ECM wasn't already overpowered; good luck dealing with my 5 x Falcon multibox fleet when I can refit my ECM modules to exactly what I see on grid.


You're kidding about the Falcon thing, right?

Have you actually used the mobile depot? It takes 60 seconds to deploy. If you uncloak your Falcons, drop those things, and still have 60 seconds to refit... yeah.

What a ludicrous statement.

Secondly, the guy literally above you suggested bumping. Doesn't matter at all how many warp stabs you have if you are not aligned. And considering you seem to have taken the 60 seconds required to drop a depot and refit when you saw a local spike...


The general claim is a depot drop becomes standard upon landing on site as a precaution. The 60 second deploy is to a big extent a strawman in this scenario.

Everyone dropping the depot on the other hand... Remains to be seen. Everyone had escape tools available before Rubicon (heavy neut/ecm drones/bubbling gates) and only few used them. The depot has a very big advantage in the immobility; it competes mostly with ratting aligned as a precaution. Ratting aligned is rather inefficient on pretty much all setups, so the depot should become very popular.

The common ground is that interceptors are horror without depot escape, making nullsec ratting scary. "Ratters, have friends" could apply, but for the effort the isk should be better then IMHO. Overallthings change and there is whining.
The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#419 - 2013-11-28 10:02:53 UTC  |  Edited by: The Spod
In fact for me the optimal solution to this excisting tilt in mechanics balance is to:

"Ratters, have friends."
Depot deploy time increased to x minutes.
This IMHO requires better rewards than 120-150M isk/hour to be worth all the effort.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#420 - 2013-11-28 10:04:06 UTC
The Spod wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Frozen Chief wrote:
Oh man, all the tough guys on page 1 ganging up like that. So many childish personalities on this forum, quite sad really.

The OP has a fair point if you guys would pull the head out of the butt. Amarr BS have 7-8 low slots; when I escape you, your buddy, or your two buddies every single time, you'll understand why "L2P" or "get some friends" is code for "I can't think critically about any criticism so I'll say the dumbest thing that comes to my mind".

We're not even discussing ECM now. Like as if ECM wasn't already overpowered; good luck dealing with my 5 x Falcon multibox fleet when I can refit my ECM modules to exactly what I see on grid.


You're kidding about the Falcon thing, right?

Have you actually used the mobile depot? It takes 60 seconds to deploy. If you uncloak your Falcons, drop those things, and still have 60 seconds to refit... yeah.

What a ludicrous statement.

Secondly, the guy literally above you suggested bumping. Doesn't matter at all how many warp stabs you have if you are not aligned. And considering you seem to have taken the 60 seconds required to drop a depot and refit when you saw a local spike...


The general claim is a depot drop becomes standard upon landing on site as a precaution. The 60 second deploy is to a big extent a strawman in this scenario.

Everyone dropping the depot on the other hand... Remains to be seen. Everyone had escape tools available before Rubicon (heavy neut/ecm drones/bubbling gates) and only few used them. The depot has a very big advantage in the immobility; it competes mostly with ratting aligned as a precaution. Ratting aligned is rather inefficient on pretty much all setups, so the depot should become very popular.

The common ground is that interceptors are horror without depot escape, making nullsec ratting scary. "Ratters, have friends" could apply, but for the effort the isk should be better then IMHO. Overallthings change and there is whining.


But that's my point. The people who couldn't be asked to use the tools they already had aren't going to use a new one. You can't say that everybody will drop a depot because it's the smart thing to do, when it's already the smart thing to do to watch D-scan and local, and people don't do do that.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.