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Sentries, Prop Mods and MJDs.
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#21 - 2013-11-27 21:47:20 UTC
Batelle wrote:
battleships that use sentries dont move in PVE.

You can orbit your sentries, which is better for damage mitigation than sitting still.

The AB is only used for moving between gates, typically after scooping the sentries and deploying light drones to clean-up the frigates and destroyers.
Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#22 - 2013-11-27 22:12:52 UTC
Batelle wrote:
Jeanne-Luise Argenau wrote:

the thing is he should use deadspace plates then, because all active resistence modules eat to much cap in my experience


Deadspace plates don't save any CPU. The higher resistance is always worth the extra capacitor, because you need to rep less. Even deadspace plates have lower resistance than t2/faction hardeners, meaning that even in the niche situations where your sustained tank is better, your burst tank will always be worse, and your overall lower resistances will result in lower EHP. Hardeners are virtually always the superior choice, and it takes some hardcore EFT-fu to find the use cases where faction/deadspace energized plates are better.


i meant as example to use an a-type "resist" plating with compensation at 5 its not as good as a hardener but cheap and close enough to not matter.
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#23 - 2013-11-27 22:47:28 UTC
Jeanne-Luise Argenau wrote:
i meant as example to use an a-type "resist" plating with compensation at 5 its not as good as a hardener but cheap and close enough to not matter.


There is no good reason to spend low's on resist plating, even energized plating is questionable in viability. For the Dominix you want 3 active hardeners, and depending on skill and experience maybe a damage control. If you have fitting problems it's always better to downsize you guns, use meta guns or fit one less gun.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.
Bibosikus
Air
#24 - 2013-11-27 23:55:17 UTC
Batelle wrote:
Jeanne-Luise Argenau wrote:

the thing is he should use deadspace plates then, because all active resistence modules eat to much cap in my experience


Deadspace plates don't save any CPU. The higher resistance is always worth the extra capacitor, because you need to rep less. Even deadspace plates have lower resistance than t2/faction hardeners, meaning that even in the niche situations where your sustained tank is better, your burst tank will always be worse, and your overall lower resistances will result in lower EHP. Hardeners are virtually always the superior choice, and it takes some hardcore EFT-fu to find the use cases where faction/deadspace energized plates are better.



Energized A-Type membranes (55.62%) have better resists that T2 hardeners (55%) if you have the relevant comp skill at 5. They use zero cap and less CPU (4). The only disadvantage is that you can't overload them, which is not something you'd normally do anyway in PvE. The A-Types aren't cheap (40-140m depending on damage type), but they're widely used as "Fit & Forget" passive mods especially on T3 fits eg. Legion for Sleeper farming. Just saying :)

Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.
Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#25 - 2013-11-28 16:37:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Jeanne-Luise Argenau
dexington wrote:
Jeanne-Luise Argenau wrote:
i meant as example to use an a-type "resist" plating with compensation at 5 its not as good as a hardener but cheap and close enough to not matter.


There is no good reason to spend low's on resist plating, even energized plating is questionable in viability. For the Dominix you want 3 active hardeners, and depending on skill and experience maybe a damage control. If you have fitting problems it's always better to downsize you guns, use meta guns or fit one less gun.


boy o boy u r so wrong i did missions with a 3 slot armor tank 2 energized resistence membranes but it worked rly well and i didnt need ccc and only one heavy cap injector. never had any trouble but active hardeners can easily reduce your cap from acceptable 5 minutes down to 2 which is to low.

EDIT: it needs rly good skills so, i prefer to dps tank in mission when i do them
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#26 - 2013-11-28 23:03:46 UTC
Jeanne-Luise Argenau wrote:
boy o boy u r so wrong i did missions with a 3 slot armor tank 2 energized resistence membranes


I'm sure it was something like worlds collide.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.
Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#27 - 2013-11-29 11:55:59 UTC
dexington wrote:
Jeanne-Luise Argenau wrote:
boy o boy u r so wrong i did missions with a 3 slot armor tank 2 energized resistence membranes


I'm sure it was something like worlds collide.


yeap, or blockade, or scarlet pirate, pretty much every mission there is. but with mjd u need even lesser tank than my brawling i did because u kill them outside their hurting range
The Djego
Hellequin Inc.
#28 - 2013-11-30 03:23:09 UTC
@OP you normally use a mwd to move the hull into a good position and deploy sentry's there. At this point you bring the hull normally to full stop(mach or navy apoc still can move a bit to make 100% use of her turret dps) kill the spawn, scoop the sentry drones and move on.

Ab is to slow and the longer you move the longer you deal low to zero dps. MJD is also quite suboptimal since most of the time the spot where you want to be is 30-50km away form you, not 100km.

Improve discharge rigging: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=246166&find=unread
Master PewPew
Corporation 98735482
#29 - 2013-11-30 03:29:14 UTC
Mach is still the king of ratting.Cool
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#30 - 2013-11-30 14:28:06 UTC
The Djego wrote:
Ab is to slow and the longer you move the longer you deal low to zero dps. MJD is also quite suboptimal since most of the time the spot where you want to be is 30-50km away form you, not 100km.


I always use both mdj and mwd.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#31 - 2013-12-01 04:52:27 UTC
Bibosikus wrote:
Batelle wrote:
Hardeners are virtually always the superior choice



Energized A-Type membranes (55.62%) have better resists that T2 hardeners (55%) if you have the relevant comp skill at 5. They use zero cap and less CPU (4). The only disadvantage is that you can't overload them, which is not something you'd normally do anyway in PvE. The A-Types aren't cheap (40-140m depending on damage type), but they're widely used as "Fit & Forget" passive mods especially on T3 fits eg. Legion for Sleeper farming. Just saying :)



thank you for pointing out those exceptions. But again I originally suggested a faction hardener specifically because it would save assloads of CPU. And if you're spending 100m, you can just deadspace the active hardener. Plus what do you mean overloading isn't something you would normally do in PVE ?Twisted

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.
Mnemosyne Gloob
#32 - 2013-12-01 21:25:51 UTC
Bibosikus wrote:
The only disadvantage is that you can't overload them, which is not something you'd normally do anyway in PvE.


I often overheat in pve. it's available to me, so why not use it. an example would be overheating my hardener in 5/10 last room until the webs are down. or my prop mod to get somewhere faster. or my guns to kill that overseer faster. i don't understand why people think it's only good to overheat in pvp.
The Djego
Hellequin Inc.
#33 - 2013-12-02 04:01:57 UTC  |  Edited by: The Djego
Mnemosyne Gloob wrote:
Bibosikus wrote:
The only disadvantage is that you can't overload them, which is not something you'd normally do anyway in PvE.


I often overheat in pve. it's available to me, so why not use it. an example would be overheating my hardener in 5/10 last room until the webs are down. or my prop mod to get somewhere faster. or my guns to kill that overseer faster. i don't understand why people think it's only good to overheat in pvp.


Because it costs money.

Then again I nearly use webs at full range 100% of the time, having everything key bound for quick switches(having F1-F8 on the mouse and toggle with shift is awesome). If you look at plexes it is a very useful tool to squeeze out the extra speed, tank or dps you need sometimes.

dexington wrote:
The Djego wrote:
Ab is to slow and the longer you move the longer you deal low to zero dps. MJD is also quite suboptimal since most of the time the spot where you want to be is 30-50km away form you, not 100km.


I always use both mdj and mwd.


It is a waste of a med slot.

Improve discharge rigging: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=246166&find=unread
Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#34 - 2013-12-02 21:09:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Batelle wrote:
Bibosikus wrote:
Batelle wrote:
Hardeners are virtually always the superior choice



Energized A-Type membranes (55.62%) have better resists that T2 hardeners (55%) if you have the relevant comp skill at 5. They use zero cap and less CPU (4). The only disadvantage is that you can't overload them, which is not something you'd normally do anyway in PvE. The A-Types aren't cheap (40-140m depending on damage type), but they're widely used as "Fit & Forget" passive mods especially on T3 fits eg. Legion for Sleeper farming. Just saying :)



thank you for pointing out those exceptions. But again I originally suggested a faction hardener specifically because it would save assloads of CPU. And if you're spending 100m, you can just deadspace the active hardener. Plus what do you mean overloading isn't something you would normally do in PVE ?Twisted


u r correct in one way my standard setups for pve are cap injected, and the cap i save with passive mods is more important then those few % resist especially since they r also dependent of the size of the hole they r filling. But if i use a cap stable bs i would use hardeners, but cap stable ships normaly need alot of ccc or cap rechargers or capacitor reactor controls which might have negative effects on the active rep.
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