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EVE New Citizens Q&A

 
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community knowledge being made more accessible in game?

Author
Don Juan'nardo
Overneath
#1 - 2013-11-14 00:31:44 UTC
There are a ton of sites and lots of info in forums about specific npc stats, and it's all extremely helpful. But I find that for all the reading i've done, i still have a hard time as a rather new player in keeping it straight as to what ships from what factions have what resists/damage quantity/types. (that was very poorly written)

Are there currently any sort of options or mods that can tap community databases for displaying ship specific details on npc's in game? Like if i target a ship and then mouse over my target queue to get a summary of enemy damage potential/tank?

Would such a feature be game breaking? Or would it just be very convenient? :P

an example of such data base that i just learned of
Dato Koppla wrote:

Use Chruker NPC Ships (http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/npc_ships.php) database to answer these types of questions in future including things like Ewar (neut/scram/web/td etc), Orbit Range/Velocity, EHP, DPS and damage profile, and basically anything to do with NPC ships.


If such info could be accessed in game i feel that more dynamic and challenging content could be made for newer(low sp) players. And such content would also give a fun reason for pve oriented older players to play in smaller ships aside from farming 3-4/10 ded space.

Of course i could just be talking out of my ass here, but i do feel that as a new player i've spent more time reading about the game than actually playing it.
L'ouris
Have Naught Subsidiaries
#2 - 2013-11-14 00:43:01 UTC
Disclaimer: I'm still considered by many to be 'new' P

My understanding is that there is so much about the game that was never documented and the players took it upon themselves to write it down and be useable as they went.

There is soooooooo much about this game documented by players on websites and books ( I mean really, just look at all the stuff in the stickies!Shocked )

I think most players are content to let ccp devote resources to develop and feel that they can fill the niche of documentation.

There is a group that also look at mastering the game with little available documentation as a draw.

Given that most players wrote the documentation, it's almost all available 'in-game' via the browsers so they are content with the status quo.

NightCrawler 85
Phoibe Enterprises
#3 - 2013-11-14 01:12:17 UTC
L'ouris is completely correct that its simply to much information, and players who were willing and able came up with sites and systems to make it easier for everyone (new and old) to get the information they needed.

CCP has improved some of these things over the years, but i think that both them (and im sure many of the players) feels that it..adds something to the game when you can find all this information and useful programs (evemon as an example) because of players just like them self,

At least in my opinion it shows that anyone can add something to the game that makes it "better" without that person having to be someone special.
Donbe Scurred
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2013-11-14 01:16:31 UTC
The information you seek is acquired by talking to people.
This is a social game, be social!

As mentioned there is too much information and it is constantly changing, 3rd party resources are not updated on a consistent basis, so if CCP made these resources available in game they would be required to police the 3rd party sights or face the wrath of the player base, ain't nobody got time for that.
Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#5 - 2013-11-14 01:18:23 UTC
I would like to point out that the game does have a web browser built into it so that you can always get to the wikis and etc fairly easily.

That said, you can look in my bio for a reference page that has little tables on nearly everything you'd ever need to know. And if you want you can print the PDF version that was built to fit on two pages (one front and back).

If you wanna find me easily in-game add me as a contact here and then check in people and places and then show info on me.

Then, once you have the reference page link you can bookmark it to use in-game whenever you want without needing my bio.

Note that the "E" menu (hotkey [ \ ]) has a menu in it that lets you jump right into your browser bookmarks :P

The Drake is a Lie

Don Juan'nardo
Overneath
#6 - 2013-11-14 04:43:58 UTC
i see where you all are coming from and especially understand that it'd best that CCP remain focused on content and developement. I didn't recognize the fact that all the documentation on the game was player driven.

However, so as not to leave a dead horse unbeaten, I will take my question a step further Twisted


The api system used for character information was a wondrous and amazing thing when i first saw how it worked. Which means i must have been living under a rock till i started playing eve as i now see that api's are used all over the place, and i still don't fully know what they can and can't be used for. That aside, I must ask if it would be an extensive amount of work to set a template for player documentation and ask that if anyone wishes to have public data be displayed via tooltip in game, that they match this template and provide a general access api?
Thereby allowing players to seek and acquire the information they want shown from the web, as well as placing full responsibility for the maintenance and accuracy of that information with the independent parties.

...I may yet again, be talking out of my ass on this one :P

NightCrawler 85
Phoibe Enterprises
#7 - 2013-11-14 04:54:09 UTC
Don Juan'nardo wrote:
i see where you all are coming from and especially understand that it'd best that CCP remain focused on content and developement. I didn't recognize the fact that all the documentation on the game was player driven.

However, so as not to leave a dead horse unbeaten, I will take my question a step further Twisted


The api system used for character information was a wondrous and amazing thing when i first saw how it worked. Which means i must have been living under a rock till i started playing eve as i now see that api's are used all over the place, and i still don't fully know what they can and can't be used for. That aside, I must ask if it would be an extensive amount of work to set a template for player documentation and ask that if anyone wishes to have public data be displayed via tooltip in game, that they match this template and provide a general access api?
Thereby allowing players to seek and acquire the information they want shown from the web, as well as placing full responsibility for the maintenance and accuracy of that information with the independent parties.

...I may yet again, be talking out of my ass on this one :P



I think you are looking for something like this? Smile
Good Apollo BS4
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2013-11-14 06:44:50 UTC
Best bet is to join a corp that has ppl who are sorta experienced in whatever it is you're into ATM. Reason being there is a ton of stuff/ advice, but for example what works for a drake tank won't work on a domi... Or stuff like that with mining. Or whatever. Good corp will have ppl into what you're into and not shove "only fly drakes blah blah blah" which is supposed to be a metaphor for all the advice on the internets. Great resource for sure but it can be very overwhelming... Ppl can help better or at least tell you when what you're reading is pre inferno or some such. Least that was my experience.
lollerwaffle
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2013-11-14 07:50:04 UTC
Knowledge is power. Those who seek it will have an advantage over those who don't.

No need for additional documentation IMO
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#10 - 2013-11-14 08:33:12 UTC  |  Edited by: J'Poll
lollerwaffle wrote:
Knowledge is power. Those who seek it will have an advantage over those who don't.

No need for additional documentation IMO


This, partially.

EVE has the in game browser. Nothing is stopping people from going to google to find something without even leaving the game.

The only addition I could think of that would be nice is adding a small thing to the NPE to make new capsuleers aware of the forums - specifically this part, where they can ask questions and/or find lots of information.


To have all kinds of guides and spreadsheets integrated in the game means CCP has to make free manpower to maintain them and code them in properly and it also kind of defeats the whole player driven part. Now its the players who provide each other with such knowledge.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club

Dkeh Weis
Digital Innovations
#11 - 2013-11-14 13:47:58 UTC
J'Poll wrote:


To have all kinds of guides and spreadsheets integrated in the game means CCP has to make free manpower to maintain them and code them in properly and it also kind of defeats the whole player driven part. Now its the players who provide each other with such knowledge.


Well, not necessarily. They could make an in game wiki, maintained completely by the players. It would give bittervets something to do rather than sit in station and spin. Or it would give haulers / miners something to do. Help the community while doing their daily grind.

Eve will make you work a solid month all on your own for your first cookie. Then kick you in the nuts and take that cookie, and laugh at you for thinking you could have a cookie at all.

J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#12 - 2013-11-14 13:54:34 UTC
Dkeh Weis wrote:
J'Poll wrote:


To have all kinds of guides and spreadsheets integrated in the game means CCP has to make free manpower to maintain them and code them in properly and it also kind of defeats the whole player driven part. Now its the players who provide each other with such knowledge.


Well, not necessarily. They could make an in game wiki, maintained completely by the players. It would give bittervets something to do rather than sit in station and spin. Or it would give haulers / miners something to do. Help the community while doing their daily grind.


Too bad there is already an EVE wiki, that is easily accesible through the IGB and can be maintaindd and edited by the community.

Now only to find people who want to spent their fun times writing stuff on it and keeping it up to date. I am one of those vets that never undock but I rather sit in channels helping players with their own questions then editing the wiki.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club

Dkeh Weis
Digital Innovations
#13 - 2013-11-14 14:00:59 UTC
Fair enough.

You have a good point - I love being able to go on the Wiki while out of game- it gives me something to do while I have nothing to do!

Eve will make you work a solid month all on your own for your first cookie. Then kick you in the nuts and take that cookie, and laugh at you for thinking you could have a cookie at all.

Don Juan'nardo
Overneath
#14 - 2013-11-14 20:19:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Don Juan'nardo
Though the problem I see with depending on igb for access to info on current mission/plex is that you have to keep another window open and thereby add clutter to the screen. I was hoping more for a smoother integration of basic common use public info such as specific ship stats. Something I assumed an API sourced from player maintained databases could offer.
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#15 - 2013-11-14 20:50:35 UTC
Don Juan'nardo wrote:
Though the problem I see with depending on igb for access to info on current mission/plex is that you have to keep another window open and thereby add clutter to the screen. I was hoping more for a smoother integration of basic common use public info such as specific ship stats. Something I assumed an API sourced from player maintained databases could offer.


Specific ship stats, in case you did read the Dev Blogs is coming Soon™ with ISIS.

As for all kinds of other things, it would require a lot of work to code it in, if you have to take into account character skills etc, which means more clutter to the UI etc too.

I play EVE on a rig with multiple windows, I can have EVE on one and for instance a browser for into on another. And even on my laptop, I run in windowed mode and just tab to the OGB to search stuff.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club

Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#16 - 2013-11-14 20:53:57 UTC
A good start is the the free book http://www.isktheguide.com/
Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#17 - 2013-11-14 23:33:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Xercodo
Sorry but the IGB is the only method the player base has on effecting the game client. The API is only for reading data from the server, it has no capability to send data back or to change anything inside the client.

Every API based function you've ever seen created was a third-party creation.

The only other exception of being able to change the client is being able to put videos into your Captain's Quarters TV heh

However, they are working on a new API called CREST that will allow us to both read and write data. If the amount of data we'd have access to is as much as I think it is we could potentially make some home-made super thin clients heh

At the least be able to change skills and access chat with a third-party app

The Drake is a Lie

Don Juan'nardo
Overneath
#18 - 2013-11-15 01:39:33 UTC
J'Poll wrote:

Specific ship stats, in case you did read the Dev Blogs is coming Soon™ with ISIS.


but again, this info is available in a separate window. I think it would be very usefull if i could access small pieces of this info via tooltip or something similar.
L'ouris
Have Naught Subsidiaries
#19 - 2013-11-15 03:45:16 UTC
No one is saying its a bad idea.

Just that it hasn't been a big need from most in the community.

If it's something you'd like to see, make a post in the features and ideas forums for it.

Malcanis had a good post about what to include in your idea post to make it more likely to be championed. I'd recommend searching for that post via eve-search ( Chribba made ), these forums search tool or google to get the most response to your idea.
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#20 - 2013-11-15 06:57:35 UTC
Don Juan'nardo wrote:
J'Poll wrote:

Specific ship stats, in case you did read the Dev Blogs is coming Soon™ with ISIS.


but again, this info is available in a separate window. I think it would be very usefull if i could access small pieces of this info via tooltip or something similar.


That would just mean that your screen will be cluttered with tooltips. Also, who says it will clutter more, you do know you can snap windows together, on my laptop client the IGB is actually snapped to the maincl chat window (corp, alliance, some public channels). So it doesnt take up extra space on my screen and is easily accessible in case I need it.

And to some degree you can just learn about the things you do in EVE and dont need tooltips or guides for it.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club