Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Well, yeah, I understand why the loot drops rather than is totally destroyed -- there's nothing wrong with it. I think the OP doesn't quite get this, which is why I decided to "agree" to the "no more dropping loot for suiganks" idea, with the caveat that there should be something that still allows the less savory types to get their hands on my cargo (because, srsly, making hisec into a 100% safe place is bad).

EDIT -- To be 100% clear, my posts were not meant to actually say EVE should be like RL, but that the OP is twisting an (admittedly not entirely good) analogy to say what he's saying... it goes back a few pages, but I keep having to trim off the quotes because ~forum rules~.

I have the same ideas and have been consistent throughout. Unlike yourself. Let me recap.

You have said there's no risk, then said there's little risk.
You've said it's not rare, then gone on to give poor reasoning why it actually is.
You've claimed many things. But when asked to provide citations, have failed to do so.
You have claimed it is very easy and profitable. Then gone on to say the reason people don't do it, is because they actually want a challenge. It seems your easy risk free profits are not their bag.
You have yet to provide numbers regarding Marauders, Freighters and Mining barges. All to show your argument is based on facts, rather than feelings.
You are so clued up on the subject, you even said gankers get an insurance payout.
Then we have the whole real life comparison censorship. It had to happen to you 4 times before you actually got the message.


Oh and I have lived in low sec for over 4 years and have made a profit doing so in that time. But that's because I take the time to learn the game and then play it.

Yea you're full of ideeas, whatever that means.

Yes i said as much, marauders will be balanced vs Suicide Ganking in Rubicon. Now we just need to have the other ships balanced like the Marauders are.

As for the fact that Suicide Gankers were forced not to use Battleships after a nerf, that says it all. CCP wanted to nerf you, did it... but it was not a success as now you found ships that are even more cost effective.

Good for you. Bad for EVE.

But i am sure CCP will nerf it again soon. Because they have to. And i am only talking about your profit here. That needs nerfing. Either by forcing you to use BS hull to Suicide Gank other BS hulls/capital ships or by adding some new mechanic to force you to occasionally take loses.

Griefing people should not be so rewarding. Especially when there are threads made by new players saying they can`t recover. And EVE needs new people to keep playing not to be Suicide Ganked into quitting.

There are so many reasons Suicide Ganking(griefing) for profit is a bad idea i am sure it will get nerfed again. I am here to try and help CCP find a good way to do it while still allowing it, albeit with less profit.

OP you still have this idea that "risk" means "guaranteed loss".

If we apply this logic to hauling it means there needs to be a chance that your freighter will sometimes crash into the station upon docking, or that one day Caldari command gets a bit drunk and accidentally resets my LP balance to 0.

You are not asking for balance, you are asking for the removal of a playstyle.

Your idea wouldn't even remove it, make ganking impossible to do profitably and people with too much isk will simply start sponsoring ganks.

40 out of half a million to a million trips isnot a significant risk.



There are even fewer of these kills out of tens of millions of missions run every month.



We already suffer from unprofitable ganks as well as suffering a whole host of other punishments and risks.

Nope.

And we risk hundreds of billions in every large fleet fight to protect trillions in assets while 99% of high sec gets to make isk with zero risk. We dont make them fit billions on their ship, they do it themselves in order to gain an advantage. They must accept the greater level of risk that goes along with such choices, just as we must accept the harshest punishments of any other activity in EVE when we go gank them.

What you want is to remove an entire playstyle just so you can avoid the consequences of your own actions and get a risk free ride.

But he isn't garented by game mechanics to get suicide ganked. Which is what you are asking for.



Actually I wouldn't because I'm not a ******* ****** and don't load my ships down with officer mods. It is possible to upgrade from just t2 mods and still keep yourself unprofitable to gank. Even a full t2 ship can operate at 90% the speed of a bling fit, so it's not like you're putting yourself under some gigantic handicap.

The goal is not to stop them or make them more rare.

The goal is to simply add risk to them. Real ISK loss.

One the Suicide Gankers stand to lose billions of ISK on occasion, they can keep at it, ganking whatever they want. A freighter that has 20bil would still make them rich, no mechanic should be introduced to prevent that.

But a mechanic needs to be introduced so a Suicide Ganker is forced to risk ISK equal to what the average victim loses.

For example:

A new standing is introduced. The standing can only be raised via ISK(or via items bought with ISK).

Every time CONCORD kills the person, he loses some standing. After he is killed 5-10 times by CONCORD without buying his way back from the negative standing, CONCORD will show up instantly every time he illegally attacks a target.

Once every 3 months, the standing resets, so people not suicide ganking don`t have to worry about paying for the rare times they might engage another player by mistake and so on.

The cost for getting the standing back up with ISK should be high. That way Suicide Gankers will have to make a choice:

1. Attack often for 50-100 mil profit per gank but eventually be forced to give most of it back to repair the standing with CONCORD or take a break from Suicide Ganking.
2. Attack high value targets(5bil+), in which case Suicide Ganking would net a very rewarding profit, more than enough to offset the cost of paying to increase the standing.


I know a security status already exists, but in this would only impact Suicide Ganks and not the residents of low sec. It can then be easily balanced to deter people from "for lulz" ganks(that is basically griefing as you are not doing it for any gain, you are only doing it to do harm to your fellow player) and keep them focused on High Value Targets.


As it is already clear, this would cause the Suicide Ganker to lose ISK if it attacks very low value targets for "fun" - only to cause harm to his fellow player with no thought for profit(griefing basically), but it would keep it very profitable for them to find and destroy High Value Targets.

It would also allow Suicide Gankers to keep ganking anyone and everyone provided they are willing to take the ISK loss. Just like people doing PVP in null sec/low sec have to farm some ISK to keep up with the PVP losses.


It would help bring Suicide Ganking in line with the other professions, monetary risk wise.

Tell me, what do we use to scoop the loot from the dead freighter?