Intergalactic Summit

Yeah sorry, force of habit.

Point is, that whole 'low security' thing didn't actually mean much to the people planet side for years until that whole CEWPA train wreck happened. So to an extent its on the Assembly for not seeing it coming.

Or maybe they did. Perhaps someone thought its the closest they'll get to a mechanism for leaving the Fed.

So, Intaki secession is for the Intaki solar system alone?

Interesting. Considering that the Intaki homeworld is likely the most populated and culturally dominant in the region, one would expect them to have a pretty strong influence in the area through migration and financial agreements.

But maybe I am just thinking too much. Federate politics quickly ends up as a headache that way.

It must be a very interesting view through your tinted glasses Tuulinen, because every day you continue to use the Federation as a scapegoat for almost everything that is at fault with the world today, you sound more and more like Diana Kim, but with less catchphrases and better sentence structure.


Granted you're not the only person who does it, but you do it with a Kim-like level of frequency. If you just deleted half the spaces in your posts and put "And this is why the Federation must be destroyed" at the end, it'd be hard to tell you two apart.


Yes this is a shot at someone's character rather than challenging another lack of source, high on emotional appeal content argument, but quite frankly I'm tired of constantly challenging people's skewed perspective posting and looking like a modern day Federal supporter. There's plenty of real criticisms regarding Roden, Blaque, the Senate, the political climate that people actually ignore, and go directly for the juicy skewed-perspective "let's blame it on the Federation" group like mentality.

The only exception seems to be slavery, which the Empire still suffers as a counter argument to everything, despite a lack of relevancy some time, but otherwise it's pretty much a free for all.


I mean sure, at times it serves the best interests of the State to blame the Federation for everything and try to sympathise with anyone who has the slightest gripe, and then expand it and blow it out of proportion, but then isn't the State the people who loudly, and consistently, vocalise about how they were tired of the Federation meddling in their affairs.. and yet here you are in just about every discussion meddling in theirs. Hypocrisy much?


Of course you'll find some skewed perspective to justify "Oh we're helping them" (when that's a direct line criticism used against the Federation when the same words are inferred) but let's face it, you're not working in their best interests, you're working in yours. The State benefits from the Federation getting weakened, it'd be exactly the same if there was a rift between the State and the Empire and the Matari suddenly gave a damn about the Megas, it's convenient for you, if it wasn't you wouldn't bother.


So for those people who prefer a TL:DR version of these things. Go find another faction to scapegoat on, and maybe try criticising the Federation for things they're actually guilty of doing today, because it'd be nice at times to not be the only person who actually criticises Blaque and Roden for the **** they actually do rather than this fantasy scenario where they probably also stole the cookies from the jar in your CQ.


Oh, and on a relevant side note, though I get the feeling this one is going to be impossible for people to follow, digging up the past, often irrelevantly, to "win" a modern scenario argument tends to just unfurl into a slanging match of who was more grieved, facts tend to often get lost and perspective tries to make the deaths of some people more relevant than the deaths of others, when pretty much people getting killed for things they didn't have a direct hand in (because someone will argue guilt by association of just being Amarrian/Caldari/Gallente/Minmatar) is a bad thing. All those arguments ever do is disrespect and degrade people who died simply for being what they are, well that and side track the actual debate.

Marellus your ability to imbue me with a level of malevolence towards the Federation never ceases to amaze. It seems I can't blame the Federation for anything without you leaping in to accuse me of unseemly bias - to hear you talk it would seem that the poor Gallente are the subjects of a cunning PR campaign from the State, masterminded by yours truly.

In truth, I work for a living. I don't have time to reimagine the whole cluster.

So rather than use that limited time and my limited words to try and prove something logically, I'll ask you why you think the State would ally with a gigantic, expansionist Empire that may well attack it in the future? Unless it is to protect itself from a gigantic, expansionistic Empire that is already attacking it?

No perspective is factually accurate - unless you can find someone that is wholly uninvolved and uninterested.

From my perspective the Federation is the first offender, is utterly unsympathetic to Caldari goals and needs, has dragged us into a war with the Minmatar that we never wanted and an alliance with the Empire, when our preference would be to remain unencumbered and trade with all parties.

I see the Federation as a preachy and hypocritical enemy that never ceases to twist and gnaw at the truth, spreading black propaganda about everyone else as it commits the basest of crimes and atrocities and sweeps them under the rug. If the State acted in a manner congruent with your stated opinions we would be nothing more than a client race of the Federation and, frankly, I just don't like the Federation enough to ever want to be close to it.

Now, that doesn't mean that I don't admire some things achieved by the Federation. It also doesn't mean that I can't like members of the Federation - because I do. I am not in the business of spouting propaganda, it's just that when I shower another day in the warzone off my body I find myself wishing I could do the same with my soul.

If you feel I am disparaging of the Federation then I must apologise, but the truth is that I do not see you at your best, Msr Marellus. I see you at your worst - every day - and I am not gaining as much satisfaction from killing these poor excuses of Federal Militia soldiers as I thought I would.

In my frustration I sometimes lash out.

We crossed the border because a Gallente Admiral stuffed a Nyx into a station in the Malkalen system killing... well... I don't really need to finish that sentence, do I?

But really, trade is good, isn't it? Perhaps I'm not being the face of Kaalakiota as well as I should, but I am convinced that the rest of the cluster has things of value and interest for us. And people of value and interest for us, too.

No, you don't need to finish that - because as you already know, I agree with you.

Well, it's nice to see him so disowned. Given that I can't demand that you give us back Otro Gariushi, I can't ask any more than that of you. What's really striped my back, since Malkalen, is the need some people have to spin extensive conspiracy theories about it to try and absolve Noir of guilt.

Maybe it was just one man's hate and madness.

For the record? I want the same things that you want, Msr Marellus. I'm not the State, I can't promise cease fires and an end to hostilities anymore than you can, but I would be more than happy to see this war end, cede Placid to the Federation and demand Black Rise for the State.

I think your Federation owes the Intaki some explanations for marooning their homeworld in the middle of that mess, but that's between you and them, essentially.

Not even knowing what/who came next, I would gladly have Gariushi back any day, the man was one of the brightest hopes for peace and prosperity.

Conspiracy theories will always be abound, Noir was being impersonated, the Empress is a clone under the control of someone else, the Sanmatar ordered the assassination of Midular.

A gripe within the Federation, not so much a personal gripe but still something that doesn't sit right with me, is the similarities between incidents and the reactions to them within the State.

Terrorists bomb Nouvelle Rouvenour, it's the tipping point that begins bombards, receives constant criticism that the Caldari were attacked for the actions of terrorists.

Noir orchestrates the Malkalen incident, it's the incident that leads to the massacre at Algogille the assault on Caldari Prime, the placement of a State Titan in a Federal system and the rebirth of the Federal/State war. Apparently all justified in response to a Federal (despite disavowed in every official and near unofficial *conspiracy theorists aside* capacity) attack.


Man crashes a Super Carrier into a station, kills thousands of innocents, decried as a monster, traitor, terrorist and shamed.

Man crashes a Carrier into a planet, kills thousands of innocents, praised as a hero, is a cornerstone of education and an eternal legend in State folklore.


Now yes, perception can change the stance on this, in either direction. But there's a number of similarities and yet the compete difference in public reaction between the two in the State is a major source of contention for Federal citizens.





Honestly? Call me a Hawk, but that was part of a series of weak, knee-jerk panic reactions by Foiritan. He quickly conceded Caldari Prime, and under the threat of the Shiigeru in Luminaire signed concessions that threw Intaki, his ancestral homeworld, in the line of fire. If anything the Intaki were betrayed by the man they voted in themselves, not that it in any way it puts the blame on them, but it was something the Federation learned all too late.

Foiritan was a great peace time leader, who could oversee positive diplomacy and economical growth, but had no clue what the hell to do when **** hit the fan.


The day the guns stop firing is a day I'll be drinking to remember and celebrate something, and not to cope with the day that was.

Admiral Noir purposely rammed his ship into the Station. There is absolutely no controversy about the navigational heading and intention to hit the station. Even if the conspiracy theories are true, the ship was under direct manual control and was intentionally flown on a collision course with that specific station.

He also publicly broadcasted his hate speech. He openly stated his disdain for the State and his intentions for revenge and such as he was piloting the ship into a heavily populated station. There was no question of why Noir was doing it.

The attack took place at a diplomatic summit during a time of peace, intended to calm hostilities.



There is very little evidence to suggest Tovil-Toba intended to or would have been able to actually hit any specific target the way he did. His approach was handled in the middle of a fierce firefight in low orbit, a last ditch effort by the admittedly noble Federation Navy to stop a disaster. It is doubtful that Tovil-Toba had sufficient time to pinpoint his approach vector to target Heuromont. As soon as he entered the upper atmosphere of Gallente Prime, navigational control of his ship was impossible anyways due to simple aerodynamics and wind sheer. His ship literally broke apart into thousands of pieces - some larger than others. He was probably already dead long before the impact. Where the pieces landed is entirely up to the way the winds blew - if you'll pardon the pun.

Tovil-Toba had been leading the Federation fleet on a game of cat and mouse for almost two weeks around the moons of GalPrime. He did so with the intention of distracting the Federal fleet so more Caldari survivors could evacuate. His last action was arguably yet another attempt to distract the Federation fleet - one which worked admirably. Evidence exists to suggest a vast majority of the Federation Navy was present to try and stop him, allowing his goal of distraction to work.

Finally, all this happened during a time of war. These were the actions of a military commander doing his job. While the loss of lives at Heuromont is regrettable, it was part of war, and part of the civilian collateral damage on both sides of the conflict.

In short, the two examples are wholly different. They are only coincidentally similar in that starships were used as ramming weapons.