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Dear NAGA, I am disturbed by your lack of cruise missiles
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Omnium Domitor
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#41 - 2011-11-04 19:23:07 UTC
I know it's still WIP, but the removal of explosion velocity/radius bonus on torps is a big letdown.

Why do we even want large hybrid optimal ranged bonus on Naga, when Rokh already has that and nobody uses it?

Either focus on being a complete missile boat or hybrid turret boat, not a poor mixture of both.
Naomi Knight
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#42 - 2011-11-04 19:44:51 UTC
cruise missiles sux anyway no worth to use ever in pvp
Alara IonStorm
#43 - 2011-11-04 21:09:58 UTC
Naomi Knight wrote:
cruise missiles sux anyway no worth to use ever in pvp

Cruise Missiles do not suck for PvP there Platforms do.

1. All viable Fleet Battleships have 7-8 Slots or 6 slots and 2 Damage Bonuses.
2. Multiple Types of Ships are available for each fleet, Tempsts/Maelstrom and Armageddons/Apocalypse/Abbadon.
3. Missile Fleets currently are made up of Drakes and Tengu's. The Raven will slow them down. Typhoons have 5 Missile Slots, won't be able to sit still for Sentries, Heavies are to slow to move through fleets and they have weak Shield Tanks compared to current Missile Fleets.

A Naga with 8 Cruise Missile Launchers and a Dmg Bonus with 2 BCU's will pump out 650 Dmg with missiles moving the same speed as Heavies.

All together Cruise Missiles are accurate for a large weapon and can get good DPS in both close and long range with selectable Damage Types but there is not a Missile Ship good enough to support them.
Patri Andari
Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer
#44 - 2011-11-05 00:10:03 UTC
Naomi Knight wrote:
cruise missiles sux anyway no worth to use ever in pvp


As do rails but CCP never thought to introduce a Hybrid platform which could not use rails but only blasters.

Be careful what you think, for your thoughts become your words. Be careful what you say, for your words become your actions. Be careful what you do, for your actions become your character. And character is everything. - author unknown
Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
#45 - 2011-11-05 01:06:23 UTC
i am pretty sure that they are avoiding missile spamming w.hor.e scenario creating yet another drake with large missiles instead...but it can be that they are testing stuff and you all end up with another drake.

i am hoping that they resist the urge to please every whine on this forums game will be auto more awesome.

You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear

Because >>I is too hard
Alara IonStorm
#46 - 2011-11-05 01:21:26 UTC
Mina Sebiestar wrote:
i am pretty sure that they are avoiding missile spamming w.hor.e scenario creating yet another drake with large missiles instead...but it can be that they are testing stuff and you all end up with another drake.

i am hoping that they resist the urge to please every whine on this forums game will be auto more awesome.

Yes because god help the game if there is more then 2 viable fleet missile boats.

Mina is a Laser and Artillery whore only. Roll Likes taking the 1400mm's.
Bomberlocks
Bombercorp
#47 - 2011-11-05 04:37:46 UTC
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Cambarus wrote:
(IIRC the drake is the most commonly flown combat ship in the game, being used more than than the other top 10 combined)

Reality Disagree's with you.

1 Drake 6444
2 Hurricane 6038
3 Abaddon 2840
4 Zealot 2106
5 Armageddon 1996
6 Dramiel 1596
7 Tempest 1332
8 Cynabal 1291
9 Sabre 1087
10 Rapier 951
11 Tengu 933
12 Vagabond 910
13 Scimitar 865
14 Harbinger 842
15 Manticore 794
16 Nyx 721
17 Rifter 704
18 Hound 681
19 Machariel 636
20 Loki 627

Monitoring the list the Drake has never had more then twice as much as the next best ship the Hurricane. The list is low because EVEkill Server Issues means a new 30 Day list started October 31. The day before the Drake had 175000 while the Cane a Small Gang Ship had 125000 and the Abbadon in the area of 80000.

Drake is good but not 10X as good.

People are bandying this list around in typical hurr durr idiot fashion without taking into count what the list will look like after the Gallente speed/agility and hybrid buffs have been implemented.

IF and WHEN it turns out that Gallente are still terribad, THEN you can moan and complain and I'll be right there with you, but, please, try it out first.
Alara IonStorm
#48 - 2011-11-05 04:46:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Alara IonStorm
Bomberlocks wrote:

People are bandying this list around in typical hurr durr idiot fashion without taking into count what the list will look like after the Gallente speed/agility and hybrid buffs have been implemented.

IF and WHEN it turns out that Gallente are still terribad, THEN you can moan and complain and I'll be right there with you, but, please, try it out first.

WTF does that have to do with the reason it was posted, to show that the Drake is not used in PvP 10x as much as the next ship. Blasters had literally nothing to do with me posting the list, feel free to find one of those Threads or Posters that you are tired of and pick on there lists.

As for Rails you can Buff them all you want unless you make there Alpha greater then 1400mm's and there Damage and Tracking better then Scorch you will not see them deployed to the field. Unless there is a Nerf to those 2 Weapons or they undue the Probing changes Rails are a non starter simply put.

This is about the Rail Naga right or are you expecting to Bastardize it with Blasters and dump the Fail Rail.

Not to mention Hybrids are already represented on the Talos and Missiles are only half represented which is what this Thread is about. A Cruise Missile Naga.

Edit: Unless you mean this dude.

Soon Shin wrote:



Lol No gallente ships other than the Nyx. And no, Angel ships do not count. this clearly shows that Gallente subcaps pretty much suck.

CCP is now making the SAME GODDAMN MISTAKE with the Talos, they're trying that make it perform a role that the weapon and race philosophy does NOT WORK WITH.

CCP wants to make a glass cannon ships can are meant to engage at long ranges, but the problem is that Gallente is a race that uses ******* Blasters. Blaster are ****, they have 3-5 times less range, but only compensate for it by having 5-10% more dps. That is a ****** TRADEOFF! Which is the damn reason why no one wants to use ******* Blasters.

People argue about getting someone to tackle, well its a **** REASON. Having a tackler ships means a loss of DPS, A Blaster ship needs to have enough DPS to compensate for that. The problem is that it frikkin does not !

The Talos makes it so it gets rid of needing a tackler with its webbing bonus and speed, and therefore makes it a worthwhile ship! But not anymore!

You're just better off flying a Oracle or a Tornado, which do nearly as much DPS but have SUPERIOR Range which is important for Tier 3 BC.

If you're flying a gang the Talos is not as useful as an Oracle or a Tornado which are useful in more situations due to having more range.


That is a lot of Rage there for a video game. =/
Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
#49 - 2011-11-05 04:59:57 UTC
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Mina Sebiestar wrote:
i am pretty sure that they are avoiding missile spamming w.hor.e scenario creating yet another drake with large missiles instead...but it can be that they are testing stuff and you all end up with another drake.

i am hoping that they resist the urge to please every whine on this forums game will be auto more awesome.

Yes because god help the game if there is more then 2 viable fleet missile boats.

Mina is a Laser and Artillery ***** only. Roll Likes taking the 1400mm's.


hey hey don't be mean now i like drone action too so basically anything goes that require more than one brain cell to fly so yeah anything non caldari to be precise.

You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear

Because >>I is too hard
Alara IonStorm
#50 - 2011-11-05 05:05:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Alara IonStorm
Mina Sebiestar wrote:

hey hey don't be mean now i like drone action too so basically anything goes that require more than one brain cell to fly so yeah anything non caldari to be precise.

Don't pretend Caldari is easy just because your Drake is nice enough to fake it for you.

Your group of Scourge Heavy Missile hits your Ego, doing 1945.5 damage.

One of these days the Explosions will be real for you.
Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
#51 - 2011-11-05 05:17:13 UTC
Wouldn't know hun as i wrote just above shallow things are not something i care about so i didn't fly caldari and don't think i will.

And blob of shallow thing is gross and doesn't do game any good and any ccp attempt to stir clear of noob cry for more of the same the better.

You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear

Because >>I is too hard
Alara IonStorm
#52 - 2011-11-05 05:34:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Alara IonStorm
Mina Sebiestar wrote:
Wouldn't know hun as i wrote just above shallow things are not something i care about so i didn't fly caldari and don't think i will.

And blob of shallow thing is gross and doesn't do game any good and any ccp attempt to stir clear of noob cry for more of the same the better.

So Drakes are only good in a Blob now... got it.

Guess Caldari sucks at solo PvP, Mina said so and everything. It must be true.

Don't tell the Nano Drake it will be crushed.
Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
#53 - 2011-11-05 05:44:02 UTC
"So Drakes are only good in a Blob now... got it."

that's what she said... or you in this case not me.

You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear

Because >>I is too hard
Alara IonStorm
#54 - 2011-11-05 05:56:25 UTC
Mina Sebiestar wrote:
"So Drakes are only good in a Blob now... got it."

that's what she said... or you in this case not me.

Really lets have a look see.
Mina Sebiestar wrote:
Wouldn't know hun as i wrote just above shallow things are not something i care about so i didn't fly caldari and don't think i will.

And blob of shallow thing is gross and doesn't do game any good and any ccp attempt to stir clear of noob cry for more of the same the better.

So the Drake is not Caldari huh. Or are they exempt from your shallow blob.
Masamune Dekoro
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#55 - 2011-11-05 06:42:27 UTC
I was under the impression that the new battlecruisers were meant to be glass cannon/in-your-face/expendable leetdps ships.

No matter how you look at it, Cruises in their current form don't fit with this (nor do Rails ofc).

The Talos is an upclose and personal blaster boat.

The Naga is an upclose and personal blaster OR torp boat.

And you want Cruises too? For PvP? Really?
Alara IonStorm
#56 - 2011-11-05 11:00:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Alara IonStorm
Masamune Dekoro wrote:
I was under the impression that the new battlecruisers were meant to be glass cannon/in-your-face/expendable leetdps ships.

Perhaps you should rethink your impressions then since three of them have range bonuses.
Masamune Dekoro wrote:

No matter how you look at it, Cruises in their current form don't fit with this (nor do Rails ofc).

Thank go you are 100% wrong about these ships then.
Masamune Dekoro wrote:

The Talos is an upclose and personal blaster boat.

Yes 1 out of 4 makes them all close range.
Masamune Dekoro wrote:
I
The Naga is an upclose and personal blaster OR torp boat.

Yeeeah no. Caldari Boats are not designed for Blasters. They are Bastardized into them because of Balance issues.
Masamune Dekoro wrote:
I
And you want Cruises too? For PvP? Really?

If you want to think of Cruise Missiles as being bad at PvP feel free too. You are wrong but feel free Roll.
Masamune Dekoro
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#57 - 2011-11-05 13:02:48 UTC
Feel free to keep using Cruises for PvP, I certainly won't stop you. Roll
Alara IonStorm
#58 - 2011-11-05 13:10:27 UTC
Masamune Dekoro wrote:
Feel free to keep using Cruises for PvP, I certainly won't stop you. Roll


I don't use them for PvP but hey I bet you think it is because the Weapons System Sucks.

You should take a look around for the actual reason why they suck.
Masamune Dekoro
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#59 - 2011-11-05 13:47:33 UTC
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Masamune Dekoro wrote:
Feel free to keep using Cruises for PvP, I certainly won't stop you. Roll


I don't use them for PvP but hey I bet you think it is because the Weapons System Sucks.

You should take a look around for the actual reason why they suck.


eh I never said they were the problem... I said that you were free to use them in PvP.

But as you said, you don't. I'll assume the snide reference is because they don't fit into the current metagame, much like ~ohwait~ railguns.

So why does the ship need the bonus again? Will you use cruises on the Naga if it does get the bonus?

I'm missing your point.
Alara IonStorm
#60 - 2011-11-05 13:56:34 UTC
Masamune Dekoro wrote:

eh I never said they were the problem... I said that you were free to use them in PvP.

Really because you seem to be surprised by the very concept of Cruises. "And you want Cruises too? For PvP? Really?" Why the surprise about PvP Cruise Missiles if you do not consider them a problem Problem.
Masamune Dekoro wrote:

But as you said, you don't. I'll assume the snide reference is because they don't fit into the current metagame, much like ~ohwait~ railguns.

You should Assume less. Hybrids already have enough ships that fit L Hybrid including one of the Battlecruisers. There is no effective Cruise Missile Boats, the Naga would make a perfect one.
Masamune Dekoro wrote:

So why does the ship need the bonus again? Will you use cruises on the Naga if it does get the bonus?

I'm missing your point.

Absolutely, Cruise Missiles would make a great fleet weapon for the Naga.

Remember you never said they were a problem.