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Warfare & Tactics

 
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AFK Farmer / Stabilized Farmer Solution

Author
ZheoTheThird
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#21 - 2013-11-03 23:11:23 UTC
Sean Parisi wrote:
ZheoTheThird wrote:
Why exactly are stabbed farmers a problem? People with stabs purposely gimp their fits in order to do one specific thing: disengaging. There is no rule that states that you need to take a fight. Isn't the sandbox what eve is about? If someone choses to fly something that is terrible at fighting but really good at running, where's the problem? Instead of complaining, adapt. Some of you are bigger carebears than the farmers, jesus


You don't need stabs or cloak to escape a plex. Most descent players will he pre-aligned if their sole duty is to farm, the difference is that they cannot twiddle their thumbs and waste peoples time by fitting stabs or cloaking up. It goes against the entire idea of Factional Warfare and is counter productive - this is a change that would not eliminate farming, but would discourage some of these tactics.

Essentially you shouldn't "Have" to take the fight, but if you have absolutely 0 intent of fighting then why should you benefit from a system that is solely based around PvP? Run the FW missions instead. At the end of the day I am indifferent as to whether this would actually get implemented or not, but it would reduce the amount of BS that fills up this forum about farming.


I don't know why you think that plexing is solely based around PvP. It offers opportunities for PvP, sure, but so does ratting, exploration or even mining in the widest sense. System takeovers are about PvP.
Theroine
Pew Pew Pirates
Villore Accords
#22 - 2013-11-05 03:36:26 UTC
As much as I %&^#@$& hate stabbed, cloaky farmers, I don't think banning the use of these modules is the right way to go. Roll back timers at a fixed rate (slower than if done by deplexing) if farmers are cloaked or leave the plex. Make it where the rats warp out and back if not pointed. Timers would not run either way during this time.

As soon as CCP starts messing with modules to solve this problem/irritation, what's to stop other people to start suggesting that something needs to be done for people who enjoy logging onto Eve, cloaking up in a system, and playing WOT. Imagine what those threads would look like.Pirate
Xiderpunk
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#23 - 2013-11-05 04:54:05 UTC
ZheoTheThird wrote:
Sean Parisi wrote:
ZheoTheThird wrote:
Why exactly are stabbed farmers a problem? People with stabs purposely gimp their fits in order to do one specific thing: disengaging. There is no rule that states that you need to take a fight. Isn't the sandbox what eve is about? If someone choses to fly something that is terrible at fighting but really good at running, where's the problem? Instead of complaining, adapt. Some of you are bigger carebears than the farmers, jesus


You don't need stabs or cloak to escape a plex. Most descent players will he pre-aligned if their sole duty is to farm, the difference is that they cannot twiddle their thumbs and waste peoples time by fitting stabs or cloaking up. It goes against the entire idea of Factional Warfare and is counter productive - this is a change that would not eliminate farming, but would discourage some of these tactics.

Essentially you shouldn't "Have" to take the fight, but if you have absolutely 0 intent of fighting then why should you benefit from a system that is solely based around PvP? Run the FW missions instead. At the end of the day I am indifferent as to whether this would actually get implemented or not, but it would reduce the amount of BS that fills up this forum about farming.


I don't know why you think that plexing is solely based around PvP. It offers opportunities for PvP, sure, but so does ratting, exploration or even mining in the widest sense. System takeovers are about PvP.


Plexing is a requirement for System takeovers so I am not sure what your point is? The fact is farmers are not here for their respective militia's or alliances, they are here to solo earn LP. Many of the recent Gallente farmers are now on Caldari alts.. as soon as Caldari has more systems they can jump back to Gallente and offensive plex. It is abusing the system and as it has a direct impact on both militias that's why people get annoyed by it. Stick around FW and I guarantee you will change your opinion on this.

Personally, I would never do it for no other reason than, if I got caught (and most farmers do eventually!) a lossmail of that 'shame' would be on my record forever. Stabbed venture dying in an FW zone is extremely embarrassing.
Jafit McJafitson
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#24 - 2013-11-05 05:42:34 UTC
Anyone who wants to cap a plex should have to play the hacking minigame. If we're going to be forced to pay attention to Eve while doing literally nothing for 15 minutes then we may as well give players a minigame to play to keep them occupied instead of letting them fit stabs and alt-tab out to watch Adventure Time instead.

But we all know that the whining won't stop if stabs and cloaks are banned from plexes.

Soon...

Quote:
CCP pls ban griffins and other ECM ships from capping plexes. I keep getting jammed/damped/ECM burst and losing point on plexers :'(


Quote:
CCP pls ban nanos and inertial stabilizers on plexing ships. The plexers are aligning out too quickly and I can't catch them :'(


Quote:
CCP please ban people who don't want to let me kill them from capping plexes, they keep watching dscan and running away :'(


Yeah I think people fitting stabs is a symptom of the poor state of affairs that is Eve pvp. You have only yourselves to blame. Deal with it. Adapt to the meta, fit two scrams and actually take the risk of dying in a fire to anyone who actually does want to fight back.
Thorin Matarielle
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#25 - 2013-11-05 06:31:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Thorin Matarielle
My opinion:

Ships with Stabs wouldn't be able to enter into FW plexes, the accelaration gate should keep them outside so as the cloaky ships except bombers and recons. (their ROLE to be cloaky)

These plexes meant to be dedicated places for fight, ship fitted to AVOID fights should stay away from this places. The fleet boosters got nerfed because they have to be vulnerable if they can give bonuses to someone who fight. Therefore farmers shouldn't be able to affect the war if they doesn't wants to fight. Is that simple. If i dont want to fight i'll stay docked. So finally i can decomission my sensor boosted Dramiel with her 2xTrue Sansha Scrambler (6 points ftw Twisted ) and then i can put the shiny Pcombat fit back on.
Powers Sa
#26 - 2013-11-05 07:19:23 UTC
You are not entitled to PVP on your own terms. If someone wants to have a WCS and warp away, then they should be able to. It's a valid tactic. That's just the EVE way.

Do you like winning t2 frigs and dictors for Dirt Cheap?https://eveninggames.net/register/ref/dQddmNgyLhFBqNJk

Remeber: Gambling addiction is no laughing matter unless you've lost a vast space fortune on the internet.

Sean Parisi
Blackrise Vanguard
#27 - 2013-11-05 07:36:19 UTC
Just to clarify - My proposition is not to "Ban" cloaks or warp core stabilizers. Under this idea you would still be able to essentially bring them into a plex, whether it is to bait, trap, etc. But if you must fit those to your ship, you make yourself ineligible to receiving FW LP from the PLEX or to run down the timer unless someone else without them comes into the PLEX.

People can still PvP on their own terms. But the point of FW at its core is a mechanic that encourages conflict. Both of these tools are counter intuitive to that and should not provide farmers with rewards. People would still be able to farm - They could easily align out and click warp whenever they would want to. But atleast they would have to pay attention.
Morrigan LeSante
Perkone
Caldari State
#28 - 2013-11-05 08:12:25 UTC
Thorin Matarielle wrote:
The fleet boosters got nerfed because they have to be vulnerable if they can give bonuses to someone who fight. Therefore farmers shouldn't be able to affect the war if they doesn't wants to fight. Is that simple.


Fleet boosters got nerfed because they were uncatchable (Assuming you're talking about the death of unprobable boosters), these farmers are catchable with some effort/retrofitting.

If farmers warp off, they dont take the plex therefore aren't affecting the war effort. If no-one is there to make them warp off and they take the plex - does their fit matter...?

If they warp out, or die in a fire they don't cap anyway.


As much as I can understand the annoyance, a cornerstone of eve is messing with the other guys game plan. I put these actions about in the same category as miner bumping tbh.
Powers Sa
#29 - 2013-11-05 16:00:26 UTC
Sean Parisi wrote:
Just to clarify - My proposition is not to "Ban" cloaks or warp core stabilizers. Under this idea you would still be able to essentially bring them into a plex, whether it is to bait, trap, etc. But if you must fit those to your ship, you make yourself ineligible to receiving FW LP from the PLEX or to run down the timer unless someone else without them comes into the PLEX.

People can still PvP on their own terms. But the point of FW at its core is a mechanic that encourages conflict. Both of these tools are counter intuitive to that and should not provide farmers with rewards. People would still be able to farm - They could easily align out and click warp whenever they would want to. But atleast they would have to pay attention.

What would you have to complain about if ccp changed that?

Do you like winning t2 frigs and dictors for Dirt Cheap?https://eveninggames.net/register/ref/dQddmNgyLhFBqNJk

Remeber: Gambling addiction is no laughing matter unless you've lost a vast space fortune on the internet.

The Djentleman Paulson
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#30 - 2013-11-05 19:52:13 UTC
ALOT TIMES I WANT RAT OR MINING BUT PEOPLE R CLOAKED IN MY SYSTEM I PAY GOON FOR SO ITS MINE BUT THEY ARE CLOAK SO CANT DO PLS CCP FIX PLS
The Djentleman Paulson
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#31 - 2013-11-05 19:53:03 UTC
HI POWERS U GUD LANDLORD o6m7
Jafit McJafitson
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#32 - 2013-11-05 22:04:13 UTC
So I just heard that CCP is going to ban warp core stabs and cloaks from plexes... but they're also going to make it so off-grid boosts don't work in plexes.

How do you elite 'solo' pvpers feel about that?
Milton Middleson
Rifterlings
#33 - 2013-11-05 22:33:06 UTC
Sounds awesome. Throw in timer rollbacks and FW is pretty much fixed.
SeaSaw
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#34 - 2013-11-06 15:31:31 UTC
Jafit McJafitson wrote:
So I just heard that CCP is going to ban warp core stabs and cloaks from plexes... but they're also going to make it so off-grid boosts don't work in plexes.

How do you elite 'solo' pvpers feel about that?


McJafitson;

This is really going to ruin my day. Where does it say they are banning stabs from plexes? Or OGBs from plexes?

I guess I can still fly a venture?

your humble servent
SeaSaw
Thorin Matarielle
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#35 - 2013-11-06 20:12:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Thorin Matarielle
SeaSaw wrote:

This is really going to ruin my day. Where does it say they are banning stabs from plexes? Or OGBs from plexes?

I guess I can still fly a venture?

your humble servent
SeaSaw



The biggest farmer alt in New Eden starts crying... I like that! Big smileBig smile

http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=20297149

http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=19687106
Ghost Phius
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#36 - 2013-11-08 03:47:37 UTC
Jafit McJafitson wrote:
So I just heard that CCP is going to ban warp core stabs and cloaks from plexes... but they're also going to make it so off-grid boosts don't work in plexes.

How do you elite 'solo' pvpers feel about that?



Dev quote please.
Thorin Matarielle
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#37 - 2013-11-09 22:27:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Thorin Matarielle
SeaSaw wrote:


This is really going to ruin my day. Where does it say they are banning stabs from plexes? Or OGBs from plexes?

I guess I can still fly a venture?

your humble servent
SeaSaw



Farmers should stay away from fw plexes. I hate to fly dualscram ships that slot should be for webifier. But when i see this guy on local i cant resist. :)

http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=20396237

http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=20405846


Point on POD! :)
Homem na Estrada
#38 - 2013-11-10 10:41:41 UTC
Base the reward on participation in damaging, reparing or boosting the damager and/or taking damage.

Cloak and/or passive scouts shouldnt receive rewards even if they legitimate participate in the action. I often one and I still think that way.

The thing is, even in EVE's ad parafernalia it is endorsed tactic to stick around people doing things to receive its benefits, so you first must change the philosophy of the game, and then the game mechanics.

What I think it is odd is that everyone in EVE fight to the death to defend the lowest of the practices when it comes to steal, scam, and general hisec crimes, but when it comes to steal your efforts on missions, people start to get jumpy.

There are two powers: Power of Numbers and Power of Leadership They compensate or add to each other, but nothing compensates or add to having neither. Politics: If you dont use it, it will use you.

Stalking Mantis
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#39 - 2013-11-10 11:04:52 UTC
The Solution

Amarr Liason Officer Extraordinare -->Check Out Amarrian Vengeance/Amarr FW History from 2011 to 2014 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=352629&find=unread

Stalking Mantis
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#40 - 2013-11-10 11:17:34 UTC
Jafit McJafitson wrote:
So I just heard that CCP is going to ban warp core stabs and cloaks from plexes... but they're also going to make it so off-grid boosts don't work in plexes.

How do you elite 'solo' pvpers feel about that?


/ thread

Amarr Liason Officer Extraordinare -->Check Out Amarrian Vengeance/Amarr FW History from 2011 to 2014 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=352629&find=unread

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