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Missions & Complexes

 
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Loot Spew 4 Months Later

First post
Author
Batelle
Filthy Peasants
#61 - 2013-11-19 16:05:11 UTC
Julius Priscus wrote:
anyone able to confirm if all loot spewing is now gone???


No one ever said it would be gone in the first place. Ghost sites however have no loot spew, and the rubicon launch video quotes a dev acknowledging how much people hate loot spew.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.

Silmas Feanarius
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#62 - 2013-11-19 16:34:37 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
I have more issues with the hacking mini game, but that has his own thread.

I think it should be more random. Just eject the cans as generic cans. Then its pure pot luck whether you get good stuff or crap. Horrible idea you probably think, but I think it'd get rid of a lot of the whiners (they don't like non-consistent non-perfect un-reliable ticks) and leave exploration for the people who enjoy that score! feeling.. while increasing the value of the stuff you do loot as its availability would decrease dramatically.[/quote]

Well, for one, I know I would never explore again if the loot spew was also random. What?
Also loot found in profession sites is not exclusive to those, so availability would not decrease. If the loot value was increased (by increasing quantity found in sites), however...

Need more well-formatted linking.

Swearing in Sardinian.

rikki55
Mum and Pops Shop
#63 - 2013-11-19 16:55:41 UTC
Princess Bride wrote:
Exploration GOOD.
Mini-game okay.
Loot spew BAD.

This
Capt Amer'ca
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#64 - 2013-11-19 18:57:12 UTC
If this thread reaches 100 pages, do you think they will listen to us?
Batelle
Filthy Peasants
#65 - 2013-11-19 19:01:41 UTC
Capt Amer'ca wrote:
If this thread reaches 100 pages, do you think they will listen to us?


they know we hate it already.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.

Zen Dad
Raider Covenant
Scary Wormhole People
#66 - 2013-11-19 20:17:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Zen Dad
Odyssey has artificially boosted my killboard with solo frigate kills. Apart from that, I hate the way exploration has changed. The loot spew being the final slap in the face. Tried it over 4 months and despite some nice ISK the 'atmosphere' of exploration has gone.

Mini-game + loot spew has soiled a very special place in Eve.
Batelle
Filthy Peasants
#67 - 2013-11-19 21:30:52 UTC
Zen Dad wrote:
Odyssey has artificially boosted my killboard with solo frigate kills. Apart from that, I hate the way exploration has changed. The loot spew being the final slap in the face. Tried it over 4 months and despite some nice ISK the 'atmosphere' of exploration has gone.

Mini-game + loot spew has soiled a very special place in Eve.


minigame is fine. Way better than shooting rats with a data-analyzer ship or sitting and watching your modules cycle ad nauseum. That was pretty much the definition of no-content. Now we have something that requires attention, can be screwed up, and actually gives you a damn good reason to train level 5 hacking.

And I also seem to be one of the very few old-timey explorers who sees Odyssey as a massive quality of life improvement rather than saying something to the affect of "wahh the interface doesn't suck anymore and now other people are exploring too!"

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.

Zen Dad
Raider Covenant
Scary Wormhole People
#68 - 2013-11-19 22:15:03 UTC
Batelle wrote:
Now we have something that requires attention,

Sipping a whisky whilst the can was hacked fully held my attention. Sacrificed to satisfy the hyperactive.
Kayak Attack
Perkone
Caldari State
#69 - 2013-11-19 23:51:07 UTC
adding my piece to the pile. everyone still hates it.
Gosch Ti
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#70 - 2013-11-20 12:11:11 UTC
Tried Exploration 2 weeks before Odyssey for the first time. I like the new scanning interface and I also like the minigame.

But why they want crazy with loot spew I can't even begin to understand.

If you no what containers to get it get's easier. But having all shiny parts containers spew out on the other side of the cache and winding up with carbon and data sheets is just ..... "not ok"
Silmas Feanarius
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#71 - 2013-11-20 12:34:51 UTC
Zen Dad wrote:
Batelle wrote:
Now we have something that requires attention,

Sipping a whisky whilst the can was hacked fully held my attention. Sacrificed to satisfy the hyperactive.


This is also legit. Teaches not to explore with neutrals in local while in alliance space, nor alone in hisec, nor without backup or reconnaissance everywhere else.
Every mechanic should be like this, open to emergent gameplay.

Need more well-formatted linking.

Swearing in Sardinian.

Ristlin Wakefield
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#72 - 2013-11-20 14:49:37 UTC
I don't mind the mini-game, I do hate the loot spew. If there's a petition to remove it then point me in that direction, because I'll sign it and get everyone I know to sign it too.

I have a lover, her name is EVE. I see her every night and all she asks in return is that I have a pilot's license.

Caveat Emptoris
All Goats Must Die
#73 - 2013-11-20 14:56:22 UTC
Loot spew is terrible. We already won the minigame, and at least that one is primarily skill-based. In order to guarantee I get every can from a successful hack now requires bringing an alt, or making corpmates sit around waiting for me to complete hacks. This isn't emergent gameplay-inducing. The only thing it induces is carpal tunnel and vertigo from having to zoom in, out, and around at the molecular scale in order to see the mini-containers.

CCP, please change this. Make hacking harder, or whatever you need to do to balance things. I didn't sign up and train for exploration so that I could play Hungry Hungry Hippo Online.
XmonkTad
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#74 - 2013-11-20 19:31:24 UTC
I suppose I'm going to be the odd man out, but here it is: I like the loot spew. I've said it before, and I stand by it. However, it still needs some work. Right now it is entirely based on pilot skill and ship agility. There is no skill book that gives you extra time to pick up the cans, and there is only one implant (a slot 10 prospector that costs 25 mil) that gives gives you an extra 5 seconds to the container decay time. The mechanic is heavily luck based, and hurts users who have lag during the spew event.

What needs to change is the way we interact with the spew. Tractor beams work on the container, but they don't actually collect the loot automatically, and even having the cans next to you doesn't help you collect them any faster. Fitting dedicated modules should help with the task. We need help with the spew. Maybe activating a tractor beam on the hacking container would automatically condense the loot into a regular can?

The spew takes the place of a really tired mechanic, which was essentially the same as mining but with rats that had to be killed. I'm not saying that any mechanic is better than the old one, just that the old sites felt more like combat or mining than exploration. Exploration without the rats would feel very passive if there was no loot spew. It would be really dull. It would be mining with minigames attached. Now, it's a slot machine with a minigame instead. Also, the coins run away after you've won them. And other people try and pick them up. Forget the slot machine analogy.
Batelle
Filthy Peasants
#75 - 2013-11-20 20:03:09 UTC
loot spew is a pain but so far it seems pretty hard to actually miss anything good if you have a cargo scanner.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.

Ghost Phius
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#76 - 2013-11-20 20:04:05 UTC
Oh my.....Roll
Caveat Emptoris
All Goats Must Die
#77 - 2013-11-20 21:37:57 UTC
XmonkTad wrote:
I suppose I'm going to be the odd man out, but here it is: I like the loot spew. I've said it before, and I stand by it. However, it still needs some work. Right now it is entirely based on pilot skill and ship agility. There is no skill book that gives you extra time to pick up the cans, and there is only one implant (a slot 10 prospector that costs 25 mil) that gives gives you an extra 5 seconds to the container decay time. The mechanic is heavily luck based, and hurts users who have lag during the spew event.

What needs to change is the way we interact with the spew. Tractor beams work on the container, but they don't actually collect the loot automatically, and even having the cans next to you doesn't help you collect them any faster. Fitting dedicated modules should help with the task. We need help with the spew. Maybe activating a tractor beam on the hacking container would automatically condense the loot into a regular can?

The spew takes the place of a really tired mechanic, which was essentially the same as mining but with rats that had to be killed. I'm not saying that any mechanic is better than the old one, just that the old sites felt more like combat or mining than exploration. Exploration without the rats would feel very passive if there was no loot spew. It would be really dull. It would be mining with minigames attached. Now, it's a slot machine with a minigame instead. Also, the coins run away after you've won them. And other people try and pick them up. Forget the slot machine analogy.


If loot spew were the only barrier to getting the loot out, then I think I'd not be bothered as much by it, although honestly it is a minigame designed to be terribly frustrating to anyone with a history of RSI. I don't have issues with this as much as I did years back, but it's a factor worth considering. The 4x4 pixel-sized cans spawn practically on top of each other, even zoomed in...I have a $100 mouse and I still feel as if it requires feats of serious agility to click here-but-not-there.

Pick a minigame to stand between us and loot, and stick with it. Hell, if they bolted some sort of 3-card monty "you've won" element into the minigame window itself, I'd be fine with that. But the EVE interface is particularly poorly suited to this sort of micro-selection mechanic. It's a game where we use an overview with all the sexiness of an Excel spreadsheet to control almost everything we do. There's a reason for that: in-space selection and execution are weaknesses of this UI.
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#78 - 2013-11-20 23:29:23 UTC
I don't hate the spew, but I think it was mistake to use it on all successful hacking attempts. It's largely a pointless mini-game after the hacking mini-game, so at the very least a successful hack on the first attempt should just allow you to directly access all the loot. Spew should happen only if your first attempt failed. This sort of granularity would also encourage people to invest money and time in getting the hacking done successfully on the first try and reward those who invested in it or are just good at it.

That said my actual problem with current exploration has little to do with the loot spew. It has to do with CCP taking exploration out of exploration in their supposedly exploration focused expansion. It truly is just treasure hunting now and CCP doesn't seem to have any intention to bring exploring back to exploration. The change wasn't earth shattering, but it was enough of a change to kill most of my interest in the profession and unsub my exploration alt. I don't mind treasure hunting as a profession, but I didn't want to sacrifice exploration to get more of it, since I just don't have the same level of interest in the activity.

You can argue that there is only minor differences between the two, so why does it matter, but they're still important differences for some. In the same vein there are only a few differences between doing some DED sites and mission sites, but some people can tolerate DED sites quite well, while they would rather quit playing then grind missions for a living. I don't want to derail the topic, but just wanted to point this out in case anyone in CCP ever reads this, since the removal of loot spew will have pretty much zero affect in my decision to resub the exploration alt. What matters is their willingness to bring exploring, as in putting in some proper effort to even detect the signatures, back to exploration. In my book the loot spew is just a minor detail in the grand scheme of things.
Dato Koppla
Did he say Jump
#79 - 2013-11-21 01:15:12 UTC
Just dropping by to agree that loot spew is indeed terrible and needs to be removed.
Meghel
SilfMeg Mining and Transportation Co
#80 - 2013-11-21 12:32:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Meghel
Loot Spew ànd the Hacking Minigame are terrible.

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The Hacking Minigame was at least interesting the first 20 times. After that, it got boring and repetitive.
Click-Click-Click-Click.... Pfft, BOOOORING.

After that, I longed back for the old idea; Container hacked/Analyzed -> its open. Have fun.


There is nothing interesting regarding the Hacking that would make including it in the game worthwhile... Unless spending more time at Hacking and Analyzing is the Grand Idea that CCP has for this game.

Sounds more like someone's Pet Project; "I WANT this so we WILL GET THIS" regardless of use and desirability.

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The Loot Spew is, quite frankly, horrible.

A Bad Idea with Bad Mechanics.

"Yeah, lets add many containers, containing somtimes usefull things and sometimes junk, let them spew around so people have to try and grab then." As If the Hacking/Analyzing is not bad enough....

Again, a Useless and Time Consuming Thing

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