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Dev Blog: Multiple Character Training

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Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#41 - 2013-10-18 21:06:18 UTC
Walley Wallington wrote:
hmm, am I wrong? or is it not cheaper (at least for the first 3 months) to just create an alt account?
and if I pay for it strictly with plex, I may as well do it on a 2nd account that I can play along side my main instead of the limitations of a 2nd char on the same account since there is no savings involved.


Imagine you want to use the two extra character slots on your account for market alts. You want to train them to be retail moguls, so you train Social, Connections, and various trade skills including margin trading (because scams where you don't have to actually sell or buy anything are the best scams of all). Once the training is finished, you still have access to those characters.

If you train those characters on different accounts, you lose access to them when the subscriptions on those accounts run out.

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#42 - 2013-10-18 21:07:32 UTC
I'm looking forward to having the ability to share a training queue between multiple characters. Just sayin' Big smile

Then when I want to train Caldari Frigate 3 on an alt, I won't have to pause training on the main.

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Savira Terrant
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#43 - 2013-10-18 21:39:38 UTC
Raijil Saavuj wrote:
I'm rather attached to my character - I don't really like spending time on others. At about 50 million skillpoints, I'm pretty well-rounded in combat across a variety of platforms, but I'd like to get into industry too without having to have another alt to do it.

I'd be interested to see if instead of adding plex to get other characters on the account's skill queues active, if it would be possible to increase the rate at which your main character gains skillpoints. Not a straight 2x multiple, just faster than normal. Just a thought. Less skillpoints being added to the account than multiple skillques being active, but same amount of plex used.

I've a feeling this will be flamed Twisted



Hell no. I don't even have to give reason.

.
Flatiner
State War Academy
Caldari State
#44 - 2013-10-18 22:30:02 UTC
Mashie Saldana wrote:
Flatiner wrote:
Good dev blog, and I know some of my corp mates use this feature but the problem I see with this is the fact that you might get 3 main toons but can only log one in at a time and if you decide to "move" the toon to its own account you have to pay a fee for that as well, so why not just make second, third accounts?..

Not to mention why do people still buy plex in game? It makes more sense to pay the isk and buy a GTC (Game Time Code - can be found on the game time code bazaar on the forums and is secure!) and convert it into plex or apply it to your account directly (you would get two plex for 1x 60 - day Game Time code (34.99 if purchased from an eve affiliate such as shattered crystal or battleclinic )) By doing it this way you'd save the in-game tax and broker fees.

Secondly isn't it "expensive" to pay for an account to have multiple skill queues to only log one in at a time? 1 plex is worth roughly $17.50 usd per month, If you were to buy a years subscription for a toon its only 10.95 per month. I know people have billions of isk and nothing to spend it on, but it makes more sense (to me) to just buy yearly subs for all toons and use the isk for more productive/fun things in game like funding capital fights and pvp roams =) just my two cents

I guess if you play to pay for eve and play for free, GTC's (or plex) make sense (convert GTC's to plex and save the tax and broker fees!) and if you just need a quick skill trained on alt accounts then this feature would make sense as well .. Dollar and cents though it doesn't make sense to train 3 accounts for "mains" on one main account, you're better off having multiple accounts overall.

Thanks

Flat

You can't convert GTC's from the bazaar to PLEX, they will instantly become gametime to the nominated account.


Good to know thanks for the clarification I thought you could chose an option to convert to plex after you accepted the GTC
Jada Maroo
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#45 - 2013-10-18 22:47:20 UTC
This will continue to be a ripoff until we can log into multiple characters at once on the same account so long as they are PLEXed.
Marcus Gideon
Triglavian Assembly
#46 - 2013-10-19 06:13:32 UTC
Economics!

1x sub = $15
- 3 slots, 1 training at a time, 1 playable at a time.
1x PLEX = $20
- 3 slots, 1 training, 1 playable.

3x subs = $45
- 9 slots, 3 training, 3 playable.
3x PLEX = $60
- 9 slots, 3 training, 3 playable
OR
- 3 slots, 3 training, 1 playable.

So you're telling me, I can sink $60 per month, into a single account, for the ability to have several "alts" training different skills. But I'd have to log out completely, and log back in (since EVE is the ONLY MMO that doesn't support quick changing characters) in order to use them, b/c I can only play 1 at a time.

OR

I could spend almost as much, to just as much, for ability to train 3 "alts" who can all contribute simultaneously in game, without any lame cold swapping (opposite of hot swapping) between them.


WHY does anyone think this HUGE waste of PLEX is a good thing? Other than mass producing alts for the express purpose of selling them to other players who are too lazy to train alts themselves?

I just don't get it.


However, +1 to CCP for convincing their player base that crediting $60 to a single acct, for a single month's usage, is a good thing. Bravo!
Daedra Blue
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#47 - 2013-10-19 06:35:56 UTC
Now you just need to enable login on the PLEX-ed characters for multiple logins.
Saladin
Eternity INC.
Goonswarm Federation
#48 - 2013-10-19 14:22:15 UTC
Its a nice addition, but not groundbreaking. I am amused though that training 3 characters on one account costs the same as having 3 accounts. Since you can't play them at the same time, I was hoping the fees would be less. Is there at least any plan to allow people to open the second and third queues for months at a time instead of month to month? And perhaps offer bulk discounts?

Any plan to include an option where people who had inactive accounts can back pay for that period and get SP?
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#49 - 2013-10-19 16:30:59 UTC
Saladin wrote:
Its a nice addition, but not groundbreaking. I am amused though that training 3 characters on one account costs the same as having 3 accounts. Since you can't play them at the same time, I was hoping the fees would be less. Is there at least any plan to allow people to open the second and third queues for months at a time instead of month to month? And perhaps offer bulk discounts?

Any plan to include an option where people who had inactive accounts can back pay for that period and get SP?


this.

Whilst I welcome multiple training in general, I would state that paying exactly the same amount of plex for a second full fledged account that you can operate independently and at the same time is much more versatile and better value for your plex. In essence to make this attractive it needs to be cheaper in some way such as 1 plex per two months of training time after all you can only use one character at a time as it stands at the moment.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...
Sean DT
Revered Mining Corp
#50 - 2013-10-19 17:38:40 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Well, that was inevitable, wasn't it? P


....are you going to implement some clearer way to display exactly how much time is left on each multiple training payment? ....




o/

I don't know if you have a smartphone, iphone or androidphone will work, but if you do then there's an app (there's probably more than one) called Aura by Aideron Robotics which keeps track of your char training via API and alerts you when a queue gets below 24h and if it's about to expire. It works automatically and for both single accounts/multiple chars and I know it supports multiple accounts as well. I've used it for a few years for my account and it works really well and it's free (at least for android, and I assume it is for iphone too).

Hope that helps! Sounds like it will come in handy with the new changes coming oct 22 Bear
Savira Terrant
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#51 - 2013-10-19 19:17:05 UTC
Sean DT wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Well, that was inevitable, wasn't it? P


....are you going to implement some clearer way to display exactly how much time is left on each multiple training payment? ....




o/

I don't know if you have a smartphone, iphone or androidphone will work, but if you do then there's an app (there's probably more than one) called Aura by Aideron Robotics which keeps track of your char training via API and alerts you when a queue gets below 24h and if it's about to expire. It works automatically and for both single accounts/multiple chars and I know it supports multiple accounts as well. I've used it for a few years for my account and it works really well and it's free (at least for android, and I assume it is for iphone too).

Hope that helps! Sounds like it will come in handy with the new changes coming oct 22 Bear


Please re-read her post and try again.

.
Sean DT
Revered Mining Corp
#52 - 2013-10-19 19:40:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Sean DT
Savira Terrant wrote:
Sean DT wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Well, that was inevitable, wasn't it? P


....are you going to implement some clearer way to display exactly how much time is left on each multiple training payment? ....




o/

I don't know if you have a smartphone, iphone or androidphone will work, but if you do then there's an app (there's probably more than one) called Aura by Aideron Robotics which keeps track of your char training via API and alerts you when a queue gets below 24h and if it's about to expire. It works automatically and for both single accounts/multiple chars and I know it supports multiple accounts as well. I've used it for a few years for my account and it works really well and it's free (at least for android, and I assume it is for iphone too).

Hope that helps! Sounds like it will come in handy with the new changes coming oct 22 Bear


Please re-read her post and try again.



I just did and I'm not sure what you mean? Perhaps I misunderstood something since my native language isn't english, but I've tried to be helpful. I understand that she would like the time remaining to be listed on the account management page. That's fine. I just wanted to help with advice on how the skill could be managed right now on day 1.

If CCP makes changes such as adding more functionality to the account management page, then great. I'm sure a million answers to the post can be made, mine is just one suggestion . And if I misunderstood her intent with the question then maybe someone else will find my answer helpful. Unlike you I most certainly wasn't trying to be condescending and I hope it didn't come off as that in any way . It was a simple tip of a way to keep track of multiple skill queues easily.

edit: ok I think I get what you mean. She isn't asking how long training time is left, simply how long is left of the time she can dual/triple train. Yes the app cannot show that, so I answered in East when she asked in West. Thanks for pointing it out.
Savira Terrant
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#53 - 2013-10-19 19:49:51 UTC
Sean DT wrote:
edit: ok I think I get what you mean. She isn't asking how long training time is left, simply how long is left of the time she can dual/triple train. Yes the app cannot show that, so I answered in East when she asked in West. Thanks for pointing it out.


Blink There you go.

.
Flatiner
State War Academy
Caldari State
#54 - 2013-10-19 21:32:28 UTC
Marcus Gideon wrote:
Economics!

1x sub = $15
- 3 slots, 1 training at a time, 1 playable at a time.
1x PLEX = $20
- 3 slots, 1 training, 1 playable.

3x subs = $45
- 9 slots, 3 training, 3 playable.
3x PLEX = $60
- 9 slots, 3 training, 3 playable
OR
- 3 slots, 3 training, 1 playable.

So you're telling me, I can sink $60 per month, into a single account, for the ability to have several "alts" training different skills. But I'd have to log out completely, and log back in (since EVE is the ONLY MMO that doesn't support quick changing characters) in order to use them, b/c I can only play 1 at a time.

OR

I could spend almost as much, to just as much, for ability to train 3 "alts" who can all contribute simultaneously in game, without any lame cold swapping (opposite of hot swapping) between them.


WHY does anyone think this HUGE waste of PLEX is a good thing? Other than mass producing alts for the express purpose of selling them to other players who are too lazy to train alts themselves?

I just don't get it.


However, +1 to CCP for convincing their player base that crediting $60 to a single acct, for a single month's usage, is a good thing. Bravo!


^^ what he said .. but thinking more about it .. if you let full accounts expire you of course as we all know can't log into them without keeping the plex monster fed or paying a monthly fee .. so in a sense this multiple character training allows you to log into an alt even when the plex runs out .. that's the only plus side I can see from this feature
Gargep Farrow
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#55 - 2013-10-20 01:22:55 UTC
There are way too many good points on both sides of this argument to quote.

The main thing is that if you wish to play two or more accounts at the same time this new feature will not help. If you need an alt with set skill levels to do a certain task, but that toon does not need to be logged at the same time as your main ie. manufacturing alt, then this function will save you big money over the long term as you can stop putting in the PLEX as soon as their skills are maxed.

I like what is being done here, but now I have to seriously decide which of the two options is better as I am currently looking at adding an alt. Thanks CCP for making this decision more difficult. ;) Seriously its nice to have 2 good choices to look at.
Octoven
Stellar Production
#56 - 2013-10-20 01:57:49 UTC
The bit that concerns me here is the impact of the markets. We arent talking about something in game like trit that can always be added in various parts of the game or taken out to keep the supply/demand part from being offset. PLEXs are bought through cash, unless you are offering them for a significant value (Less than subscribtion fee) you create a situation where the supply stays the same and deman increases exponentially.

This was a concern when dual-training came out. PLEXs have gone through the roof now and continue to do so. Much of the market activity is centered around these things. I think you (CCP) are a bit to hasty in doing this.
Gargep Farrow
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#57 - 2013-10-20 03:16:30 UTC
Octoven wrote:
The bit that concerns me here is the impact of the markets. We arent talking about something in game like trit that can always be added in various parts of the game or taken out to keep the supply/demand part from being offset. PLEXs are bought through cash, unless you are offering them for a significant value (Less than subscribtion fee) you create a situation where the supply stays the same and deman increases exponentially.

This was a concern when dual-training came out. PLEXs have gone through the roof now and continue to do so. Much of the market activity is centered around these things. I think you (CCP) are a bit to hasty in doing this.

I dont think you are fully looking at everything involved. If you open up a separate account for an alt, you have to keep PlEXing that account to use it, therefore it is a major demand in the PLEX market. With Dual or now triple training, once an alt is maxed in the skills needed, a player can stop PLEXing it and still be able to play that alt. It is an option that may add some initial demand to the market, but in the long run could reduce the demand and therefore the price of PLEX.
Buzzy Warstl
Quantum Flux Foundry
#58 - 2013-10-20 04:31:07 UTC
You know, it's amazing, they implemented the first stage of this how many months ago?

The world didn't end then. Heck, if you didn't use the feature you didn't even notice the effect.

And people are *still* complaining that it will break things.

http://www.mud.co.uk/richard/hcds.htm Richard Bartle: Players who suit MUDs
Lucidia fern
Bacon.
#59 - 2013-10-20 14:27:12 UTC
So you can either own two accounts or have two toons on one account
both the same price
yet less functionality with the latter as you cannot log onto both at the same time

I don't see the point currently.
Electra Magnetic
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#60 - 2013-10-20 15:47:03 UTC
Why not just implement a character merger?

oh wait, I forgot, CCP just wants to sell more PLEX.

they dont really care about the players or what we want.