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[Rubicon] [Updated] Interdictor Rebalance

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Demonic Sentiment
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#181 - 2013-10-16 01:57:07 UTC
No to the eris split weapons... stupid change
Kel hound
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#182 - 2013-10-16 02:01:00 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:

ERIS - Eris is the next in the new Roden designs. Big bonuses to both missiles and hybrid turrets allow the highest damage of all the dictors if one chooses. However for most normal uses the big Eris changes are the huge amount of mass it lost (leading to much much improved speed and agility) and the extra fittings. The 10mn AB plated fleet fits will be much improved after Rubicon.

Gallente Destroyer Bonuses:
10% bonus to Small Hybrid Turret falloff per level
5% bonus to Rocket and Light Missile explosion radius per level (was 10% bonus to small hybrid tracking per level)

Interdictors Bonuses:
10% bonus to Small Hybrid Turret, Rocket, and Light Missile damage per level (was 5% bonus to thermal rocket and light missile damage)
10% bonus to Interdiction Sphere Launcher rate of fire per level

Role bonus:
Can fit Interdiction Sphere Launchers

Slot layout: 8H, 2M, 4L; 4(-1) turrets, 4 launchers
Fittings: 64(+2) PWG, 210(+16) CPU
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 650(-1) / 700 / 750(-1)
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap/s) : 700(+231.25) / 350s(+37.5) / 2(+0.5)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 305(-3) / 3.52(+0.145) / 1250000(-213000) / 6.1s(-1.11)
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 5 / 5
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 55km / 500 / 7
Sensor strength: 13(+2) Magnetometric
Signature radius: 85(-1)


ಠ_ಠ

Quote:
Slot layout: 8H, 2M, 4L; 4(-1) turrets, 4 launchers


ಠ_ಠ

Quote:
4 turrets, 4 launchers


ಠ_ಠ
This is the first time you've made me really question you Fozzie. It was said you would rebalance these ships, not leave them in darkness.
Mioelnir
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#183 - 2013-10-16 02:04:14 UTC
Tuxedo Catfish wrote:
xttz wrote:
The best way to address this (although probably too late now) is in a similar way to how old command ships worked:

1) Give the old interdictors stats geared toward small-scale pvp / gatecamping, much like the proposals in the OP
2) Use the newer destroyer models to make 'fleet interdictors' with bonuses to speed / agility / EHP.


This is an excellent idea.

I'd say there is writing on the wall for a second interdictor that throws anti-microjump bubbles based on the new hull.
At least there was talk about anchorable anti-microjump bubbles when the MJD was introduced, so mobile Dic/Hic versions of that would be logical.
Catherine Laartii
Doomheim
#184 - 2013-10-16 02:06:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Catherine Laartii
gascanu wrote:


o wise dude, can you explain how the hell will you be able to bubble a fleet with a mobile warp distrupor???
do you even know that they need some time before they get online? or that they can be locked and killed by any ship out there?
like really, stop postig if you have no ideea what are you takinb about...


It was a suggestion because this is a features and IDEAS thread. And if you'd cared to read further down, I stated that I'd be fine with them buffing the interdiction spheres' time on field as long as the ships themselves get buffed. The implication I was ATTEMPTING to make was that the two should merge in some way, if they did elliminate interdiction sphere launchers. Yes, they (mobile warp disruptors) take time to set up, and yes, they can be shot down, but the problems with interdiction sphere launchers is the SHIPS that field them. That is what this thread is about and that is what I'm concerned with when I'm looking at them. So mobile warp disruptors can be shot down and take time to online? So do 'dictors; that's why everyone on this thread is pissed. These changes don't do enough.
Catherine Laartii
Doomheim
#185 - 2013-10-16 02:08:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Catherine Laartii
Vatek wrote:


I'd like to see the bubble firing rate bonus removed from the hull, given to the launcher itself as a baseline ROF (who cares about making it a hull bonus when nothing else can fit them) and have that bonus replaced with a useful survivability bonus like resists or a sig reduction of some kind. Even if they just copied the covops cloak revamp (set it to 100cpu and give the hull a bonus to fitting) it would at least give us a bunch of extra CPU to play with when all of these ships are extremely fitting limited.

I've never understood why these ships are so fragile. Hictors have ridiculous passive tanks so they can stand up to fleet firepower but dictors can't survive against a single T1 frigate or a battle industrial (especially the newly buffed ones) without logistics or ewar backup.

The mids and lows are another issue, especially on the Eris and the Flycatcher. The slot layouts on these two ships are frankly silly. The Eris should go from 2/4 to 4/2 and the flycatcher should be switched from 5/1 to 3/3. I'm aware that this homogenizes the fits quite a bit but the result is that both of these hulls end up being more competitive with the sabre for small gang work.


What do you think about dropping a high for a fitting slot, assuming they all get 7 highs with 6 weapons? If they fix the launching system for them, do you think it would be appropriate to do that if it gives them more survivability to launch more bubbles and, you know, actually shoot back?
SmarncaV2
Doomheim
#186 - 2013-10-16 02:16:17 UTC  |  Edited by: SmarncaV2
Marlona Sky wrote:
I believe the actual interdictor sphere launcher needs a revamp. Sure years ago it worked for the scale of the game, but thankfully the game has grown since then, specifically fleet battles.

I propose you limit the sphere launcher to only one fit at a time. Change the rate of fire to 3-5 seconds. Remove the bonus to the sphere launcher rate of fire and make it +1 to amount of bubbles in the launcher clip with a base amount of 0. At level 1 interdictor you can carry one bubble in the launcher and at max skill, level 5, you can have 5 loaded. Now have the reload time decently long.

With this you have a launcher that fullfills the needs of today's fleets and allows fitting room for a more logical tank so the pilot can be more than a 15 second hero. Also when the launcher is reloading, the pilot can bail off the battlefield or stay and perform some other duties like anti-tackle role without being gimped due to 2-3 launchers and a cloak.


I support this very good idea!

+ Maybe in the winter expansion 2024 add fleet interdictor and "combat" interdictor

AND remove the split weapon system on Eris...
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#187 - 2013-10-16 02:17:18 UTC
Catherine Laartii wrote:


What do you think about dropping a high for a fitting slot, assuming they all get 7 highs with 6 weapons? If they fix the launching system for them, do you think it would be appropriate to do that if it gives them more survivability to launch more bubbles and, you know, actually shoot back?



one fitting slot won't give you enough survivability to 'drop bubbles and shoot back', people will still not want fleet dictors to bother trying to shoot things, rather they'll still be tasked with dumping bubbles and just trying to live

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.
Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#188 - 2013-10-16 02:24:03 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
Why do all races have missile ships now?

I don't get it.. We don't see lasers or Ac's being flavour for other races :S


LEAVE THE KHANID ALONE D:

The Drake is a Lie
Lfod Shi
Lfod's Ratting and Salvage
#189 - 2013-10-16 04:25:17 UTC
The Flycatcher changes are very acceptable. My ship and I are pleased.

♪ They'll always be bloodclaws to me ♫
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#190 - 2013-10-16 04:46:24 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
I believe the actual interdictor sphere launcher needs a revamp. Sure years ago it worked for the scale of the game, but thankfully the game has grown since then, specifically fleet battles.

I propose you limit the sphere launcher to only one fit at a time. Change the rate of fire to 3-5 seconds. Remove the bonus to the sphere launcher rate of fire and make it +1 to amount of bubbles in the launcher clip with a base amount of 0. At level 1 interdictor you can carry one bubble in the launcher and at max skill, level 5, you can have 5 loaded. Now have the reload time decently long.

With this you have a launcher that fullfills the needs of today's fleets and allows fitting room for a more logical tank so the pilot can be more than a 15 second hero. Also when the launcher is reloading, the pilot can bail off the battlefield or stay and perform some other duties like anti-tackle role without being gimped due to 2-3 launchers and a cloak.


a much more thought out version of my previous post plus one like

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Abdiel Kavash
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#191 - 2013-10-16 05:05:09 UTC
The best buff dictors could get is a proper visible cooldown timer on the bubble launcher.
Zilero
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#192 - 2013-10-16 06:33:07 UTC
Abdiel Kavash wrote:
The best buff dictors could get is a proper visible cooldown timer on the bubble launcher.


Not empty quoting.
Magic Crisp
Amarrian Micro Devices
#193 - 2013-10-16 06:54:17 UTC
usually the matari stuff is the most agile in eve. whatever you touch, you seem to be changing this. So, from now on the matari interdictor is the least agile one, looking at the align time stats. Eve's basic principles have changed since Fozzie.
Sizeof Void
Ninja Suicide Squadron
#194 - 2013-10-16 07:03:03 UTC
Buff to split weapons on Eris - thumbs up!

Great fun for those of us who actually spent the time to skill up both guns and missiles.

Not sure why you kept the single small drone, though.
Hannott Thanos
Squadron 15
#195 - 2013-10-16 07:15:47 UTC
Magic Crisp wrote:
usually the matari stuff is the most agile in eve. whatever you touch, you seem to be changing this. So, from now on the matari interdictor is the least agile one, looking at the align time stats. Eve's basic principles have changed since Fozzie.


Let me tell you why this is wrong.

Would you put a nano on a 1 lowslot low dps hull? No, damage mod
Would you put a nano on a 3 or 4 lowslot armor tank hull? No, damage and tank mods
Would you put a nano on a 2 lowslot shieldtanker that has the greatest top speed? Yes, and a damage mod as well

Slot layout and tanking type plays a huge part in the balancing. If the Sabre had the best agility as well as top speed it would just stomp the other dictors like it always has. It's still the most agile and fastest dictor with a nano fit to it.

while (CurrentSelectedTarget.Status == ShipStatus.Alive) {

     _myShip.FireAllGuns(CurrentSelectedTarget);

}
Hannott Thanos
Squadron 15
#196 - 2013-10-16 07:20:04 UTC
Sizeof Void wrote:
Buff to split weapons on Eris - thumbs up!

Great fun for those of us who actually spent the time to skill up both guns and missiles.

Not sure why you kept the single small drone, though.


Hush you, split types are bad, mkay?
At least give the option to use either, don't force a split, that's bad design, and that's a quote from CCP, not just me, so why they even did this is a mystery. I've only ever given Fozzie praise for his rebalancing, but this I can't get behind.

while (CurrentSelectedTarget.Status == ShipStatus.Alive) {

     _myShip.FireAllGuns(CurrentSelectedTarget);

}
Harreeb Alls
God of Terrorr
Domain Research and Mining Inst.
#197 - 2013-10-16 08:27:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Harreeb Alls
These look awesome. I support these changes! These combined with the interceptors and EAF's is going to change null sec, and low for the better.

A whole new vibrant era of small gang pvp is about to emerge. Gangs of smaller class ships using hit and run tactics will be much more viable. The people who have been bearing in nullsec reaping massive rewards with so little risk are about to drown in their own tears. If you want to use your space, you'd better be active in it.

The wolf packs are coming for you bloated cows.
Venum Einherjar's
State War Academy
Caldari State
#198 - 2013-10-16 08:36:26 UTC
Is it possible to put 7 launchers to the flycatchers ?

Heretic has 7 launchers, Sabre 7 turrets, and flycatcher specialised in missiles ( caldari ) only 6 ...
Bezdar22
Destructive Influence
Northern Coalition.
#199 - 2013-10-16 08:39:18 UTC
wtf.. its not rebalance at all.. look athose bonus they all became missle boat.. sabre is stilll the good one..and others are still ****..why not u make them t2 destroyer same as t1 with bubbles on it...

sabre is the only one has projectile and and tracking bonus ..
eris is mixed with hybrid and missle .. no one gonna fly that
hertic missle bonus not accepttable need laser bonus as coarcer with tracking
dont care abt flycather much
Serenum
Red Cross Marauders
#200 - 2013-10-16 08:50:52 UTC
i'll chime in, no split weapons on the eris, the rest is okay


but doing something against the suicide mission that is actually using your bubbles would be cool

warpin in > bubble > pray

if you do get popped you are likely to get podded as well, discourages older pilots as usual