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L4 mission running - when is it time to upgrade?
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Patrice Macmahon
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#21 - 2013-10-15 17:37:12 UTC
Silmas Feanarius wrote:
Explain - I do better with a lower dps CNR



I'm going off my personal numbers and generalities that I've seen helping my corp mates get up and running.

I am not a missile user, but I do know that effective DPS out of a missile boat is a little wonky when trying to do a direct comparison to turret baised ships.

The biggest difference probably has to do with your ability to apply optimal damage profile for full damage at 85 KM. You also could be cherry picking your missions. The limiting factor to the isk payout is the number of high bounty BS's in the mission pocket itself.

At a general term, most level IV missions have the rats to push 6-9 million isk in 20 minutes taking into account spawn times and positioning. at 800 DPS against Angel Extraviganza, I regulary hit 18 million isk payouts when I clear the bonus room.

The numbers are a practical number that people can reasonably achieve without bending over backwards.

 "Much of this is crystallised in our philosophy, or as others call it "the Intaki Faith". We simply call it Ida - the literal translation is "to consider", and is a good description of the Intaki." 
quoOoup
#22 - 2013-10-15 23:48:38 UTC  |  Edited by: quoOoup
Interesting notes, but some won't fit. To give you an idea of a RNI, here are some stats:

Raven Navy Issue

DPS tank: 758 [EM], 729 [TH], 972 [KIN], 1167 [EX] | eHP ~95.000
DPS gank: 1045 (w/o Drones), 1144 (with small Drones), you could even put out 3 sentries Blink
CAP: 2m20s
VELOCITY: 441 m/s (with AB)
DMG-Projection: Rigor II, Flare II, 2 x TP (You one-shot everything, but a few Elite-Ships need 2 salves. BS take 2 - 4 salves)
COST: ~2.5B ISK

The tank seems very big, but I have to pay attention with my CAP. I don't give a sh*t on this 'capstable'-mindset. If you are able to run missions with these stats - or similar stats - you won't spend time in salvaging & looting. It becomes a waste of your time. At least you will be able to reach ticks above 20 million. And there will be many times you reach 15+ million. If you cherrypick this way, you won't ever drop below ~15 million. Don't forget the LPs and the rewards.
Btw, you have a great range - over 90km - and a full control of the DMGtype to shoot. You can easily just take Furys. They will act like described above. With less good skills just take a few Precision in your cargo and gogo.

ISK, ISK, ISK, ...
Ariel Dawn
State War Academy
Caldari State
#23 - 2013-10-16 08:23:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Ariel Dawn
Once you're familiar with missiles and L4s, I highly suggest to train for a Machariel. The ship and missioning fit is fairly cheap (total cost of around 1.25b or so) and if you mission in an area that places you against Angel rats often, then the speed at which it completes missions is absurd (bounty ticks of 13m - 16.5m or so fairly consistently while looting battleships at the same time since the ship is so fast).

7x 800mm AC II
1x Auto Target System I (+2 targets that you can lock)

1x Deadspace 100mn Afterburner
1x Pith XL Shield Booster (Any letter works)
1x EM Ward Field
2x Invul II

4x Faction Gyro
3x Tracking Enhancer II

3x Cap Rigs (Semi or CCC)

4x Bouncer
5x Hobgoblin

1545 DPS with Hail, 1250 with non-faction standard ammo, 700 m/s. Most missions everything dies before you need to run your shield booster and as soon as the gates unlock you can activate them. Insta-kills frigates/destroyers (split your guns into groups of 2, 2 and 3). The fit is cheap enough that suicide gankers are unlikely to make the return on hull costs that they'd have to spend to pop you as well, plus you move fast enough that quite a # of their shots may miss in the first place.
quoOoup
#24 - 2013-10-16 10:59:00 UTC  |  Edited by: quoOoup
It depends on you, whether to choose a Machariel or a RNI. Both have advantages and disadvantages. It depends on 'where are you going for PvE', 'will you fly active or not', etc.

The Machariel is in some cases faster, in other cases slower. If you cherrypick smart with and for the Machariel, maybe you can do some more ISK/h, but really don't start counting beans. Machariel has not the Range, and not this flexibility in the DMGtypes. At least I would say both are equal. Roll

If you have 6 million SP in Missiles just go straight for the Raven Navy Issue. It's a very comfortable ship. Learn CMs V and start your first Missions. I don't see the point, why you shouldn't spend some more skilltime to fly a very, very good ship, but spending much more time to fly a ship, that is not much better.
Ariel Dawn
State War Academy
Caldari State
#25 - 2013-10-16 14:15:09 UTC
While some things are preferential, the Machariel does have selection of damage type due to autocannons, as well as 70km range with instant damage (no travel time like missiles). RNI is a good boat, but it's quite a bit slower at least for blitzing missions.
Jonas Sotken
State War Academy
Caldari State
#26 - 2013-10-16 17:43:27 UTC
Looks like my game plan is train the few remaining skills needed for BS IV, Cruise V and then purchase the RNI. I'll probably also start bringing my alt over in a Noctis and salvage rooms as soon as I clear them to increase the ISK/hour too.

Thanks for all the advice!
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#27 - 2013-10-17 01:43:01 UTC
Jonas Sotken wrote:
I have nearly 5M SP in Missiles right now, but would need to train Cruise Missiles a bit more to probably maximize the DPS on a Raven.


I'm pretty sure you have more SP in missiles than I had sp when I started lv4s.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#28 - 2013-10-17 01:48:27 UTC
Rexxorr wrote:
When you can fit mostly T2 (tank/light drones) items on your battleship then you should be fine, Faction and meta 4 launchers will get the job done,T2 launchers are nice when you get there.

When you get a new battleship, over tank it until you get the feel for how it flys. SNI is a good starter battleship, you can fit a massive tank and it is very forgiving. Moving from drake passive tank to battleship active tank can be an issue, learn how to work the active burst tank and the isk will flow. When you feel good with the SNI just sell it (you wont lose much isk if any), and get the CNR.

Golem is your end game pve caldari battleship. Marauders are getting a massive buff next patch and they will be unequaled in pve.

GL


tbh the best buff for the golem is the 5s cycle time on target painters. Straight

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
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